To think most property owners don’t understand how hard it now is to buy a house

[Boredfromboredshire]

DP and me earn 40k between us and our rent is 1200 a month for a 3 bed house. We don’t have rich relatives, we are in our early 40’s and circumstances (ill health) meant that we didn’t buy a house before. We can’t save a deposit & houses are expensive by us. We have stable jobs & our kids are happy so moving in the current uncertain time’s isn’t an option. Life has happened to us & some of it has been out it control.

Cue well meaning friend (who bought their house for peanuts) asking me why we couldn’t afford a house when we could get a house in a cheaper area for ‘only’ 400k. I’m so fed up of it. We really want a home of our own & we would move but in the current recession, it’s not a good idea to give up a job. And we can’t afford to save. My friend (whose deposit was 12k can’t understand it and looks on pityingly while telling me the house they bought for 120k is now worth 700k.

For many of us, the housing market is closed for ever. I’m so tired of the pity and the complete cluelessness- I quite often feel utter despair about it. It makes me feel such a failure for no real fault of our own. Some people were lucky because they happened to buy at a particular month in time & then some of us couldn’t & it’s over.

I don’t think people who own really understand what it’s like. Low interest rates, cheap mortgages, everything weighted in favour of owners while renters are treated like the Victorian poor.

Aibu to be sick of it. We are a normal family in normal jobs.

Ps bought a house. Usual long slog of saving for a deposit. No help etc. It was probably only marginally easier five years ago.

I've got this couple of friends who have recently bought their first home. She keeps telling anyone who would question how they managed to save for a deposit that its because they bring their lunches from home, and turn off the lights in the rooms. The real reason though is due to the fact that they both for for TFL in London, and this way they have free travel, which saves them at least 500 quid a month. But they don't like to talk about it :)

We bought our first house together in 1991 and are still living in it. We own it outright now. It was always going to be our forever home.

Here's a thought.

If people lived with their parents until they got married…

it might mean…

people sacrifice the 'city break' years
weddings become simple and less expensive
couples are more likely to have two incomes until the children come along…
Couple start with tiny properties as they don't need to factor in accommodating children

I'm not saying I would want to do it but it's just a suggestion...

I have so much sympathy for people who haven't been lucky enough to buy. I have to admit, when I was in my early twenties I specifically dated men who had 'good' jobs who were a few years older than me. We managed to buy in London when I was 27 and (now) DH was 32. We have been lucky to not suffer ill health or other setbacks.
I see friends who have made different life choices who now pay rent double to what our mortgage payments are (in nicer areas, but still) and I understand the security being home owners gives us, and I am so grateful for it.
We will be looking to make the next step on the ladder in a few years and I'm shocked at the prices we are looking at paying, and that will be with a significant deposit. How the fuck those prices (for a basic family home) are within the reach of normal people is beyond me.

The older you get and when there are children too, it’s harder to make changes that might allow you to buy. Some people decide it’s too hard and so continue to rent.

• is it too hard to move to another area or just that you’d rather not?
• is it impossible for one of you to take an extra job or would you just rather not?
• is it impossible to live in a smaller, cheaper property or just that you’d rather not.

Every year, people with kids make big, difficult changes and start totally new lives where they don’t know anyone, and start new jobs they didn’t really want to take, so they can live more cheaply, save for a while and then buy in the cheaper area. They do it because otherwise they will be renting in expensive areas forever. It is possible because they decide to do whatever it takes.

I get that some people are stymied by the lack of deposit and others have the deposit but don’t have the income for a big enough mortgage, even though they pay more in rent every month than the mortgage will be......but that is in certain places where prices are high.

If you are a low or lowish earner, then it isn’t the case that you have to be in London or any other expensive city like Oxford, because you can earn a similar amount somewhere cheap to live. If you have obstacles that mean you have to stay in one place, then the reality is that you can’t afford to buy there, not that you can’t afford it anywhere. It’s a different thing.

