To think this school's plan won't work

[Poppi89]

I work in a secondary school ( not as a teacher) and we have been kept up to date by email and zoom staff meetings.

There has been a lot of talk of when we will re-open and what will happen as like most schools it was very stressful closing the school and not being prepared so they are trying to put plans in place and keep one step ahead.

Due to a lot of parents in the area wanting the school to re-open and for life to go back to 'normal' they think the government might re-open schools sooner rather than later maybe before May half term, so the school has put in place an outline of what will happen:

• School will re-open but will continue sticking to the guidelines of social distancing - as this is not possible in a school with full capacity students will be split into halves or thirds to ensure they are spaced far enough away from each other. This means that the kids will only be in 1/2 days a week.

• Due to adults spreading the virus more than children (it seems) they don't think all staff should be in each day. So will be depending on parents to do a rota system - so one qualified member of staff to 2 parents to supervise.

Does anybody else think the school would be better to remain closed if this is the case?
It seems they won't be learning much and the risk of getting the virus will still be high.

I do get that this is the best plan they have come up with to keep everyone happy. My DD is missing her friends and wouldn't mind going back to school a couple of days a week and I guess it will be easier for parents to get back to work but I would rather wait until June/July at the earliest as surely the NHS is still overwhelmed.

What do you guys think?
AIBU - thinking this isn't a good plan

It’s questioning the statement that this plan allows people to go to work when no mention has been made of scheduling multiple children in a family for the same days or cross school scheduling for families with children in different schools.

I doubt that any way the schools reopen on a phased basis will actually help people go back to work. I can see any plan that is produced will just make lots of people cross.

I'm really saddened by the amount of shock and anger people are expressing at the fact they may be asked to volunteer!

Has no-one on here ever volunteered, or been asked to volunteer at their DCs school?

My DDs primary school was constantly asking for parents to volunteer for reading, day trips, summer and Xmas fairs, discos etc. Hardly any would have been DBS checked.

I didn't do as much as I would have liked to as I didn't have the time but I still did the odd hour every term like being on the cake sale stall or cleaning up after the disco.

Pandemic aside I would really recommend trying to be more involved as I went to the zoo with the entire class and it is something I will never forget and my DD loved me being there too.
My DD went to breakfast and after-school club and had a childminder take her to these so being able to show my face and know the faces of the other children and parents was really important to me.

@BlessYourCottonSocks says all that needs to be said.

I cannot fathom what these parents are supposed to be doing? If the teacher is in the classroom then they don't need a parent volunteer. If the teacher is not in the room then they CAN'T use a parent volunteer

I honestly don't know how public transport would work.

As there will be fewer pupils going in each day then there will be less of them on the buses but I still don't think it's right.

With regards to only working a couple of days a week, that is what most people I know are doing now. I only know a few that are still going in every day 5 days a week, most are just doing 1/2 days so they are still getting full pay, the rest are working from home or being furloughed.

I think this 'plan' is based on if the country has to social distance for a long time. Therefore, workplaces would have to social distance too meaning some places would have to have fewer staff in each day.

If this plan went ahead I don't believe any school will force parents to come in all day every day. I assume it would be a system where you put down your availability and then do an hour or 2 every now and then. There are over 1000 pupils in my school so 1000 parents will definitely not be needed.

@Letseatgrandma - I agree that no plan is going to suit everyone. This is why I wanted to know if I was being unreasonable saying I disagree with this plan because I wouldn't be able to come up with a better solution.

Schools don’t have the authority to force parents to do anything behind drop their child at the gates

I’m not blaming you as such OP but either you misunderstood your staff briefing or your senior management are incompetent.

Just wait until we actually know what is happening.

@Letseatgrandma and @BlessYourCottonSocks - as I said a few times it would not be a teacher it would be an admin assistant or someone who has a DBS check but has no experience of being alone in a classroom environment.

Even in places of work you are very rarely alone, as there is usually someone on hand to offer support if needed.
I guess they thought that some parents might have wanted to offer to help if it meant re-opening the school quicker.

