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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Simon Dolan seeking judicial Review of government’s lockdown - AIBU to think he is a selfish pr**k?

172 replies

Userwhatevernumber · 02/05/2020 16:22

A multi-millionaire is taking the government to court to challenge the lockdown restrictions. He is seeking judicial review of the decision to enforce lockdown.

Fair enough if he wanted to use his own multi-millions to find this. But no, he is actually crowdfunding. He is seeking to raise £125,000 from the public. At a time when he himself has already acknowledged the suffering economy.

AIBU to think this is total selfishness and that he is just another white, rich privileged man thinking he can play the hero and save us all when all the while he is only out for himself?

😡

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/law/2020/may/01/uk-government-faces-legal-challenge-coronavirus-lockdown-businessman-simon-dolan

www.crowdjustice.com/case/lockdownlegalchallenge/

OP posts:
sparepantsandtoothbrush · 02/05/2020 16:30

Apparently he lives in (tax haven) of Monaco where the lockdown is even stricter thank the UKs. Clearly there is something more in this for him than just the well of the people 🙄

Userwhatevernumber · 02/05/2020 16:32

Of course he lives in a tax haven 🙄

OP posts:
CuriousaboutSamphire · 02/05/2020 16:34

And was the executive producer (?) of a film about David Icke

And is making money flying PPE in his fleet of planes

He has not yet launched it, has given the government until Thursday to respond... rather good timing I thought.

Basically he's a twat!

HeyDuggeesCakeBadge · 02/05/2020 16:43

I don't think he's selfish, the government should be able to prove quite easily that they enacted lock down as a proportionate means to a legitimate aim. This is curtailing our freedom and I absolutely think the government should be able to provide evidence that this is supported and held to account - good on him. It says the action is supported financially up to a court case so if they provide a satisfactory answer they won't need the additional finance.

Userwhatevernumber · 02/05/2020 16:50

@HeyDuggeesCakeBadge fair enough, I understand your point but does he really need to crowd find? Isn’t he rich enough to pay for his own litigations?

Is it really what the government need right now?

OP posts:
Bluntness100 · 02/05/2020 16:52

I think he is right to do this, it has already been done in another country and was successful as against human rights to put people under house arrest and remove their freedoms, to fine them if they go out.

I think all governments need to be held to account to articulate the cost to their people of the lock down and restrictions, from unemployment forecasts, increased taxes, other deaths, be it untreated cancer, or mental health services being removed, lack of future funding for key services etc,

So I get he lives in Monaco but other than geography I think he’s absolutely right to do this, because at the very least the government should be more transparent with people on the cost to them personally and society as a whole from what’s occurring here.

Police have basically been acting likely illegally - example asking people where they are going, and fining them if they don’t say. We have a right to a private life. To not be stopped and questioned and told we have to go back to our homes.

Whether a court in this country will want to go there is a different story and may not wish to get involved as it could be argued it’s political strategy,

However is there a question to be answered here on whether placing your population under what effectively amounts to house arrest and fining them if they go out for reasons other than you permit is actually illegal, then yes there is, and is there a question to be answered on the cost to the us as a society, then yes there is,

As said though, a court could be scared to go there and throw it out. But we will see more and more of these cases across the world come up, because basic human rights have been removed and the cost of doing so is not being explained to people.

HeyDuggeesCakeBadge · 02/05/2020 16:53

I agree he could fund this himself and his 'it will show the government that people care about it' is an excuse for, 'I don't want to dip into my profits too much' but i honestly don't think its a bad thing at all, yes they've got a lot on their plate but they should be able to provide sufficient evidence that such draconian measures are supported by evidence. Otherwise we are walking into a big brother state where the government can do anything to us without having to prove the need for it.

HeyDuggeesCakeBadge · 02/05/2020 16:55

Bluntness has said everything I wanted to in a more eloquent way 😁.

cardibach · 02/05/2020 16:58

I can’t believe there are people who would want to give the government (who I don’t support in general, by the way, and think have made many cock ups in this situation) more to do to ‘prove’ they have a reason to do what governments all over the world have also done. It’s bonkers.
Invoking human rights is also bonkers. You don’t have the human right to risk the lives of people you come in contact with. Your rights end when they start to impinge on the right to life of other people. Our lockdown is hardly draconian anyway. ‘House arrest’ my arse. You can go out to shop, to exercise, for any genuine need.

Bluntness100 · 02/05/2020 16:59

Otherwise we are walking into a big brother state where the government can do anything to us without having to prove the need for it

Totally agree, to say he should not be challenging the government is to say they can do exactly as they please when they please, if they deem the reason justifiable and we as a population will get attacked if we question it,

As said. The government need to answer the question on exactly what this is costing us and not just”x billions” but in terms of x people will die, x amount of unemployment, x rise in taxes, and within given corridors not exactly so people know what we are facing.

But no government should be able to place their population under house arrest and give police powers to remove their right to privacy, to fine them or jail them, without being held to scrutiny.

