To not continue to buy my exH's family presents?

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

ExH and I have been split up for nearly a year. We’re leading separate lives in separate cities whilst trying to co-parent our 7yo and 3yo.

When we were together I did ALL the “life admin”, even in regard to his family - bought all presents, RSVPd to weddings and organised hotels, outfits etc, sorted us going to family parties, everything. I did it begrudgingly because I always loved (most of) his family and otherwise nothing would get done.

The kids came back from a week at his on Sunday, the same day as their cousin’s (exSIL’s son) 7th birthday. I commented on her Facebook post saying happy birthday Harry, but I didn’t check if the kids had spoken to him as, by then time they got home at 5.30pm, it had gone from my mind. May or may not be relevant - “Harry” is very spoilt and indulged, to a ridiculous degree, Ex and I used to refer to him between ourselves as Little Lord Fauntleroy. There would be an expectation from everyone to make a big deal about his birthday.

Yesterday I got a text from exSIL saying that Harry is very upset as he feels his cousins forgot his birthday - they didn’t get a call, a card or a present, and she “expected better of me” . She knows they came home in the evening and Harry was expecting a call when they got back. Now since Ex and I split up, I’ve maintained a good relationship with his family - mainly because I always got on with them, especially his mum and dad, and there really was no need for any animosity. But his siblings were always hard work and I wasn’t sorry to see the back of them. So I simply replied “speak to your brother” and thanked my lucky stars I didn’t have to please her any more.

Anyway today I got a text fro exMIL - who BTW I adore and she’s been amazingly supportive since the split. She said exSIL is obviously upset because Harry’s birthday was a bit naff in isolation and that was compounded by no contact from his favourite cousins - which she acknowledges is exH’s fault entirely. However she’s basically gone on to ask if I could carry on getting presents for their family members - on behalf on the DC and/or me rather than from ex - as she feels that otherwise there’s gonna be no presents at all and a lot of upset.

My first thought was “no fucking way”. Aside from the fact that I don’t want to continue to facilitate exH’s goal of being the biggest manchild in existence, I’m a single mum now and this could cost a fortune! His family is huge and even if I spent just £10 each on cousins, aunties, uncles and grandparents, for Xmas and birthdays that would be £400 a year!

However, she’s right about one thing - if I said no, there’d be no presents for them ever again. ExH has the unfortunate affliction of being lazy, selfish and tight fisted all at the same time. He’s not hapless or forgetful - but buying presents means taking more than 4 seconds to do something for someone else, whilst parting with his money, and he won’t do it. And he wouldn’t be ashamed about it either (you can see why he’s an Ex). His mum and dad especially deserve better than that. I’m not exaggerating when I say I’ll be amazed if DD gets anything from him for her birthday in a couple of weeks. So if I do say no, then my in laws will get nothing and my DC will be in the horrible position of being the only grandkids not to buy granny, grandad etc presents at Christmas - something they scarcely notice now but will do before long.

Good people of MN - what should I do?!

I'm a bit torn on this one lock down birthdays are a bit shit I would have sent him a gift off the kids on this occasion maybe something for grandparents on their birthday but nothing expensive

i agree there is a sexism to all this that will set a ridiculous example for your children.

If you want to send a gift to your lovely ex in laws you should do it because you want To, not because it is demanded by them. They don’t seem to understand the basic principles of gift giving. MIT comes across as grabby and selfish.

You have the opportunity to road your children property. Teaching them that women aren’t responsible for doing all the chores and keeping everyone happy. Clearly your ex’s parents didn’t teach your ex basic manners and life skills. Why should you continue to pay for their crap parenting.

I would ensure that every Christmas from now on your DC choose a nice calendar for your ex, and in it they can write every relative's birthday (including yours) so he can open it (& in front of inlaws & his side of family hopefully, so they know he knows ) and see he now has NO excuse to forget any birthday.

Nope nope nope. By all means help your DC keep in touch with their cousins but buying presents - or at the barest minimum funding the presents for your DC to choose - is on your Ex. Don’t do it.

Do you know if they contacted him @GlummyMcGlummerson to ask the same? Especially his own sister!

Do they buy gifts for your children, Op?

You were right in your initial behaviour.

It isn't sustainable and dropping it now will be easier than in year's time or so. Your exMIL is really not your exMIL, that term really is made up, she is one of your DC's GP. As such the GP have responsibility as the adults of a useless son to not only buy their gifts for other family members on that side but also for each other: she buys for Grandad from them and Grandad buys for her from them. You are not part of this now and have to step back and let them work this out.

Fuck that - why should you take on this work, even if your ex gives you the money? It takes time and effort to buy presents and facilitate relationships, and that's your ex's job, not yours.

Your XPIL have brought up a lazy, selfish tosser. They are beyond cheeky to expect you to cover for him. They've created a crap person and if they want to carry on enabling him then they can do it themselves. Why should you clean up their mess?

Sorry your ExH is such a tight arse OP, what a nightmare!

@lyralalala thank you, it's so hard isn't is! DD asked me just before lockdown "how come daddy doesn't ever take us anywhere? We never go to the park or soft play we just stay in the house and when we ask he says no?". What I wanted to say, and what the the truth is, is "Well daddy is selfish and he won't sit in soft plays because it costs money and inconveniences him ever so slightly, and he will never ever put your happiness before his convenience, that's why darling". But I said some bollocks about how daddy wants to spend as much time with them as he can and not just watch them at soft play. Grrrr why can men get away with being such shit dads and there always a sea of people (me included) lining up to try and cover up for them/patch up the cracks/say they're brilliant anyway/gaslight the kids into thinking they're not just not-shit dads but fantastic dads.