Op did you say how much you’ve saved? You said it’s hard to save, but what have you managed? In any area you will need a deposit - and that’s right that banks don’t lend 100% and some effort of accumulating some deposit is needed. Even where you live now, even if purchasing isn’t imminent you need to be saving now and making changes so you can do that - so def look at a few hours of extra work for one of you. You can fit it in if you try and really want to. Save every penny from those extra hours. Start looking for new jobs in a new area in 6 months to a year. Rent a cheaper property and get the 2nd job again. Save the savings from rent and extra job. Within a couple of years you will have a deposit suitable for a small property in a cheap area. Mission achieved.

It won’t happen fast. It won’t happen without sacrifices. It won’t happen without significant changes. But it’s not true it’s impossible if you are prepared to move.

If you won’t make significant changes, you probably won’t ever buy. That has been the same for lots of people and some are now homeowners because of choices they made and others made different choices and still rent.

I get it OP. I'm mid 30s and got into a position to buy a house literally 3 months ago. A few weeks ago our mortgage offer was rescinded and we have now been offered a 70% mortgage.

I was telling a friend who sounded very confused about why this mattered and just said "it's only a grand or 2 more don't worry."

Going from a 10% to a 30% deposit means needing to save at least £30k on top of the deposit we have now. Friend who said it has no clue - was given a mortgage free house as a wedding present and lived in a house belonging to her parents before that - rent free.

It is very frustrating when people don't understand but I now just ignore - if they can't be arsed to think about what they're saying, I can't be arsed to explain it to them. Stick to people who do understand (renters and owners alike). It's much easier.

I feel your pain op. We managed to get on the ladder recently, early 20's. DH earns more than your combined salary but it was still a struggle. Lots of older couples around here in their 800k properties not understanding the struggle even though some admit that they could not afford their own home if they had to buy it today. Even though we're on the ladder now we do wonder if we'll ever be able to climb high to a 'forever home'.
Renting does trap you as it's very difficult to save the large deposit required while paying off someone else's mortgage and then some - even if you do take up 5 jobs and stop eating avocados.

She bought a flat in London (zone 2/3) for £45k in the late ‘90s, sold it within three years for treble what she paid. For a lot of people it is just luck and circumstances.

And hers was the only property to increase in value? Everything else would have gone up a similar amount by the time she sold the flat.

I agree with pp, life isn't always greener. At least you can move easily if you need bigger or different area.

We got stuck in our old house. Bought cheap but house prices rocketed so we remortgaged (to do house improvements) then two years later we hit a recession. House for many years was worth much less than mortgage. We out grew the house long before we could move and only managed to move because we part exchanged for a new build. They paid us £14,000 more than they sold it on for. We could never had afforded to move and sell that low.

In the mean time friends and family who rent were able to move easily when their family out grew their home.

We do need to sort out house prices though. We are in the north east. A friend living down south is buying a three bed flat with no garden for just £10,000 less than we paid for our 3 story three bed house, garden and garage. We are similar age (early 40's) and this will be the first home she has owned.

I think the older generation don't get how hard it is but most if us must know. We bought at the right time (2003) and if we hadn't would have found it very hard to get on the property ladder.

I totally get it. The hopelessness is horrible. The permanent anxiety, knowing you can't do what you want in your home, that you could loose you home on someone else's whim. It honestly has been a major factor in my mental health.

We've made the decision to leave our family and friends and move up north to a tiny, poor town. We got an inheritance, but down south the near 100k amount didn't even get us a deposit. Despite both working, with decent wages, no child care costs, minimal travel costs. It's just ridiculous isn't it? In what world is 100k mot enough for a desposit for two full time workers?!

Oxford is very expensive, without the wages to support extortionate rents.

If you want to buy a house you will either need to earn a lot more or move to another city. If your DH works at the university he must be able to get a job at a university in a cheaper city? I appreciate this isn't what you want, you want to stay in Oxford but you can't afford to do that if you want to buy a house.

Unfortunately you don't earn the money to support the lifestyle you want to have in the city you want to live in. It's tough and made tougher because rents are so extortionate compared to a mortgage. I do have sympathy for you.

@catsjammies did you mean to sound so smug ?