If they have the justifation then they can provide it, but provide it they should. Not hide it and people who challenge and want the answers shouldn’t be attacked.

This guy is crowd funding because it should be everyone’s question , not just his.

midsomermurderess · 02/05/2020 17:02

What other country has ruled that lockdown is a breach of its citizens' human rights?

CuriousaboutSamphire · 02/05/2020 17:03

And they won't be able to answer any of the those questions yet, not for quite some time.

Yes, a challenge to the legality of some police actions, some have been over zealous.

But we are not under house arrest etc. That is disingenuous.

formerchild · 02/05/2020 17:05

Kinda hoped that if there was going to be one good thing to come out of lockdown it'd be and end to racist bullshit like this. Especially when you consider what "white men" such as captain Tom have done during this pandemic

Bluntness100 · 02/05/2020 17:05

You can go out to shop, to exercise, for any genuine need

Going out once a day to exercise, not allowed to see friends or family only allowed to shop for essentials is as close to house arrest as it gets here. Genuine need to see your mum, no we will fine you. Genuine need to walk your dog twice a day, no we will fine you, genuine need to see your child, no we will fine you, genuine need to see your counsellor, no we won’t permit it, genuine need to have cancer treatment, no we won’t give you it, genuine need to go through the fertility treatment you were promised after 10 miscarriages, nope, that’s off the table for the foreseeable, genuine need to get to the dump, as you’re swimming in shit, nope, we shut them down.

It’s to all intents and purposes a house arrest.

I’m not saying the lock down to date wasn’t required, in my view it was. I do now think restrictions need to be eased gently over a period of time. I fully support the question being asked on the cost to us as a society, and understanding of the government is behaving illegally, in terms of looking at what’s to come.

HeyDuggeesCakeBadge · 02/05/2020 17:11

I'm not arguing for or against the lock down by the way - I don't know whether it was fully necessary but I won't condemn someone for trying to hold the government to account to ask the difficult questions.

Topseyt · 02/05/2020 17:17

I think he is right to do this.

I do support the lockdown so far, but we need to ensure that governments are continually held to account and we don't sleepwalk into a dictatorship and a police state. I'm not comfortable with the removal of so many freedoms and I will only accept it for so long really.

I don't like living in a state where people are snitching to the police because their neighbour left his house X number of times, or people are called murderers for eating a packet of crisps on a park bench.

It is a legitimate concern that as governments have now had this taste of such power they might be less than enthusiastic about relinquishing it.

So, after some deliberation, I think YABU.

PubsClubsMinistryOfSound · 02/05/2020 17:23

I can't get too upset about the GoFundMe itself, nobody is going to be forced to donate. If people want to spend money on bringing weak legal cases, that's no more my concern than however else they want to fritter their hard earned. And if not enough people are willing to donate, his fundraising efforts will fail.

sparepantsandtoothbrush · 02/05/2020 18:00

What racist bullshit @formerchild?

cardibach · 02/05/2020 18:04

@Bluntness100 I’m in Wales where it is just one walk a day. If you are in England it isn’t.
You can buy what you like, just don’t go to the shop more times than you need to. I don’t anyway. I fucking hate food shops at the best of times.
If your genuine need to see your mum is about her welfare, you can do it.
It really isn’t house arrest.
In normal circumstances, theses restrictions would be unreasonable, yes. You may have noticed our circumstances aren’t normal.

Troels · 02/05/2020 18:09

Sounds like a bunch of whining babies who are pretty much unaffected by the Virus. The tune would probably change if they had close family, loved ones lying in ICU due to all this. Or if thye had close family putting their life on the line treating the people in ICU.

OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 02/05/2020 18:09

Do you want to know what's in it for him?
This🤷🏻 Publicity

NailsNeedDoing · 02/05/2020 18:11

It says in the article

Dolan said the case was funded all the way to the court but he was advised that the crowdfunding would help the budget if it became a prolonged case and would also help to see “ how much support was out there from the general public”. He said: “When people actually start putting their hands in their pockets it’s a far more powerful message.”

It pretty much answers your question about crowd funding, and it’s a fair enough answer in my mind. Otherwise you might have had a point. But you don’t, so I’m thankful that someone with money is up for raising the questions. We may as well use the democracy that we have created.

OmgThereAreNoPlanesAboveMeNow · 02/05/2020 18:12

I too am curious about which other country is bluntness talking about.

MrsTerryPratchett · 02/05/2020 18:14

I don't think he's selfish, the government should be able to prove quite easily that they enacted lock down as a proportionate means to a legitimate aim.

I had to deal with a legal action this week. It took days away from my key role. People didn't get support because I was preparing. Of course we won but that doesn't give me the time back. I'd imagine the government might have slightly better things to do with their time right now than deal with a toddler tantrum by a privileged emigre.

Finerumpus · 02/05/2020 18:14

OP What does the colour and sex of the litigant have to do with anything?
Crowdfunding is a good idea. It’s totally optional. If you don’t want to contribute you don’t have to.