If this plan went ahead I don't believe any school will force parents to come in all day every day. I assume it would be a system where you put down your availability and then do an hour or 2 every now and then.

@AppleKatie - please do not say I have said something which I blatantly haven't.

An admin assistant and a parent in the classroom? With a load of year 9s who haven’t seen each other for months and no knowledge of the curriculum, support training or guidance. You couldn’t make it up.

I genuinely can’t see how schools can reopen with reduced numbers to allow social distancing in a way that will work for everyone. Right now schools are trying to provide remote education and there is no model that works for all families. There are too many variables, additional needs, access to technology, ability and availability of parent/carer to support it, stress levels at home due to financial uncertainties, individual children’s ability to engage at home with what is provided.

Schools function in a model that relies on high density of children in school transport, rooms, corridors, playgrounds and dining halls. Their staffing numbers reflect this model. Any parent whose child’s needs have resulted in a request for flexi schooling or anything that means a non-standard attendance pattern can tell how complex and difficult to achieve this is. Any school timetabler could explain how complex it is to get kids and staff and rooms to work with the current numbers and facilities within a single school.

A reduction in density means taking the current model and doubling or tripling the number of class groups into the same number of spaces with reduced staffing numbers due to shielding or sick staff.

Maybe add in trying to keep with curriculum dates so trying to deliver lessons in two formats, live and remote so all the pupils are progressing at the same weekly speed.

Add in transport, family groups in one school, family groups across schools, family health factors, additional needs, etc.

I would not want that task. It’s hideous and not possible to do it in a way that works for all families so no matter how you do it there will be inequity and a backlash.

I thought people would accuse me of being lazy and not wanting to go back to work haha! I'm shocked that it is because they may have to give up some of their own time.

Did anyone else who WFH not sign up to volunteer to deliver shopping to those who are shielding or anything?

I can't believe the selfish attitudes on here. I welcome the opinions of those who are wondering how logistically it would work on public transport, if parents are working full-time etc but some seem to just have selfish attitudes.

I do not agree with this plan as in my opinion the schools shouldn't re-open until it is safer to do so.

@AppleKatie - my thoughts exactly. But as Ive said several times there would no 'teaching' taking place as the teachers would have set the work already. It would simply be supervising.

You are suggesting that schools would expect people to sign up for an hour or two at a time and a stream of parents would come in and out of the premises.

It’s never going to happen.

Parent volunteers have a place in schools of course but it is never a) to replace paid staff b) during a pandemic.

The plans you outline are amateurish, dangerous and unworkable.

It’s hard to believe your claim to work in a school.

Admin assistants? We employ two in my school-they are both rushed off their feet with admin tasks and couldn’t leave that to front a class.

If you don’t agree with this plan, why do you keep banging on about volunteers staffing a school being such a good idea?!

@2ndStar - I agree but I think this is on the basis that we will have to social distance for a lot longer than planned - may be up to a year. As people are already calling for schools and shops etc to re-open Then there's no other choice to social distance which can't happen in a normal school.

If I was head and I felt that it was unsafe to re-open then I would refuse, but I don't know how much power they actually have over that decision.

@AppleKatie - which pandemics are you referring to?

As in my lifetime, this is the first time this has happened so by no way are things running under 'normal' circumstances.

If you have read what I've actually put ( and not said I've said something that I've not ) you would have read that I have put multiple times that this is NOT MY PLAN I did not come up with it and I do not agree with it. PLease RTFT before posting next time.

@Poppi89 I've done lots of volunteering at school. I was a helper at playgroup, have spent years on the PTA at my kid's primary school, helped out at cubs and Brownies. I've volunteered professionally - adviser to the board for a charity and spent time as a school governor.

