That day nursery can be as good as school nursery ?

[Sootyandsweep2019]

Pregnant and stressed. Will need to, ( financially), return to work 3 days a week when baby is 5-6 months old.

Looking at childcare options and, pre-lockdown, found what I thought was an absolutely lovely day nursery that takes babies 3 months to four years.

Staff seemed lovely, lovely outdoor play area, pets/ farmyard animals,regular trips out, home cooked / nutritious meals , literally everything you could want.

Naively I also felt for a baby that I would prefer a nursery over a childminder , as there are people around, ( in case anything untoward happened), and everyone coming into the setting is DBS checked. I also assumed that , ( if settled ), baby would stay there until reception as they follow eyfs. However, I've just spoken to my sister , ( who works in a school), and she has told me in no uncertain terms :

-Day nurseries are full of bored 17 year old staff who don't care.

• They're horrible places which are lonely and boring for children.

-School nurseries are soooo much better, shge doesn't know anybody who would keep their child in a day nursery over a school nursery.

Have i got everything wrong ? Genuinely feel quite stressed and upset

Your sister is wrong.
We used a private nursery and it was fabulous. They had excellent, well qualified staff - it was worth every penny.
School nursery operated in school hours and you couldn't access the wrap around care which would have made it impossible for us both to work.
Our private nursery was open all year round which offered us so much flexibility.

There aren't any school nurseries where I am and if there were I wouldn't send ds to one after reading about them on here.
Small children in uniform. 3 & 4 year olds not being given any help in the toilet etc.
No thanks.

You’ve seen the intended nursery with your own eyes and were impressed by it. So you know that in this particular case your sister is wrong. She seems a little partisan and irrationally prejudiced. If she doesn’t know anyone who would keep their child in a day nursery, does that mean she doesn’t know any working mums? If she does, how do those mums get their DC from the school nursery to the other form of childcare that they are still going to need?

For a young child - under about 2.5/3 hrs old, I'd choose a good childminder.

My mum and sister are both early years specialists so I've ended up learning quite a lot about it over the years.

Young children don't need other children around. They need a strong, attached relationship with a consistent adult. It isn't really possible to do this at a nursery - even if your child has a key worker, ratios mean that the key worker's attention will be spread very thin.

I've done childminder/day nursery and school nursery with both my kids. Day nursery was were the care and attention was spread thinnest. School nurseries are lead by highly trained early years educators - day nurseries are often staffed by people with very little training, even if their intentions and instincts are good.

Good childminders are worth their weight in gold.

Re your mum's friend who is a childminder: I'm sure your mum is lovely but I'd be concerned about her policies, frankly.
My sister is a childminder and when she is minding she does not have friends popping over - she is working.
Some childminders have a log book that all visitors to the premises have to sign when they are minding.
When you visit a childminder you can ask them these sorts of questions. A good CM will be pleased you do.

You are always going to find good nurseries/childminders and bad ones.

I looked around 10 day nurseries for my return to work. I found an amazing one. The staff all seemed lovely and the key worker was really nice. Ofsted Outstanding. I also picked it because they had a camera system, so parents could go in and check on their little ones without the little ones seeing.

Thank God I picked that one. My DD started there several weeks before I returned to work so, for her settling in, I would nip out to the shops and then come back and collect her.

One day I came back about an hour earlier than pick up. I thought "I'll just nip in, see how she's doing and then go and wait in the car". As I approached the door, there was a child screaming and crying. Went in, saw that it was my DD with an upset face like I'd never, ever seen before. She was on her own in a travel cot, stood up in great distress. It was upsetting to see but I ignored my instincts to rush in and scoop her up, thinking they may be busy and trying to give her time to settle herself (she subsequently had a fear of the travel cot that lasted for months that she'd never had before or after).

When I bought her home, we noticed a mark on the back of her neck. It looked like a fingernail. Nursery said that she'd done it to herself but it would have been impossible given the angle that it was at.

The next day I decided to come and go and keep an eye. She was supposed to be there for several hours. I nipped in at snack time. She was the only one not having snack at the time. So the rest of the room was sat around the little table while my DD was on the floor with her cuddly toy. 3 members of staff were having a chat but supervising the eating children.

My DD fell over onto her tummy, hit her head on the floor and began to cry. I think she was also distressed out of frustration of not being able to get back up. The staff knew that she wouldn't be able to do.this herself. I timed how long they ignored her for. It was 5 minutes before a member of staff from the office saw me watching the cameras and rushed in to the room to tell the staff. My DDs key worker then rushed over to my DD, grabbed her by the tops of her arms (not scooping her up under her armpits) and plonked her back on her bum. This was done without any care, like my DD was a sack of potatoes. She didn't comfort the crying even though she knew I was watching.

