To worry about the psychological impact of covid guilt

[SquashedSpring]

I think people should be sticking to the rules and trying their utmost not to spread covid, but I'm really concerned by the way individuals are being told that if they do slip up, or make a decision that may or may not be within the guidance, that they are responsible for countless deaths. Tellingly, I feel the need to add that I haven't come close to breaking any rules or slipping up, so this isn't about me.

My beloved Grandmother died of norovirus, which she obviously caught from someone, but although it is frowned upon to send children back into school or to return to work while potentially still infectious, I've never heard anyone being accused of killing people for doing so.

Same with flu, tens of thousands of people die every year from it, but I have never heard it said that those deaths are the fault of whoever infected them.

I undestand that social pressure/shaming/guilt is used to ensure that individuals act for the greater good, but I am becoming really concerned about the effects of guilt on both the short and long term mental health of everyone right now. AIBU?

I don't see anyone who is breaking the rules being in the least concerned that they might infect someone. I also don't see loads of the media, or in Government saying people are 'responsible' for deaths if they break the rules!

I'm really concerned by the way individuals are being told that if they do slip up, or make a decision that may or may not be within the guidance, that they are responsible for countless deaths.

Where have you seen this statement? I have not seen anything like it from any responsible source and, anyway, I suspect those who do "break the rules" would not suffer in any way from "guilt". I think you are worrying about a non-existent issue.

I see it 10 times a day on MN. Hang out on AIBU and you'll see it too

I've seen the same comments about children recovering from the norovirus, chicken pox or whatever else being sent back to school while still potentially contentious, and unwell adults going back to work prematurely.

I don't think these comments are anything new. They're probably more frequent at the moment because Covid has been the major news story for months and there are clear rules in place.

YABU imo.

Yes it’s a problem

It’s been the intention of the “anyone can catch it, anyone can spread it” campaign, to guilt people into staying home.

Whether or not it’s working in the real world, I don’t know

If I got it now, I’d assume it was from the supermarket

I’m guessing the biggest problem will be children getting a message they might spread it. Three weeks later, grandma dies and they’ll think it’s their fault.

I can't see how anyone would feel guilty about spreading an illness that they may or may not have.

Doesn't bother me. On the flip side, I think I was ill with covid obviously having contracted it from someone. No, I have not even thought of finding out who spread it to me (or my dh).

I am becoming really concerned about the effects of guilt on both the short and long term mental health of everyone right now. AIBU?

YANBU

I don't see anyone who is breaking the rules being in the least concerned that they might infect someone.

Really? So you've interviewed them?

I also don't see loads of the media, or in Government saying people are 'responsible' for deaths if they break the rules!

???

I undestand that social pressure/shaming/guilt is used to ensure that individuals act for the greater good, but I am becoming really concerned about the effects of guilt on both the short and long term mental health of everyone right now. AIBU?

I don't in "real life" see any shaming or pressure going on, people are just living their lives in their own way. I have no clue what anyone around here is doing/have done, whether they have broken the "rules" (god it winds me up when I read this, sounds like school!!).

All of this madness that you see on here where people are branded murderers, accused of spreading the virus (do they even have it?) to me is one of two things, it's done for dramatic effect just to post a comment and they don't behave like that in reality, or they really are unhinged.

I won't be pressured or shamed by anyone. What I do in my day to day life is nobody's business apart from my own and my immediate family's.

Yes you only see it on MN though.

Those posts lack logic, as obviously if elderly and vulnerable want to reduce their risk they just need to follow the rules themselves and stay home.

It might help if the Govt openly said they weren't aiming to eradicate it. Or indeed, if they are attempting to eradicate it, say that!

At the moment we just have a lot of arbitrary nonsensical rules and a lot of speculation and frothing. It's not helping.

On the contrary, I would like to see the guilt more equally shared.

If old ladies on oxygen are murdering nurses and their children, I want lockdown enthusiasts to accept the blame for the children being abused and murdered due to the current lack of safeguarding.