Meanwhile my parenting is scrutinised to within an inch of its life and because I'm 2 parents 12 nights out of 14, I get the flack from the kids over everything, trying to spin 50 plates at once and keep everyone happy and they still moan at me - but he puts in minimal effort, shows up every other Saturday and it's like they've met God himself they way they greet him, while all my plate spinning and efforts to keep them happy - the trips out, the things I plan, the meals, rewards, treats, homework, games I invent, staying up until 2am to build a fucking Wendy house - goes unnoticed.

Reverting back to my teenage self here - it's not fair 😫

No way when I got divorced I was really pleased I didn’t have to do ex’s family present shopping. Needless to say they got nothing! No longer my problem. It was ex mil’s fault for bringing up a selfish lazy man. So she needed to pick up the pieces. She ended up doing it all for him which is what caused him to be so lazy in the first place.

Maybe help DC to make a card for grandparents, but I wouldn't be buying ex-inlaws presents. As you say, you're a single mum now and money can get tight. Your ex-SIL should be understanding of your situation. Her issue is with her brother, not you.

And little did I know I also had to keep Little Lord Fauntleroy happy too. Whilst exH sits in house probably playing XBox without a care in the world, being a non-present buying prick and getting away with it

Fuck the patriarchy

Wow not cool. For me personally I’d be happy to send cards for the kids but that’s it.

Would let kids give grandparents a little gift, birthday and xmas because he will not. The other family you need to say no. You cannot afford it.

Next time your DC ask a question like that I would reply "why do you think?"

Encourage your DC to practice critical thinking...

It's not good to cover up with lies, better to say "I don't really know, why do you think?"

Sorry but no more flannel to the kids. When they ask the "why does daddy?" questions you simply say "what/why do you think he does that?"

Do not pretend to them he is better than he is. Do not lie to your kids. You are not protecting them. You are just setting them up for a bigger fall later.

@CrazyTimesAreOccurring I'm not sure if they contacted him, I suspect not as he would honestly tell them to fuck off. When we first met he was honest and blunt in a non-offensive way but over the years as he's flirted with middle-age that's just turned into complete rudeness. And they're all a bunch of Pansy arses, no one will ever say to him "don't speak to me like that" 🙄

@RandomMess I know I totally agree I was really caught on the hop with that one from DD! But I suppose it's still so new and I'm trying to navigate co-parenting - but after I gave her a bullshit answer i promised myself no more bullshit answers. I'm sure if I did carry on with the BS she'd realise one day what he's really like - but honestly I'd live with it if she realises now what's shit dad he is. I need to get into the mindset that, if the kids do realise he's a waste of space, it's because he's failed to be a good father, not because I've failed to protect them or "poisoned them against him" (which I'm sure I'll be accused of at some point).

If you like his family Send a homemade card from the kids and yourself. Not your ex. Don’t bother with gifts (apart from in-laws) and explain you can’t afford them.

Don’t gaslight them, don’t make excuses for him, just say you don’t why daddy doesn’t do XYZ. It took me a long time to realise that I wasn’t doing my kids any favours by teaching them not to trust their instincts about their dad.

I think that it would be wrong if you were signing the cards from you, kids and exH. But if they are gifts from you & the dc to people you like and still in your life, that's ok. Your choice. But only do it for the people you care about yourself.

while all my plate spinning and efforts to keep them happy - the trips out, the things I plan, the meals, rewards, treats, homework, games I invent, staying up until 2am to build a fucking Wendy house - goes unnoticed.

This stuck out to me, OP, and I just want to say: they do notice. Certainly not audibly, and maybe not even consciously, but they do notice. Your ex sounds like a selfish fuck, and it's cold comfort in the face of that, but still, they notice and it really, really matters.

@GlummyMcGlummerson I know exactly what you mean.

One of the hardest habits to break for me was stopping making things sound better for the kids' sake. I had abusive parents so I was desparate for my girls to have good parents. Randomly at a school thing I overhead another parent say "Oh no, I never lie for him. The younger kids know things the less of a bombshell it is to their lives" about her ex not attending school plays and I realised she was right.

"I don't know, you can ask him the next time you see him" or "I don't know, why do you think he does/says that?" became my stock answers to the why questions.

I also spent a lot of time saying things like "I don't know darling, I love it when we go to the park. Remember when we saw the butterfly/bumped into Molly/got soaked to the skin by the rain" because it wasn't anything like a criticism of him, but it reinforced that I love spending time with them and that will always happen as well as helped them not dwell on their sadness.

I also didn't shield his family from any of his bullshit. They know when he didn't show up, they know when he randomly didn't pay and, most importantly, they knew when he opted not to take them to family events (he went to two weddings and stated I wouldn't allow the girls to go). It meant they always felt comfortable enough with me to ask directly if the girls could attend a birthday party or wedding with them because they knew he wouldn't make the effort.

"DC's DGM, I love you dearly but I can't agree to this. Although I am divorced from your son now, it still upsets me when I remember how he never made me feel special on my birthday. I know you understand this, it is why you want your other family members to continue to receive gifts from our household. But your son and I are no longer the same household. It isn't reasonable to ask me to do something for your family that your son never did willingly for me. I am the last person you should be asking - I have suffered most from your son's unkindnesses and it is important for the relationship I have with you that you acknowledge I am one of his victims, not someone who can make things right for the other victims.
When I give presents it is in recognition of the relationship between me and the recipient. It would be dishonest to give gifts at your request because I would be giving the gift for the wrong reasons. I will continue to give presents to the people I would have given them to even if you hadn't asked. I will continue to foster a good relationship between the DCs and all of your family. But everyone in the family needs to realise that the divorce has changed things and I am an individual separate to your son / their brother."