To say I'm half Irish

[Winederlust]

Just wanted to settle a petty argument between DH and I.
I was born in England. As was my mum. My dad also. However both his parents were born in ROI. They moved to the UK as young adults and met, married and settled with a family in England.
I think that, although my dad was born in England, he is full blooded Irish. Which in turn makes me half Irish. My DH reckons I'm quarter at best.
Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things but just interested in the general MN population's thoughts?

Basically it all comes down to who you support in the rugby.. 🤣

Got it in one!!!

Ireland all the way!!!

@1forsorrow love that! Will add to my repertoire!

I will give everyone a history lesson if they dare to declare me British
Essentially, you’re pissy that you don’t get read as Irish, so feel the need to point out your pride and dish out history lessons.

You can’t understand why anyone would want to be British, as you’d give hell to anyone who called you that.

But the thing is, most people don’t feel the need to self flagellate, some people are proud of being British.

For most people, they are neither proud nor ashamed, they simply are

But you’ve seen that they have brown skin, so are not British in your eyes.

But they don’t feel the need to give history lessons to everyone, and it confuses you.

So you conclude they’re ashamed of where they’re from.

Mind boggling arrogance actually

If your Dad was full blooded Irish, of course your half Irish. Don’t get the quarter thing at all.
But he's actually English as he was born here?

You can call yourself whatever you like.

Doesn't stop it being cringe.

Genetically yes you’re 50% Irish but TBH I’d feel like a right knob saying it to anyone given both you and your two parents were born and raised? In England? In what context do you need to refer to your Irish heritage?

I agree with this. I'd say I was English if I were you.

"I don't understand why people are saying your dad was British because he was born in England. I was born in Germany, my parents were working over there at the time, but we moved to England when I was 5 weeks old. I'm not German."

But OP's dad was brought up in England. Totally different situation.

@ChurchOfWokeApostate
If you continue to goad me with adjectives such as ignorant or arrogant, I will report your ass. Got that?

And perhaps you could take a few on National pride
Unless the nation is Britain. Natch

The UK does not have citizenship by birth - the parent needs to either be a British citizen or have settled status at the time of birth.

I’m the exact same - 2/4 grandparents are Irish and I describe myself as half Irish. From my ancestry, I’m more Irish than English, and culturally feel the same too.

The culture for me is stronger than the blood ties.

DH was born in SA and his parents are also from there. They relocated to Australia when he was young and he has always described himself as Australian, as the family assimilated so well there.

It’s only been subsequently when we moved there to live, that he has “felt” South African, once he had experienced the culture for himself. He now describes himself as South African-Australian.

The people that are saying quarter are blowing my mind! It’s not possible to be a quarter when 2/4 grandparents are Irish.

Moving does not wipe out your heritage. You are 1/2 Irish.

If you continue to goad me with adjectives such as ignorant or arrogant, I will report your ass. Got that?
Report away. I refuse to let you get away with claiming people with brown skin are not ‘really’ British.

"@Gwenhwyfar actually my Ancestry DNA test pinpointed the exact area my Irish family are from so you’re wrong on that front I’m afraid!"

One example doesn't make it me wrong does it?
Plenty of people have done these DNA tests and come out with all sorts of origins, that may be correct of course, but go back many centuries. For example, lots of British people have Danish DNA. That could be something that goes back to Viking or Dane Law times. It doesn't make those people Danish.
It's not an exact science.

My grandparents were both half Irish and half Welsh.

So is my mum half Irish half Welsh or two quarters of each?

It's not an exact science
It’s not, because it’s only telling half your story. Every time a baby is born, half of the parents dna is ‘lost’
So you can have full siblings with different ‘percentages’ or a country come up in one siblings and not the others.
It is interesting though.

I refuse to let you get away with claiming people with brown skin are not ‘really’ British.

Jesus, you really are fucking deluded. Where - PLEASE FUCKING QUOTE ME - have I said any such thing?
One more post directed at me and I will report you for goading and trolling. I'd have done it already only it involves me scrolling and reporting which, being Irish, I'm too drunk and lazy to do.
What a nasty way to post.