We never sent my DD back there. My DD was clingy and not herself for weeks and would only let me hold her (not her Dad or Grandma who she was normally so attached to). They put on a great act for us!

We eventually found a childminder who was a friend of a friend and I trusted my friend's word that she would put her own childrens' lives in this childminder's hands. We are still on friendly terms now and her older daughter babysits my kids.

I'm not saying one is better than the other. However, do really, really good research. Observe these places really well. Go to places that childminder's go. Watch their behaviour with the kids. Which one's just leave the kids to their own devices for a long time and which ones interact with their mindees.

If you've seen one you like then go for it... school nurseries have less staff so higher ratios... I know a lot of people that did both so private until 3/4 then school but the hours are tricky but better now as quite a few do 30hr

All registered early years settings have to follow the same curriculum and prove what work they are doing to develop the children.

It's the care that they give that is the priority for me.

I sent my DS to a private day nursery when he was 1. Although it had great reviews, friendly staff and lots on offer for the children, he hated it. At pickup, quite often there would be someone you hadn't met before giving you a run down of little ones day. The nappy rashes he came home with (because it's much harder to be aware of in a bigger setting) and the untold bugs made me research another setting. It broke my heart to leave him there in such a noisy artificial setting. I found a childminder and although she had two young girls working for her, the setting was homely. Less kids, more walks and outdoor space and she would message me in the day with updates. He never had nappy rash again and the bugs stopped. When the childminder is ill or has a holiday booked, then they close unlike a nursery but my DS well-being was much more important. It was the personal touch. He was happier and stayed there until he started a school nursery where he then went onto join the school attached. The school nursery was great in getting him prepared for school.

're.Cm My friend is one and I have to sign in to a book if I visit whilst any of her mindees are there. I happen to have a DBS but would be allowed to visit without one.

Ignore her, there are good and bad settings. Use your 6th sense. We visited 3 until it felt right. DD was really happy there.
It depends on your baby too. DS hated the noise, the setting, he was better with a CM.
Until she gave him back due to excessive crying

I used a day nursery for both of my children and it was excellent. They supported us during my son's diagnosis of autism and learning dis and dealt with him and his challenging behaviour with knowledge, compassion and understanding. They were far from uninterested 17 year olds! Many had degrees and other qualifications In child development and child care.
Also, many school nurseries do not take kids under 3. And are useless to working parents due to short days and closing in summer holidays.
Quite frankly, your sister is talking out of her arse! It's your decision and if you have found somewhere that you like and the hours meet your needs, then great. Don't let your sister's silly ideas put you off.

When you visit, you get a feel for nurseries. You know, having looked around, what type of place it is. Both my dds have been/go to a day nursery and its lovely. A good mix of older women and young trainees. They follow the EYFS curriculum and everything is logged on a system called Tapestry. When I log on, there are photos of my dd 'doing' - between 2-5 daily. My dds both love it. It set them both up perfectly for school, by eldest dd is still best friends with two of the girls she went to nursery with. The younger staff are great - keen to learn and very much focussed on 'developing' the child - they train for this and out their training into action. The older women are mums and grandmas themselves.

I've just seen your question about childminder regular visitors. If someone is regularly visiting a childminder's setting when mindees are there, then they MUST have a DVD check. Your Mum's friend should be getting her to.sign the visitors book.

The childminders that I'm friends with only allow visitors if they are parents looking to use the setting. They are not allowed to leave the parents alone with the children.

I don't go round my friends houses when they have mindees, they are working so it's not appropriate. Childminder's might invite other childminder's over for the kids to socialise. Plus everyone is allowed the odd cup of tea in a working day.

I suspect that your Mum's friend started pre OFSTED and is a bit old school so ignores some of the rules. I would filter these ones out by going places they go (Childrens' centres, soft play, local farm/activity centre, toddler groups) and see what they're like with the children. When vetting, ask to see the visitors book.

DBS check, not DVD check. Bloody autocorrect!

My son was in nursery 3/4 days per week until starting reception. Mostly mature staff, no young trainees. I'd say the only issue was the lack of 'education' in the pre school room, but that doesn't go for all nurseries. We kept him there as he was very happy and felt there was plenty of time for formal learning. He was well cared for and spent lots of time playing inside and out in their beautiful big garden.

Nursery hours just wouldn't work for us both working and felt he was too young for nursery + school wrap around care.

