‘Work from home if at all possible’ yet managers are already planning to get us back in.

[Beenjuice]

Our team provides an email and phone service to customers who buy our products. We cleared out the office the day that boris announced lockdown, took all our gear home and apart from the little loss of service the day of the swap over have worked hard to keep the email responses dealt with and incoming phone calls answered.
We all thought we were doing as best a job as we possibly can - we know there’s been a small dip in the number of enquiries answered per day than usual but that’s due to the extra communication issues that working apart from one another brings.
Today we were given the heads up that it’s looking likely we’ll be back in the office from May 11th albeit spread apart. Apparently the dip in numbers of enquiries being sent has been noted by the powers that be above.
So what was the point of the last 4 weeks at home? A group of about 15 of us having to use the same office kitchen, loos, door handles, stair rails and other places.
So what’s changed? Why does the rule ‘work from home if you can’ no longer apply to us? And how can it be justified if we’ve just spent the past 4 weeks working from home! Our customers haven’t seen a drop in service just the number game from the people above.
AIBU?

Or are there less queries to answer because business is quieter?

My work are proposing a return to the office plan to the bigwigs, involves leaving empty desks, no one directly behind you, only using desks away from walkways. Presumably on a rota because our desks are usually full.

Nothing said about toilets/kitchens/photocopiers etc though.

When the country is bankrupt you'll be glad to have a job. Or maybe you wont, as so many companies will have gone under.

Seems silly to me to rush back for a slight dip, will the decision makers be in? Or wfh themselves?

Lockdown needs to lift but there are jobs unable to be done wfh and those without resources who can't. They should go back first. If those who can wfh do as well that's more people putting those who can't at more risk.

Are you sure the drop in enquires isn't due to the situation? To companies and people stepping back in caution to preserve funds or because they aren't working?

@Beenjuice

Can you all get together and 'remind' them how much productivity will be down if you're all having to self isolate due to symptoms? How much further it will be down if there are (god forbid) any deaths. The cost of an
Onsite cleaner to keep communal areas suitably clean and the obvious office overheads.

Ask them if the very slight reduction in the quantity/speed of replies is really a problem?!

Obvious via a union if you have one.

There are going to be lots of arses who want the minions back in the office under their beady eye. It makes them feel important. It's a shame our Govt are so wet

A lot of employers seem to be jumping the gun here.

How do they know they'll be able to re-open as normal on May 11th? Nobody in government has given any specific date on when things can begin to re-open. All Boris has said is that he has a plan in place - he hasn't said anything about things happening on that date

I think if employers get people back soon, there will be class actions in the future. And against the government too.

Some strange answers on this thread.

OP, I would make your business case for working from home but I dont see your employer as being unreasonable. Are you of the mind that they will make reasonable adjustments due to the virus while at the office? How are your terminals spaced out?

One one hand we still have lockdown. On the other, if you can't work from home (ie construction) you didn't have to stop work in the first place.

Those two statements do contradict a bit. Because even if that's only, say 40% of the workforce, it's hardly 'lockdown' if they go back.

@cantory

I agree with Bluntness, have you considered some time off? You sound very anxious about levels of transmission.

@bakedcam I am anxious because if I catch it I have a high chance of dying. Being anxious in these circumstances is not a mental health issue, it is normal.
And yes other people will die as a result of all of this. 3% of the population are supposed to have had covid 19 and look at the amount of people who have died.

@bakedcam Presumably OP still has to share toilets and kitchen. It is not just as simple as having spaced out terminals.

I think the issue is sadly so many people have personally benefited from this pandemic. They have been maybe furloughed and kids at home, so still getting paid, but no work, or less work, no commute, no school run etc and life suddenly became so much better for them.

But instead of saying ok I was lucky and had a good couple of months out of this, I accept we need to go back. They refuse and dress it up as fear, because fear is acceptable right?

They aren’t just at the front of the queue with their grubby hands out for more money, they are actively fighting to keep it going, elbowing others out the way as they do. Fuck everyone else, fuck the costs, even fuck the kids and their right to an education, give me a few more months of this type of thing, and I’ll scream We are all going to die if you don’t agree.

It then means everyone else get shoved in the same boat as these low life’s, people who are shielded or very vulnerable need to be protected, and continue to be protected, and I hope the government continues to do so to keep them safe, people like cantory. and then simply cut all funding for the greedy lazy ones with their hands out because of nothing more than they like the new way of life.

How many people don’t want schools and work back because they are vulnerable and shielded, v how many don’t want them back because this new set up suits them just fine.

Our workplace has also started making plans to get us all back in, despite productivity being higher.
Tbh I would prefer to be in the office with my colleagues as the last couple of weeks have been tough mentally, but I don’t trust that the measures put in place will be that effective against CV with the toilets/kitchens issue, leading to a lack of service to our service users if we’re off sick.
Also, what do we do with these kids that are still off school.

@bluntness I know since the beginning you have not wanted a lock down and told frightened teachers that they just wanted paid time off work.
I know you have been quite clear that it does not matter if people die from covid 19 because you see that as just part of life.
Most of us value our parents and do not want them to die many years earlier than they would have. Most of us don't want to risk being ill with covid 19 for weeks and weeks and unable to look after our children properly. Most of us don't want us to risk possible long term health complications including lung damage.

You can dismiss that as people being lazy and avoiding work as much as you want. It is not the truth.
And any employer who knowingly puts staff in danger is opening itself up to future law suits. Health and safety laws still apply.

