Aibu to not force the kids to facetime?

[Queenofthestress]

Split up with ex-dp 3 years ago. 2 kids, aged 3 and 6. The eldest is autistic. We've been in lockdown for a month (we're on week 5 this week ) he's still going between his and his mums. So obviously the kids have been at home with me for the full month.

Since lock down started for us, I've had two or three messages asking how we are doing, and the total of 4 requests to facetime. Each time we have facetimed the eldest has refused and the youngest has refused 2 times. I do the usual encouraging to talk to him etc but short of following them round with the camera there's not much else I can do. Both refused last night so I ended the call. Then got several shirty messages off his mum for apparently refusing him access to facetime the kids. It's got me thinking that maybe I should be doing more to encourage the kids to talk to him but I can't see much more that I can do?

You can't force your DC's to facetime! Completely unreasonable and unacceptable for his mum to be sending shitty text messages accusing you of anything, did he ask her to?

I'd tell them both outright....

I would refute that text straight away if you haven’t already OP, just calmly stating that you tried but they didn’t want to do it to cover your back for the future. Might just be her mouthing off but it doesn’t sit right with me that she’s suggesting you’re blocking contact.

Maybe you could take a video of them doing something and send it over instead so you’ve got a water tight defensive in case they try to go down the legal route later?

Turn it round on them and ask how they’d get reluctant kids to comply? Let them come up with the solution, try it. And keep the same line until they realise their expectations are unrealistic for your kids.

Yanbu. Kids are some kinds of toy that will interact how you want when you want. Even as an adult I hate FaceTime.

The only compromise would be to just sit the phone in a side generally facing the area they are in/playing and leave them all to it. If they talk they talk. If they don’t they don’t.

I don't think you should force them but perhaps set up the Facetime in a less demanding way. So the kids can be playing and you can just show their dad what they're up to. I think kids can feel pressured if they're put on Facetime and forced to interact.

It's not the first time she's suggested I'm blocking contact so usually I take a timed and dated photo that I've actually showed up to meet for contact and he hasn't.

I think I shall start taking photos that the kids are off doing something and sending it as suggested. I did refute and say 'hang on a minute, they both said they didn't want to on facetime to him so how is that my fault' back but she completely ignored it. The kids have no problem telling people when they don't want to do something with other people (they have ace boundaries when it comes to talking to someone, hugging, doing something etc) which usually him and his mum respect but this time they don't seem to be doing.

Might just be her mouthing off but it doesn’t sit right with me that she’s suggesting you’re blocking contact.

I didn't think of it that way but your totally right.

In that case I'd definitely suggest doing what @Gatehouse77 suggested.

I do answer, give them the phone, they say they don't want to, so the call ends. I've never left the call unanswered so I don't know where she's getting that from either.

DD is autistic too and flatly refuses to FaceTime family members. She'll occasionally accede to "saying hello" as in will come into view, say hello or make a random noise and walk away. She will however record short video messages for us to send on - would that work for your boys?

I have a DS (6, autistic) and a DD (3), the recording a video might work with DS actually, thank you for that suggestion, he likes doing videos

And if he's had a habit of not showing up for contact, he can't really complain that his sons are following his example.

I'd not engage with his mum about contact, that's none of her business.

Sorry, I missed that your younger child was a girl!

Our dsc don't like talking over the phone but have been happy to play board games via Skype. Is there something like that you could set up?

That might be something I can do if their dad will engage (he's a bit hit and miss hence the so few messages, but that's a thread for another day)

What happens if you don't force them to come on the phone but just bring the phone over and say "I'm just showing dad you're toy kitchen/lego/play house" etc. Then dad can say "wow what are you making there?" and they can either answer or not as they decide.

They'll just look at the phone then move off to a different activity

I would just go with that then I think to be honest that's all their dad can expect. I'd let him have that as facetime - at least that way he'll be the one to eventually get bored and end the call and the kids can still see that their dad is interested in what they're up to without feeling like they have to perform for the camera.

It just seems to be him they have an issue with surprisingly, they're fine for my family and will happily engage, it's just when it comes to their dad they won't even look at the screen baring the telling him they don't want to. I've got some ideas on how to hopefully get them engaged with him while we're in lockdown as we'll be here for a while atleast (I'm extremely vunerable as I'm missing part of my lung & have had a tumor before) fingers crossed it works

I agree with the suggestions of sending photos/video so he can’t accuse you of withholding anything from him.

In addition, maybe he could plan to actually do something with them to keep their interest - Reading a story or similar?

My autistic child barely talks on the phone, let alone video messaging. When he communicates, he's manually decoding all the verbal and non-verbal signals and cues that NT people take for granted. On a video call, laggy videos, poor lighting, and sound quality all interfere with that process. Eye contact is a challenge anyway. Although DS may appear to make satisfactory eye contact, it tends to focus on "safe people" not necessarily the person he is talking to if he feels discomfort. ASD is a communication disorder and while some people may appear to communicate functionally much of the time, they still have a communication disorder nonetheless. It is unfair to demand that a child with ASD is forced to communicate in a certain way just to appease the ego of a couple of NT people.

The recording a video where the child can talk about something they are comfortable with may be a good compromise, certainly through the child's point of view. It would certainly show up if the relatives have the child's best interests at heart.

Your update at 11:44 reminds me of when DS was a toddler; if one of us went away, he would refuse to give us eye contact for some time after as part of his emotional response to dealing with missing people.

I don't force my children to talk to my parents either, with the result that one talks to them a lot, one sometimes and one never. I don't think it's in any way right to force a child to facetime or video call or even chat on the phone, just as it's inappropriate to force them to hug or kiss a relative or family member or family friend or to make them stay anywhere they don't want to overnight.

@anothernotherone that's why I'm usually happy for them to toddle off and do whatever, if they don't want to then they don't want to that's just the end of it as far as I'm concerned. As much as I feel for him, and I do a bit because it must be hard to hear them tell him they don't want to talk to him, at the same time I don't really want to force them to do something they've said they don't want to do that isn't non optional (the phrase we use to tell them that it's something they don't get a choice in)

It does sound as though he's also not very good at talking to children... Especially reluctant ones, small ones, ones with ASD... Does he "host" an interactive conversation or expect them to do half or all the work? Or monologue or let the conversation grind to an awkward halt?

My parents don't follow up an initial "what have you been up to" with any questions which show they're actually interested. My mum especially just says "ah, that's nice, then starts talking about herself. Dc1 takes over the socially competent adult side of the conversation, and if he's in the mood dc3 monologues right back, but DC2 just looks completely confused, holds the phone away and says "Mummy I don't know what I'm meant to say - can you talk?"

I don’t think you should force them either OP, it will just be counterproductive. I think the pics/videos are the best idea, maybe ask them to do a picture for their dad even?