It doesn’t help Op, but some principles for younger people which can help;

• live at home when first working if poss and save hard
• look to buy before having children - can buy small to start you off plus no childcare bills and more flexible working
• look to buy as part of couple of with a friend as 2 incomes make massive difference
• be financially wise. Boring choices like limiting holidays and purchases do mount up to thousands in savings each year
• if you reach 30 and can’t afford to buyin a couple or with friend, seriously consider moving to cheaper area even if you have to change career

The way people used to live, in terms of living at home until getting married and several years later having children, would work well for today still. But people don’t marry at 21 these days and don’t want to wait for independent living.

OP, we're in the same boat. We both work, have kids and live in a lovely 3 bed social housing home. Our annual income is less than yours OP and we are of similar age. We have missed out on owning our own home.
Thats ok, I'm grateful for all I have. But I do get similar head tilts and 'why don't you buy a new home-you get government help now'.
DH's parents offered us a deposit, even with that, wheres the other £120k coming from? And yes, we looked at 2 bed houses (too small) and no, we are not able to get evening jobs as we have kids and you know, lives. I've had two jobs before-the tax is ridiculous.

Its ok, we're grateful to have a roof over our head at all. The only chance we have is inheriting enough to buy something small. If that happens, so be it.

I think YABU to say all homeowners as it’s been hard to buy a home for ages so plenty of people will have struggled. We bought our first home last year so I know exactly how tough it is to get on the housing ladder.
However I would never say to someone “why don’t you just do xyz and then you’ll be able to buy a house!”

@Wheninrometoday oh my, maybe because her kids are in the school in the area maybe because its not that easy to uproot the whole family and get a job in their field easily. You don't know her situation so don't sound so smug just because you own a house you unhelpful bastard

Of course @ChicCroissant but £45k (I think it was that, long time ago, either that or £50k) would have been so much more affordable for me and (then-P) on our low salaries. By the time we were thinking of buying, property had increased but our salaries hadn’t.

A two bed terrace in our home town was by then more expensive than her first flat, over a total period of 4 years or so. Our employer at the time had a clause that you weren’t allowed to work for anyone else, unless it was as a volunteer. Had we been able to be looking just a few years earlier it would have been much easier and affordable.

Um, how about not having kids, cars, meals out, takeaways, gym membership and holidays until you buy your house?

To anyone posting 'it was hard for us too back in the day' ... the only question is: does that house you bought now cost more?

Because if it does, WHATEVER SACRIFICES YOU MADE, BUYERS TODAY HAVE TO MAKE GREATER SACRIFICES THAN YOU DID.

FFS. It's really not that difficult a concept to grasp.

It's not about different lifestyle choices. It's not about iPhones and avocados. Obviously, saving more is better than saving less. The fact anyone thinks it necessary to explain that to the OP and then complains about eye rolls... that says much more about the 'helpful' explainers that it does about the OP.

I worked hard to save a deposit to buy a flat in 2010. To buy that flat today would cost twice what I paid for it. So I would have had to work twice as hard. Given up twice the number of avocados. Missed out on twice the number of holidays. Moved to a much worse neighbourhood. Put off having kids for twice as long.

I'm sorry to get shouty but ... good grief. Show some humility and appreciation of your good fortune.

Most workers could afford property if they lived in a place where their income fitted with house prices.

The reality is lots of people want to live in places which are too expensive for them to do so as homeowners. So I’m simple terms they must choose to rent or move to somewhere they can afford it.

Even low paid workers on couples can afford to buy something if they save for a couple of years and live in the right place. It’s all about compromise and knowing we can only have what we can afford and aren’t entitled to buy in expensive areas but probably could if we lived somewhere else.

@wheninrometoday How is it possible on a salary of £22k to buy a house independently?

I purchased my house 10 years later than I should have done by waiting and enjoying cheap living and not wanting commitment. I paid the price buying the house.

I was 'lucky' to get one of the last 100% mortgages and buying a house that needed a lot of work doing to it to add value

There is absolutely no way I could afford to rent my own house. There is also no way, paying rent in my area, I could ever afford to save for a deposit