To not want social distancing at nursery

[Sadie789]

There’s been lots of discussion about when schools go back and what age groups will go first and the measures that will be put in place to support social distancing etc when this happens.

I’ve yet to hear any mention of nurseries. However I’ve been thinking about it a lot as I live near our nursery and pass it often. It actually breaks my heart to think of all the hardworking people who ran the nursery and made it such an amazing place for my DC who get so much from it and are missing it terribly.

But how can nurseries ever go back if social distancing is to be the “new normal”?

I don’t want my tiny children being looked after by people in PPE. I don’t want them not to be able to sit on their teacher’s lap for a story, or get a hug if they fall over, or have a literal helping hand when painting or doing a puzzle.

How will staff help zip up coats or change nappies?

I don’t want them to be kept apart from their friends, to be told how to play with them or have their numbers limited or staggered.

It’s not fair on very young children to be thrust into a new and strange world that they simply can’t have any real understanding of.

Does this mean nurseries will remain closed until next year? Some people even seem to think social distancing will be permanent- what implications does that have on our young children and how they learn about relationships and friendships? What about their developing immune systems being artificially disconnected from the normal cycle of infection and immunity (to other illnesses)?

I feel like under 5s have been forgotten about completely in this pandemic.

^I don’t want my tiny children being looked after by people in PPE*

I'm sure you wouldn't rather your kids died or killed people? A sense of perspective would help you.

"How will staff help zip up coats or change nappies?"

Erm, with their hands? Even if they wore gloves they'd still be able to do it.

@NoMoreDickheads do they have 2m long arms?

the thing I remember hearing is about teachers & how many of them have gone down with coronavirus (an interview at schools on bbc) if dc weren't passing it one the numbers of teachers who are apparently getting it wouldn't have been so high?

I agree this isn't talked about enough.

The other big problem is that bedside nurseries, grandparents provide a lot of care for under 5s, but this now seems a risky thing to do, esp if kids are back at nursery.

We might have to choose between grandparents having contact and sending kids to nursery.

Genuine question: what's happened to everyone's childcare needs? Everyone suddenly seems fine with not needing nursery, I thought there would be a national outcry but nobody seems too bothered!

My cousins are nursery teachers in Germany, and have been back at work since last Monday. They wear the visors decorated with colourful stickers, everyone washes their hands on arrival, and every hour. Their class sizes and teacher ratios are quite small.

I work with 2-3 years old in a nursery.
When they come in they are handed over at the door now, parents don't come in. Hands are washed straight away, that's normal now. After that there is no social distancing (obviously only key workers children in atm so very low numbers)
Nappies are changed wearing apron and gloves as we always have. Apart from that no ppe. We still fasten coats, give cuddles, get sneezed and snotted and wee'd on. We still sit with them doing activities, games and reading. We wash our hands a lot. We're scared of picking it up and bringing it home to our families but what can we do? It's just not practical to wear ppe or distance ourselves from toddlers.

DS is still going to nursery as we're both key workers. Handover is now done in the main lobby, only one parent is allowed in at a time.
Occasionally I've had to wait but not often as we seem to avoid the main drop off & pick up times. They've also asked that we don't send bags in every day like normal, I sent one change of clothes in a nappy sack that stays at nursery.
There is no social distancing between the children and staff, although they are doing a lot more activities outside than usual. DS is thriving with the smaller numbers, his speech is really improving and his behaviour is better too. He's also done a lot of activities he wouldn't have done normally.

@notinthislifetime I think a large number of people are suffering in silence because it’s not the done thing to admit that you were used to being a parent with lots of help... what I mean is we should all be able to quite happily look after and entertain all our children at home with very little because that’s how it used to be.

Even in my mother’s time there wasn’t nursery to the same extent, she didn’t have a car so we walked everywhere, no soft plays, No big shopping centres or entertainment complexes, no kids clubs, no fancy holidays, grandparents weren’t around, dad at work. Mum had us on her own all day in the house every day for years. All my under 5 memories are from in the house or the garden. I don’t remember going anywhere else except the butchers and only because there was sawdust on the ground and I have a memory of playing in it.

I run a nursery, it’s closed at the moment. I don’t know if it will re open. We were struggling with money and meeting ever increasing costs. Struggling to get qualified staff to maintain the qualification ratio.