It's important to stress that even up to the end of reception, learning is play based. Reception teaches the basics of Phonics and numeracy, plus building social, emotional skills in starting school. So if your child goes to school only from reception, they're really not missing out.

My child is Year 1 now, and top couple in the class for reading/maths, so the approach we took didn't disadvantage him at all.

In a cm setting any visitors need to be recorded and never left alone with the children. I don't have visitors when I'm working. Sometimes spend time with another childminder but she's registered and vetted in her own right

My daughter went to a school nursery and the teacher at her school said if she could clone her she would, she was absolutely ready for school and hasn’t struggled with things like eating in the hall, she knew how to get a tray and get food, carpet time, school bells, assembly, as well as knowing what she needed to learning wise, the nursery really was just a reception class, so going into reception didn’t phase her at all.
However. She didn’t get into the school that the nursery was in, I really struggled with this she lost all of her friends and at the new school most of the kids had come from the 3 local day nursery's and friendship groups were established and my daughter is always on the fringes and hasn’t made any good friends, (although this has turned out to be a blessing in disguise right now as most of the kids are struggling and missing their friends my daughter hasn’t missed anyone and is fine)
I have a 1 year old who will go to the same school as my daughter and I’d love her to go to the same school nursery my oldest did as it made school transition a doddle, but, most of the kids will go to the school and the same will happen again, so I have to weigh up what’s more important being school ready but no friends or send her to a day nursery near the school all of which are small and in converted houses, I’m not a fan of them
regardless of an outstanding ofsted rating, but she will have friends and socially will find it easier. I’m glad I’ve got time to decide, but if the school had its own nursery I’d definitely choose that over a day nursery every time.

I always think that school nursery is a good thing tho. It's defo beneficial for them to do their nursery year. We all follow the same curriculum but the school routine and mix of friends is always nice for them to get used to. I would say cm and day nursery are slightly different than the school nursery for this year if their life but also wouldn't do any actual harm if you decided to use them instead of a nursery. I'm a cm and have had 2 children spend their nursery year with me this year.

DD1 continued at her Community preschool/nursery after she turned 3. DD2 went to the school preschool class (we had moved, so options different).
They had different experiences, but I think they both went to the right setting for them. DD1 was a very slow speaker (and selective mute, so she chose not to speak at nursery that often). She was happy in the setting she knew well, with the staff and children she knew. There was about 20 of them. I liked the flexibility of her doing 3.5 days rather than 5 mornings/afternoons. It wasn't very 'academic' though- but she wasn't ready for phonics and numbers as a 3yo. The 'school' option for her would have been a 'free flow' early years unit with 100children aged 3-5 (combined preschool and reception). The facilities were amazing- but she wasn't ready for 100 children.
DD2 the only option was the school (Military base abroad). The children had daily phonics and maths, used the school facilities, and was quite integrated. She went 5 days for 3hrs. She had a great time.

I sent dd to a private nursery from when she about 11 months. Most of the staff were great and interacted well with the children. I cannot say everything was perfect because it wasn’t. But they were kind and caring to my dd.

Your sister sounds very annoying and I advise you to use the grey rock technique as much as possible with her, avoid discussing your parenting decisions as much as you can, if she asks then very short answers and change the subject. Boring small talk. Ask her questions instead. She sounds the type to be happy to talk about herself.

We don’t have many school nurseries round here-they were only built in areas of significant socio-economic deprivation, so it wouldn’t be an option anyway. The ones I know of though, are good and they do have a qualified teacher.

Even if you did want your child to go to one, the hours wouldn’t be much good if you work and you’d then need a childminder as well.

You’ll get a range of opinions even on here as you can see. If you’re happy with that nursery then that’s all that matters.

School nurseries simply aren’t suitable for the vast majority of working parents. They’re term time only, 9-3 only, and only take children from 3.

My DS’s private nursery is fantastic and I can’t wait for it to reopen for him to go back. The key is to find a good day nursery with a good mix of ages - ours has room leaders who are mainly in their 30s and 40s and have years and years of experience, supported by younger women and apprentices who are 16-18. Most of the younger girls are fantastic with the children and have so much energy.

Ratios are higher in a day nursery so your child will have more individual attention than in a school nursery. My DS (4 now and has been at the nursery since he was 10 months old) has absolutely thrived. From what I’ve seen there is also far more support in day nurseries for things like toileting, they eat proper meals there - at my DS’s nursery they teach the older children to use cutlery nicely, to serve themselves from large bowls in the middle of the table, to take their plates and cups to the kitchen afterwards, it’s brilliant.