I also teach in a secondary school. It is a WORLD of difference going on a trip, making mother's day cards, playing Mrs Claus, standing on a bloody tombola than being in a teaching situation. Even in some sort of supervision scenario like you are talking about (but what's the point when there's a qualified teacher in the room?) a classroom full of kids of any age is a completely different beast to a hall full of kids at a summer fair.

There will always be people who volunteer despite their own busy lives. Likewise there will always be people who never volunteer despite their seemingly 'empty' lives (not a dig, I've seen it from both sides and heard every reason/excuse for both).

Volunteering, and teaching, is not for everyone. In fact, much as I'm sure every teaching professional has thought wtf about their colleagues occasionally, I've worked with volunteers who I've had to 'sack' because they really shouldn't be, despite their willingness to help.

Hopefully the government is coming up with a workable plan. Schools will not open (despite every government date set) if they haven't got correct ratios of staff to students, and my understanding is that parent volunteers aren't included in these figures. Supply teachers have been out of work for 5 weeks; our cover manager has a list of external supply and agencies she can contact for professional, qualified, DBS approved staff.

@Poppi89 sorry, I meant to add this at the start of my post I'm really saddened by the amount of shock and anger people are expressing at the fact they may be asked to volunteer!

@Letseatgrandma - because I think volunteers are a fantastic idea. You may not be aware but there are many organisations who wouldn't be able to run without the help of volunteers - I am quite shocked you are suggesting otherwise.

• I do not agree with this plan not solely because of the volunteers themselves but because it is part of a response that there would not be enough staff to re-open the school - so my argument is the school should then not re-open.

• The volunteers were only half the plan - the other part (which barely anyone has mentioned as it doesn't affect them) is the fact they will be social distancing so fewer pupils will be in meaning there will be barely any education benefits so what would be the point.

@Stronger76 - I completely understand by me going to the zoo with my DDs class is completely different from teaching a full class but this was in response to all the posters saying I am lying as no-one without a DBS check would be allowed in school.

As I have said this is not a set in stone plan or anything but I am assuming the qualified teachers would not have a parent helper ( as they do this every day anyway), it would be those already working in the school who have DBS checks but aren't teachers. Or to help with break time duties or road crossings etc. They definitely wouldn't be expected to teach or anything. I am not a qualified teacher but have been working in a school for years and I know I couldn't teach.

is the fact they will be social distancing so fewer pupils will be in meaning there will be barely any education benefits so what would be the point

Well, this morning’s news seems to be that we can forget about the 2m rule anyway, so it’ll be back to school as before anyway.

I have read the thread you are consistently arguing both points-

‘We should all volunteer in our kids schools willingly’

‘The schools plan wasn’t your idea and you don’t agree with it’.

It’s like arguing with a goady straw man but I’m going to stop now. I hope the majority can see this thread for the ridiculous bullshit it is.

I speak as a parent and teacher who is not afraid of doing anything for my kids school

Did anyone else who WFH not sign up to volunteer to deliver shopping to those who are shielding or anything?

What? Seriously what do you think working from home is? I’m working at least 1.5 times standard hours due to the massive increase in demand for what I do (keyworker) due to everyone working at home alongside reduced staff in my team due to furloughing people who can’t work from home. I know many people WF who are in similar or worse positions. Where is this imaginary extra time coming from to volunteer?

OP parents are not going to volunteer to come and look after other people's kids when they've been stuck at home trying to keep their own sane for weeks on end. Its just not going to happen.

I don't want to schools to open until it's absolutely necessary and no way would I let my kid go in to be supervised by randoms anyway.

@AppleKatie - I am arguing both points as I have said numerous times I am no expert, I don't agree with the plan but I wouldn't know an alternative.

My argument is based purely on the fact people think I must be a liar because a school would never ask a parent volunteer who doesn't have a DBS check. The people saying this are the liars because I do not belive they have never been asked to not volunteer at their DCs school.

I am agreeing with everyone who has said they don't agree with the plan. As that is my personal opinion too. But I am saddened why people are offended that they may be asked to volunteer and not because they think their DCs may be at risk of catching or spreading a virus.