Staff are scared about going back. I can give them no reassurances. We can play outside a lot, and keep in small groups, but I can’t keep them 2 metres away from others.
They get paid such little money for what will be quite a stressful situation.
The cost of gloves has sky rocketed. What would have cost me £8 now cost me £18.
Parents keep contacting me asking how I intend to implement social distancing and keep the children safe .. I can’t.

I also think it’s not talked about by government because they don’t know what to do and hope that it resolves itself

I am cminder- some things - I keep spare clothes here, no handover books , handover are verbal, can text / call about other issues. Parents remain 2 metres away unless handing over a baby. More hand washing. More thorough deep cleaning.

Otherwise we carry on as normal - only Keyworker children currently.

@Sadie789 how old are you that there was no nursery when you were young? I'm 32 and I went to nursery, as did my mother who is 63!

The stats seem to suggest that in a nursery context, the primary concern should be adult-to-adult transmission, between the staff.

Social distancing there seems possible.

My 12 month old was due to start last month. Instead, for 8 weeks he's not seen anyone but us, his parents. He was very social, but I think separation anxiety will be a real issue now. I hope work is understanding about a slow transition, and only after parents can stay.

You can,t in a nursery, which is why they are only open for certain groups and working on skeleton staff.

My DD constantly had a cold when going to
nursery, she would never be able to go if I have to keep her home every time she has a sniffle. Since we've been in lockdown she hasn't had anything (obviously). I guess with the improved hygiene that might mean she would get fewer colds now but also worrying like a PP said that they are less likely to come across minor illnesses to build their immune systems.

I think only a small amount of children will be allowed back anyway.Maybe later on as situation improves we can go back to normal capacity.

I am also shocked by how few people are talking about the childcare crisis caused by covid. I am currently working full time with a 2 and 1 year old and had to have my anti anxiety meds bumped up as I was on the verge of a mental breakdown. The doctor actually said I was lucky to have a job and asked me to clarify what I meant when I explained I was doing 2 full time jobs at the same time(being an employee and a mum). She made me feel like a piece of shit for struggling and HR at work are no use either. I cant afford not to get paid so have no choice but to endure for god knows how long.

@Vampyress totally know where you are coming from. I’m working from home full time with a child under 1 and it’s hard, really hard work. Dc2 is at school but even then I’m playing catch up in the evenings just to keep floating.
I feel like I’m failing at both to honest..... both can’t have my attention and both are suffering. It’s hard work, really hard.

Nurseries are being talked about. There was a piece yesterday on the BBC news channel that was repeated several times.

Obviously nursery staff can't practice SD and they won't be in PPE.

Your OP was very heartfelt but I feel you are being over dramatic.

No decent child care setting is going to do anything that will damage the emotional well being of the next generation.

I suppose nurseries will have to be one of the places where SD can’t be upheld.

I agree the situation with nursery provision is massively under-reported. I understand that the government has also done a u-turn on furloughing nursery staff?

Me and DH are trying to do our usual 30 hours a week and look after our 2 year old, we’re doing this by splitting days which usually ends up with us mainly working in evenings and having no downtime. I love having more time with our toddler but we are both exhausted, my work have Said I don’t need to work my full hours but even then it’s exhausting and I don’t think we can do this long term.

If the nursery does go back then I worry that we’ll have to choose between nursery and him seeing his grandparents, who live too far away to provide any regular childcare. If that happens then one of us has to reduce our hours significantly, which basically means our jobs aren’t doable, or one of us quits our job. We could probably get by on one salary but there’s the risk of economic uncertainty for the company of the parent who is still employed.

You have to compromise somewhere - you can't just stamp your feet and demand everything magically reverts to how you've previously known it.

Intrigued how you would enforce social distancing in a nursery?

I hope this won't be the case op. I very much doubt social practising can be practised in this setting. Staff would be killing each other to prevent it and it just wouldn't be plausible.

My ds is starting reception in September and I have had the same fears. It will be a very strange introduction to school if they are encouraged to keep apart and are not comforted when they cry. I don't think it can really be expected to happen other than reducing numbers and big congregations like assemblies and whole school lunches.

There will have to be a balance between what is good for the children and what is better for social distance. I think they’d have to let parents in for settling visits but perhaps not at other times. I saw an interesting leaflet from the nursery association saying that care needs to be taken for all transitions back in. I

I wouldn’t send my two back if they tried to enforce social distancing. They need cuddles etc and I think everyone accepts it can’t be done for the children. It isn’t a competition as to who has lockdown harder but I think the experience for nursery aged children must be harder. We are frazzled.