I think that app nailed it- the concept of half something, quarter something etc is an attempt to put a label on a complex set of facts that combine issues of nationality, ethnicity, culture, heritage. Kids like to say things like “I’m a quarter this, a quarter that and half that” in the same way that they say their address is “10 Main Street, Preston, Lancashire, England, UK, Europe, Earth, the Universe!”

There is no legal reason for anyone ever to have set out fixed rules as to how you can describe your nationality. Claims to passports etc come with very specific rules in each country and vary widely around the world. Therefore you and your husband can chat till the cows come home about how you might describe yourself but neither of you will ever be able, definitively, to prove the other right or wrong. As this thread proves!

It’s fun to untangle though, as long as you don’t get too pedantic about it. My DH’s Dad was born and raised in The Netherlands and all antecedents Dutch as far back as can be traced. I am Scottish with all antecedents Scottish as far back as we have gone. DH’s Mum was born in England to one English and one Scottish parent. So I joke that I win because our son is “majority Scottish” but we do brag about the Dutch bit just to make ourselves sound more interesting (plus we have to explain our unusual surname) - and we gave our child a vaguely Dutch name. However DH was brought up culturally English, his Dad never spoke Dutch at home and he knows less about Dutch culture than I do.

"My DF was born in India but moved to Wales when he was 2- calls himself Welsh.
His DM was born into an Irish/mixed race family in India and lived there until she was 29- called herself Irish.
His DF was born to English/Welsh parents in Patagonia and came to Wales when he was 5- called himself Welsh."

You know he can get his own series on S4C with that right?

Whereas other nations, with the exception of the Scots and the Italians, DEMAND to be known as being British! They seem keen to utterly deny their heritage

You said the above, earlier you cited ‘Indians’ specifically.
Implying that they’re not really British, but are just not proud enough of where they are from to announce it.

"So you can have full siblings with different ‘percentages’ or a country come up in one siblings and not the others.
It is interesting though."

I hadn't thought that through properly. My uncle did a test and I presumed I would have all the various origins he had plus mine from the other side of the family.
Our family has lived in the same patch for hundreds of years, but the DNA test was still very mixed.

I'd have done it already only it involves me scrolling and reporting which, being Irish, I'm too drunk and lazy to do

Why are you bringing up offensive Irish stereotypes? Weird

ludog well that settles it then, definitely Irish...I always wondered why I can never find a hat that fits

I agree with PP that it's personal to the individual really, so it's a bit disappointing to see people being less than nice to each other about it on this thread, but that's MN for you these days I guess.

I do think it's important to recognise and embrace your cultural heritage. I know plenty of first and second generation English people who have Indian/Bangladeshi/Nigerian etc parents or grandparents. Although they would probably call themselves British first, they definitely don't hide from their heritage. I think it's good when you can embrace both. How is that any different for me? The differences between Irish and English culture may not be as marked as some, but there are definitely some.

I think the phrase 'half Irish' comes from a time when there was more emigration from Ireland to England and more anti Irish racism. Now, we are much more likely to accept people's own definition, rather than impose one on them.

My mum was Irish and my dad was of Irish heritage. I would describe myself as British. But if it comes to cultural heritage or identity then I am more Irish. I like the rugby conundrum massistar. For football and almost every sport, I support England. For rugby, it's Ireland followed by Wales!

DH was born in SA and his parents are also from there. They relocated to Australia when he was young and he has always described himself as Australian, as the family assimilated so well there.

It’s only been subsequently when we moved there to live, that he has “felt” South African, once he had experienced the culture for himself. He now describes himself as South African-Australian.

@YahBasic I’m curious. Did you move to SA because of your DH’s connection to the country, or is it just a coincidence? In that it seems odd to have made such a big move if he had previously felt no cultural connection.

Its interesting how family members identify according to their heritage. According to my DNA im mostly irish scottish ( there is no distinction) even though ive lived in england most of my life, yet have only very little english ancestry ( and no idea who its even from) I identify quite a lot with my maltese side from one of my grandparents and feel a real homecoming when I go there. Ive never even been to Ireland, but am applying for my irish citizenship anyway, which will make me irish.

As for whether im half or quarter this or that, I dont know what it even means in real terms