To wonder if I'm making a boy who will be an arsehole?

[Eggybreadleg]

I'm so upset and absolutely raging at DS. Earlier in the year he told a classmate he was brown like poo and his we, his teacher and the head made a big deal out telling him this wasn't ok. We went over racism etc and he was sanctioned at school as well as punished at home. We made him write the other boy a letter of apology and I really thought he got it. Now today I got called by school to tell me he'd done it again! For reference DS does have high functioning autism. I feel like ripping all his lego out of his room and putting in the bin. I'm worried I'm going to unleash an arsehole on the world. Why doesn't he get this is such a big deal?

I would get this post moved to the sen page, you will receive more constructive advice - I feel for you xx

Agree with both the above posters. I think on AIBU you might get some aggressive “well he must’ve learned it from you” type posts, whereas in SN you’ll hopefully find more experience and wisdom.

Also agree on education. I try and talk often with DS (9, HF ASD) about racism in its historical context and why insulting someone based in their skin colour is not the same as any other insult based on appearance (which is also unacceptable, but wouldn’t have the same consequences). I’m also matter-of-fact about it being a hate crime and something that can earn a criminal conviction for adults.

I can understand how mortifying this is for you OP, but try and keep a cool head.

Put him with my just turned 9 hfa. He loves to throw out a racial slur, swear word etc when he has exploded. He knows it's wrong and does it for effect. I ignore him and stick him in his room. When he is calm we have the same chat AGAIN about racism and being unkind. He bloody knows but likes to use words that will get the most outrage

Also a consequence which he has been pre warned about well. So for any racial comments he loses beloved ipad for a week and tv massively limited. Swearing depending on the level same sort of consequences.

Try to keep in mind he probably emotional maturity of a 4/5 year old

I'm just shocked it's happening again. I really thought he got it last time. He does have friends who are BAME and always has. Of course I have never described any of the children in his class as thick! My point was he is academically able enough to understand. I'm upset. This is mortifying. My son has done this twice to different children. The school have said if it happens again he will be suspended.

The idea that maybe he was after the attention is interesting and I hadn't thought of it. DH and I are both absolutely stressed at work and the kids haven't had that much of us.

He does try the emotional manipulation angle with his siblings if he gets in a fight with them. "You aren't my best friend." Etc. His routine is completely out the window and the supervision at school has been really lax. They are using gap year students who were no where to be seen when I pulled up yesterday. They literally weren't even in shouting distance. How do I get this moved to SEN?

He's never sworn. So at least we have that going for us, I guess. I'm not actually sure he knows swear words. In some way sanctioning it makes it seem less important than it is? He hasn't been naughty. It's much bigger than that but how exactly impress that upon him I'm not sure.

I'm not sure why people think I'm a racist? Why on earth would I be here trying to fix this if I was?

The school have said if it happens again he will be suspended

He is 8, autistic and they're the ones with the professional training and professional contacts. What strategies are they employing to make sure it does not happen again? Agree you need considered an constructive advice on the SEN boards.

and

OP - where is he getting the brown skinned = not nice?

My son - also HFA - has heard some racist stuff (more subtle) at school and asked me about it, namely, ‘Sarah can’t be my girlfriend anymore because you can’t go out with people with different coloured skin’

We talked about our family with is very mixed ethnically and therefore obviously it’s allowed. I try to stay as factual as possible.

Sorry OP, maybe I’m being pessimistic. But I’ve seen threads like this before in here where a poster has clearly felt desperate about their child’s racist comment or insult, and there’s usually someone who likes to stick the boot in and imply that the poster themself must be racist. Hopefully they’re all busy tonight...

I understand how you feel, but in reality is this is not quite the same. It was a statement as he saw it. Suppose he had retaliated by saying because you have curly hair would you have reacted the same?

Firstly, there is no such thing as 'high functioning'... he is every bit as autistic as the next person on the spectrum... what it means is he is better at masking it, can expend more energy to do so.

But his brain is still an autistic brain, it processes information differently.

When he hit on 'you are brown like poo' his point of reference was 'poo is yucky, poo is brown, you are brown ergo you are yucky'... No real difference than calling any other kid a poopoo head or a poo or a big smelly poo face... etc.

And then YOU (parents, teachers) told him that actually referencing brown as a bad thing was FAR more powerful than simply calling someone a poo head.

