to think we really are 2 completely different cultures - the USA and the UK - just looking at the 'rebellion' taking place

[chomalungma]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8228769/Bleak-figures-China-US-economic-hit-virus.html

I know it's only some Americans. I know that it's a massive country with many many more people than the UK

But these scenes are astounding. People flocking to beaches. Protesting about lockdown.
Protesting with guns about lockdown

You just can't imagine these scenes in the UK at the moment.
Especially not the Ohio Zombie picture

It just amazes me - sometimes you think we are very similar to the USA, and then many times, you realise we are completely different.

Canada was largely a collection of British army outposts

And Canada has traditionally had a much better (although still pretty horrendous) relationship with natives

hennybeans the interesting thing about that is, you're right, Americans do talk a lot about their perceived freedom, but they're massively behind northern Europe and the UK when it comes to the Human Freedom Index, they have a huge prison population, the death penalty and no right to healthcare. How do they square that with 'the land of the free'? some US guy I talked to the other day claimed we're all paying 60% tax 'in europe'.

I’m American too like previous poster. I too think trump should be held accountable. It’s his wish washy lack of correct guidance to protect the people and continued political divide that is contributing to this.

Weeks ago I was watching the parliamentary debate on the covid 19 legislation and was so grateful to hear the different parties say that they were going to vote in favour - yes, said they had questions and the need for review every three weeks for these temporary, emergency measures BUT all parties recognised the need for cohesive action

This is not happening in USA. Predominantly it is the democratic governors who first put in place action plans. Some gave now banded together too

So you had some people in democratic rules states Object because a democrat implemented the guidelines.

Then you have the issue of trump and all the unrealistic stances and statements. He is about himself and how he appears. His only aim is the safety of the economy, not the safety of the people.

It’s my opinion if he gave firm scientific based guidelines for social distancing or lock down, then more people would follow. He could even acknowledge what some if the democratic governors did and use as examples of what other governors should do so that a united front could be shown. But he’d never do that because he has to be seen to always know everything and always be right.

I do hope history will report on trump and have him carry as much blame as possible.

@hennybeans I was thinking the same the other day about how we had to say the pledge of allegiance every morning in school (spent first half of my life in US, second half in UK) and how so many people take it to the nth degree.

I know people back home who would lay their life down, and the lives of others, to not have been to seen to be capitulating to the government. Not even 'fringe' people, but your 2nd grade teacher, your tax preparer, etc. It's really part of the culture. Probably why I left!

American news is also like Chinese news. Many Americans have little idea do what's going on outside their state, no matter about the rest of the world.

Plus there is almost a religious passion for the constitution

I see everyone is back on the beach in Florida 😯

Mark Hamill among others tweeted the point made up thread that there was a whole month without a massacre in the schools. gun sales have also rocketed.

this has been used to say that it isn't availability of guns that causes mass killings.

I am so glad I don't live in America.

and yes - religion, all the way. In this case, christianity.

I'm American but have lived in the UK since I was 21. I grew up in a very liberal state but even I said the pledge of allegiance every morning and was taught that what makes America great and different from others is our freedom. Freedom is everything to Americans and that's why even though 99.9% of Americans abhor school shootings, it is still legal to own guns. Freedom above anything else.

I'm also an American who has lived here all of my life, and while I think this might be overstating the case slightly, it's essentially correct. And there is a tiny fringe of conspiracy theorists (google sovereign citizens) who don't recognize most government authority at all. Lots of them wind up in legal trouble as a result.

@NOTANUM - well said, that is the origin of gun culture here, but it is much stronger in some places than others. I'm in New York and not only don't own a gun, I don't know anyone who does and they're severely regulated here.

In the UK, those of us who are trying to follow regulations and restrictions to the letter (ie the vast majority) get fed up of the stupid minority who aren't taking things seriously.

The actions of the morons in the UK pale into insignificance in comparison with the words and actions of the religious right and other nutters in the US. The dismissal of science is shocking.

I feel desperately sorry for the frontline workers and those who are trying to promote and implement sensible precautions. I don't know how they are coping when faced with such belligerent stupidity.

YABU for even considering we had the same culture. Why would you think that? Just because we speak the same language doesn't mean we have the same culture. You only have to vacation there and talk with Americans to understand that.

On the Second Amendment, the wording seems clear enough to any sane objective outside observer: "A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

In originalist terms, this can only be a reference to the formation of state militias, such as the National Guard which, provided they are well-regulated, shall include the rights of the citizens to keep firearms at home, specifically flintlock musket rifles, there being no standing army which could be used as a tool of tyrrany.

It is based on the wording of the English Bill of Rights of 1689, stating "That the Subjects which are Protestants may have Arms for their Defence suitable to their Conditions and as allowed by Law," but something was lost in translation.

"Freedom above everything else"

Pretty ironic when they are lagging behind in the freedom stakes

The US will continue as an (not “the”) economic/military global power for another century at least. But its time as world leader/spokesperson for Western values is done. It’s a decline 50 years in the making (the US working classes have been getting poorer and poorer for decades measured in real terms, quite a unique phenomenon). Madman Trump and this virus have driven the nails home. Meanwhile China’s continued rise looks unstoppable in the mid/longterm.

Part of the problem is that people are desperate to get back to works as their employee protection is so poor. People have SO little paid annual leave and with kids at home that's so hard to manage. They have no free healthcare or safety net if they're not earning. It means people often prioritise going to work over their health and almost everything else in their lives.

This is a small number of people and I think there are lots of different cultures within the US, let alone them being different or similar to the UK.

What is clear is that the US urgently needs a grown-up in charge and the world needs the US to have a grown-up in charge.

We are already in the Chinese Century. The relative decline of the USA looks strikingly like that of the British Empire in the late 19th Century, when German and American industrialisation caught up and passed it. The weaker the UK became, the more it fell back into pomp and circumstance ritual and flummery, starting with the coronation of Edward VII in 1901 when all the centuries-old traditions were made up on the spot, because the last person alive to remember the last coronation had just died.

I was surprised by suggestions before the lockdown that the UK government thought people wouldn't comply. With a few exceptions, we are generally a very law-abiding nation. We like rules. Look at our fondness for queuing correctly.

Trump's popularity is based on the economy. Without that, he is nothing absolutely nothing. So the economy has tanked, and what's a few hundred thousand lives to get it moving back up. He doesn't care for other human beings one iota. Just the economy. Hence his banging on about getting the country back to work. It is a ticking timebomb, I agree.

But hey... that's what you get when you vote in an illiterate, mysogynistic, narcissistic failed businessman, who was given the equivalent of £413million in today's terms by his Dad and managed to go bankrupt six times. So he's not even good at business... he managed to bankrupt a string of casinos, unheard of.

If he retains his marble (I think two is pushing it) I can see the frail old Trump claiming the credit for the numerous constitutional amendments he may inspire, from clarifying the impeachment rules to electing the Prez on a popular vote, French-style.

I think
Trump has totally inflammation the situation.

It might be different if someone like Obama was still in charge, calmly explaining why the lockdown was needed.

Can you imagine if Johnson or Raab was tweeting shit like “free Yorkshire”. The bloke is insane.

Just leaving these two links

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-intellectualism_in_American_Life

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Paranoid_Style_in_American_Politics

they needed to defend themselves against native Americans, other settlers and fierce animals.

Yes, they needed to defend themselves against fierce animals but they were attacking the native Americans and trying to steal their land rather than defend themselves against them.