@cantory

Then you must shield. Yes, if someone suffers anxiety, then the chances are, a crisis such as this, will escalate that anxiety.

I have read the OP, but there is a level of perspective to be had here. If the OP's employer is able to adequately safeguard their employees, that performance levels need to return to former levels, that employer has every right to request people return to their work places. With rights, comes responsibility. We all have to share that responsibility.

If you're highly vulnerable as you say, then you're shielding anyway, so I'm not sure which part you're struggling to accept about the OPs situation? Her employer has requested a return of the workforce to the workplace. That's the discussion.

I'm a senior manager responsible for nine office locations and around 70 staff. We closed down responsibly and equipped our teams as best we could to work effectively from home. We have been able to continue delivering our services (healthcare recruitment) to the wider group and we haven't any furlough staff. However there has been a noticeable drop in output and we are having to compromise on significant quality and compliance areas- Virtual training as opposed to classroom, remote interviewing. However we have also had a large increase in payroll and invoice errors as its hard to deliver these in a silo.

We have't any fixed date to stage a phased return to work but we are in consultation with our colleagues to sound out their feelings and concerns. Things will have to adjust. Social distancing with full teams in some locations would be a challenge.

If we don't get some office teams back in soon though, we would be facing cashflow issues and that would lead to difficult decisions around furlough and ultimately reduced staff overheads. Put simply people may lose their jobs.

There are around 40% of the workforce still active as we speak. Do you really think that there will be a mass of law suits for those who have contracted CV. Some people need to give them selves a shake and stop scaremongering.

@bakedcam People who are vulnerable such as the OP are being asked to return to work. They are being asked to share work space, toilets and kitchens with possible infected colleagues. That will kill people and leave some with long term health problems.
Nearly all the NHS staff who have died have been in the vulnerable group. Nearly everyone who has died had an underlying condition. They are the people being talked about as having to go back to work.

And if they get covid 19 and survive, they are also the people more likely to be extremely ill for weeks and weeks.
Health and safety law still applies. Few workplaces can actually put proper measures in place. So yes employees will be able to sue employers if they are left with long term health problems and had not let employees work from home.

@hobbesmanc I assume there has been a drop in output because people are wfh and caring for children. With jobs usually where you wfh one condition is that you have childcare. Of course output has dropped.

I expect in some places wfh output will increase once the schools are back in action. Some Parents obviously have attention drawn in two places at the moment if wfh and having young kids.

I hope wfh lasts longer and companies chose to keep it, so people like dh and dsis who can't work from home can socially distance on public transport on their way in. Dbro company are looking at the long game, of a reoccurance in winter months or other sicknesses so they are planning rotaed wfh with all their staff who can

Until schools and nurseries are back I don't see how everyone can go back to work. Even then, I'd expect a phased return with those who can and are happy wfh to stay there and those who need to be in returning with increased cleaning/distancing etc.

While I get the importance of containing the pandemic, throwing mostly working mothers jobs under the bus isn't great long term.

@cantory

She doesn't strike me as particularly vulnerable. Where foes she say she is vulnerable? What is with people giving others 'vulnerable'?

You appear to misunderstanding many people's positions in this discussion and basing responses on your experiences and circumstances.

I know how Covid-19 works, we have confirmed case in our house. But I song have the same levels of anxiety you have. We are perfectly able to manage the situation without threatening to sue and bring class actions against our employers. I'm also fully up to speed with what is happening in the NHS. My daughter is a nurse.

Your situation is yours. But you're reading as hysterical. I dont want to be unkind, but you really are not making much sense.

Many employers are noting a drop not just in volumes but in adherence to procedure, regulatory rules etc. The FCA and FOS have been advising companies handling calls etc that the current situation does not provide justification for failing to carry out proper verification checks, dealing with complaints promptly or dropped calls. Complying with those requirements is very difficult when working remotely, likewise providing upskilling or refresher training to staff to cover off such errors/ risk of the same being repeated.

As for H&S, an employer's duty extends to your home environment if you are working temporarily from home. If your home workstation is not appropriate from a H&S point of view for whatever reason, then providing you have no health issues which put you at higher risk, your employer needs to return you to the office as soon as possible

Or are there less queries to answer because business is quieter?

My thought entirely. The number of responses will obviously fall if there are fewer inquiries.

@hobbesmanc I assume there has been a drop in output because people are wfh and caring for children. With jobs usually where you wfh one condition is that you have childcare. Of course output has dropped.

Technically if people wfh can't fulfill their contracted hours due to childcare then they should be using holidays or taking carers leave. We fortunately haven't been told to do that.

However the primary reason that output (and sales) are down is that key elements of our roles are harder and less effective done from our dining rooms.

You seem so focused on your own fears than you don't want to accept that if everyone takes your stance. the economy will grind to a halt and business will have no option but to lay off people. We simply dont have the cash reserves to carry on with such reduced cashflow on current staffing levels.

Btw I'd never expect anyone to be returning to work if they are shielding or in a high risk group. But to protect their jobs, some of us will have to go back

How on earth would you prove you could it from work? The best you would get is circumstantial ie x in the office has it and now I have it. It depends how much service is reduced as to whether they are being reasonable, and the reasons for this. Is it because people are struggling to balance other responsibilities whilst at home, or is it because the infrastructure isn't sufficient? Either way, as long as they put the correct measures in place, they can argue that their business is suffering from people working at home. Sadly it is an employer's market at the moment with so many poised to be unemployed, they wouldn't be too upset if people who weren't happy left I imagine.