Those posts about people who aren't following rules, well thank you very much, I've got another 3 weeks of not seeing my mum because of you, you should be refused NHS treatment if you can't follow their guidelines! I can't believe some people haven't seen that anyway, you must have very sensible people on your Facebook 😁

I actually think we need those people to be not following rules. Unless a vaccination is created, the only way out of this is here immunity- it's not going to be eradicated. Therefore, we need people to be infected at a rate where the NHS can handle the fall out. Currently it can, so we can relax a bit more, and get another slight wave, then restrict as it climbs up again.

Should probably add, I am following the rules, blah de blah.

I agree with you. I’ve certainly seen / heard plenty of this type of language, although much more online than in real life. I’m also not sure it s reserved for out and out ‘rule defiers’; it’s sometimes used to address genuine uncertainty. I also wince whenever I see people/groups labelled as ‘idiots’, ‘stupid’, ‘morons’ etc. Of course anger and frustration can be justified, but it just feels sometimes as though there’s an unpleasant eagerness about the attacks on our fellow humans.

I agree OP

“ I’m also not sure it s reserved for out and out ‘rule defiers’; it’s sometimes used to address genuine uncertainty.”

It’s true - there is a certain group (on here particularly) that seems to see even asking questions as a sign of deep immorality - eg someone thinking about whether to send a child back to school, by even considering it they are selfish and a would-be murderer. Regardless of the actual laws and guidelines, for some people anything deemed “inessential” (by their own judgement) is immoral - so there is absolutely no justification at all in their eyes for someone to sit on a park bench despite it being lawful and low risk in terms of the virus. It’s really really disturbing

OP no one says it to someone who 'slipped up' but to people who say "I have rights. I can go where I like and you can't stop me'

Did you do that on another thread and get criticised?

LastTrainEast From the OP

“ Tellingly, I feel the need to add that I haven't come close to breaking any rules or slipping up, so this isn't about me.”

Does that help?

Well if you follow the rules and unwittingly pass it to someone, then your conscience is clear.

If you don't follow the rules, and pass it to someone you can't really claim it was done unwittingly can you?

If that causes some guilt, we'll then presumably it's something you consider before making your choices.

Personally, the people I know in rl who are not following the rules, are either adamant that they haven't got it, or adamant that they've already had it, and that they're no threat to anyone. Even the person who had a party at her house and works at a care home that has subsequently had two covid deaths - has just managed to convince herself that it couldn't possibly have been her.

So I don't think I'm particularly sympathetic to any guilt. You make a choice when you break the rules, and must live with any consequences imo. Otherwise you're like a little kid saying 'I take it back' when it goes wrong.

"Same with flu, tens of thousands of people die every year from it, but I have never heard it said that those deaths are the fault of whoever infected them."

If you've got flu, you aren't walking about giving it to anyone. Presumably you infect others before symptoms appear.

If you read the OP, it’s the attempt to make people feel guilty which seems to be troubling her (and which I agree with). So it’s really interesting that some people have misinterpreted this and are keen to enforce the “is your conscience clear” message

As per the OP, I feel I have to say that I haven’t broken any rules either - which goes to prove the point in some ways

I guy in the next little village to me killed himself because he had convinced himself he was "patient zero" in our town. So yes, I agree. It's only like catching a cold. Only so much you can do to stop it. One contaminated door handle and touch of your nose.

I completely agree OP, and I think your point about other virus’s is really relevant

Viruses*

I think everyone has to be aware of the potential to spread it. Everyone needs to take responsibility by keeping their distance, covering mouths, washing hands.
My ignorant old skool DF obviously passed it to my DM as she was shielding, he was going to the local shop, despite us delivering food and organising a newspaper delivery.
DM died, he is fine, did he spread it = Yes. Is he responsible for killing her = Yes. Will he be left with Covid guilt? Yes so he should. If he had of stuck to the guideline and stayed in or at least washed his hands instead of acting the tough guy.