Instead of learning that thats an awful thing to do because of all of the complex reasons racism is awful, which he can't comprehend really even if he wasn't autistic... what HE learned was 'this is a REALLY powerful way to hurt someone and cause a huge fuss when I am very very angry'.

You effectively gave him that tool, because you don't really understand how the autistic brain works.

He doesn't yet (and most kids at that age don't really, they mimic it for the sake of those pushing for it) have a fully developed sense of empathy, and being autistic means he may never really grasp how other people feel.

So you have to find another way around it, that he can understand and do, even if he doesn't feel it.

A big start will be understanding why high functioning is a bad concept as far as autism goes - I suspect it is causing you to expect him to be capable of more than he really is at times.

Wow, so you’re 8 year old autistic son is an ‘arsehole’ you’re going to unleash on the world but at least he’s not ‘thick’?

Clearly as a child with autism he doesn’t understand the concept of racism in the same way an adult without autism would.

I’m more shocked by your attitude than his.

@WiddlinDiddlin So how would you approach it with him. It's all fine to say here's where you've gone wrong but what I need is ideas on to approach it with him. He got the idea of racism ironically from school. I don't think he'd ever really clocked the whole skin colour thing because people are trees to him really. It happened the first time the day after that lesson.

And he didn't make a factual statement. He told someone they're an idiot because they are brown. The first time was factual in that brown is the colour of poo.

Do people really not worry about what kind of adult their kids will be? I feel a huge sense of responsibility that I don't unleash someone especially a white man into the world who acts like an arse.

Clearly your son needs support at school
He has a diagnosis of autism ,so you could apply for an ehcp.
That would give him the support he needs .its not just for academic reasons .
My eldest and youngest both have autism.
My advice is to not draw attention to it .in your eyes it’s racism ,in his eyes ,he’s got no idea of what racism is .in my experience the more I go on about something the more they do it .
The school should be offering you support,not threatening him with suspension.

Obviously ,I’m not agreeing it’s ok ,what he said,.but he needs to not say it again..so I find to not pay bad behaviour attention works ( sometimes).

Do people really not worry about what kind of adult their kids will be? I feel a huge sense of responsibility that I don't unleash someone especially a white man into the world who acts like an arse.

I do. I understand OP. Raising a boy feels like a significant responsibility; especially one with a neuro-developmental condition that means he may struggle with the nuances of social communication and boundaries.

Also in the borough where we live, EHCPs for children who are academically able are rarer than unicorn shit. Unfortunately for my DS.

Off topic I know, but I have a five year old. She has never once mentioned the colour of someone’s skin to us eg asked why someone is brown or made any comment in relation to it. It’s not something that has ever come up at home either (because why would it).

Are we supposed to explain to them in advance that they must never comment in the colour of someone’s skin? Or do we wait until the issue comes up? I mean I can’t see why she would but you never know what goes on in kids’ heads and what if she one day just blurts something out without having any idea of the implications?

I will educate her of course but I don’t know how to even approach it without simply planting the idea that people are/were singled out because of the colour of their skin.

🤷🏻‍♀️

@Eggybreadleg If he does it when he's wound up, would anger management classes help?
What strategies can the school use to help him manage his anger before it gets out of control?

@welcometothenorth my parenting experience has been have the chat. My son once made comments about skin colour and really hurt some good friends in a childish row. I wish I’d spoken to him so he understood the hurt words can have.
As their mum said, her kids don’t have the privilege of pretending racism doesn’t exist. They have been confronted by it many times. It really woke me up to reality. Talk in an age appropriate way from a young age.
My son was devastated when it sunk in how his comment about how ‘no brown faces In our team’ had made his two closest friends feel. He was having a stupid row over team
Choosing, clothing, skills and other appearances had been mentioned already and he jumped in with that. Changed a silly row into way more, because then it was picked up by others on the edge of the group who did understand more. It was a shit show of mending friendships after for them. The boys had a horrible experience of a group excluding them for being ‘brown’. They felt no better just because my son didn’t understand racism. For a long time. And I nearly lost a good friend too.

ofti thank you for sharing your story. That’s certainly given me food for thought. I think I will have the chat. I’ll have a think about how we might approach it. Thank you.

Also, what about the other child who wound him up. He must've known the result. That wasn't kind

@WelcomeToTheNorth there’s a chapter in the book Nurture Shock that you might find interesting, called “Why White Parents Don’t Talk About Race”. The authors are American, so it’s US-centric, but it’s useful in dispelling the idea that children don’t notice race and explaining how taking a proactive approach to discussing it can be helpful.