Poll on if you would send your (primary) aged dc back to school on 11/5

[THATscurryfungeBITCH]

Would you be happy to send your primary aged dc back to school on 11th May?

Yes - YABU
No - YANBU

Not 11th it seems too early, after May half term yes absolutely.

@Aesopfable Where is your evidence that schools have limited role in infecting others? Everything I have read that is based on evidence rather than someone's opinion says the opposite.

This letter from the NEU asks some sensible questions of the government. There is a petition you can sign. The questions are worth considering even if you don’t want to sign...

To The Prime Minister: We, the undersigned, oppose any re-opening of schools before it is safe to do so.

As a matter of urgency and certainly well before any proposal to re-open schools is published, please can you share with teachers and parents:

Your modelling of the increased number of cases and mortalities amongst children, their parents, carers and extended families, and their teachers and support staff as a result of the re-opening of schools.

Whether such modelling is based on some notion that social distancing could be implemented in schools (we ask this because many teachers think this would be a foolhardy assumption)?

Would your modelling be based on concrete plans to have regular testing of children and staff, availability of appropriate PPE and enhanced levels of cleaning - with all of which we are currently experiencing severe difficulties?

Whether your modelling would include plans for children and staff in vulnerable health categories, or living with people in vulnerable health categories not to be in school or college?

Your latest evidence on which people are most vulnerable to permanent consequences or death from the virus, for example the evidence of the impact on those who live in crowded accommodation, those with different comorbidities, those from different ethnic groups and of different ages and both sexes.

Are you developing plans for extensive testing, contact tracing and quarantine in society as a whole?

Teachers see that countries successfully implementing such strategies have many fewer cases and many many fewer mortalities than we do in the UK. Would you intend these plans be in place well before schools are re-opened, which seems essential to us?

If you are not developing such plans what is your overall approach and is it dependent on an assumption that those who have had the virus are then immune?

Can you join me and take action? Click here: actionnetwork.org/forms/open-schools-when-it-is-safe?

Thanks!

Michael Carter

NEU District Secretary

@PicsInRed I know you are in the - we should all get it camp. But the government is saying 4% of the population have been infected. Over 12,000 people have already died. You are happy to accept the thousands more deaths that will happen?
Personally I think once covid 19 becomes endemic in the UK, that we may find other countries refuse to have UK citizens enter until there is a vaccine.

I'd potentially be okay with it - but need to consider what the next two weeks look like first obviously.

However, unless all kids are allowed back normal school hours, plus breakfast/after-school club then I can't see how it'll actually help many people get back to work. There really are very few of us working parents who have a school hours only job; most of us need wraparound care to be open too so that we can manage the commute to and from work. Without the wraparound care we won't be able to get back to work 'in person'. So far no talk of wraparound care opening. Also I've noticed, nothing about private sector childcare opening such as nurseries which are just as important in terms of childcare for working parents.

I'm lucky in that I'm WFH at the moment, and can do my whole job from home without issue. But a lot of others can't and do need to be present in the workplace for more than just school hours.

Agreed Quartz2208. If that date is correct then it will be a gradual reopening. There is absolutely no way that on 11th May all children will go back en masse into full time school.

No.

We have two on the shielding list here including my 12 year old son.

We won't be rushing out once our 12 weeks shielding are done and lock down is lifted. We will hold back until it feels right.

We will all get coronavirus and must get it, otherwise we will be a vulnerable country from a national security standpoint
What?!
If we all got coronavirus, even spread over a long period of time, that's condemning 665,000 people to death at a minimum - possibly many, many more.

There are dozens of countries working on a vaccine. The initial research on the virus has already happened. Presumably as time goes on there might be more things to make the symptoms less too.
We don't know where we'll be in the next couple of months. What's the point in rushing to let people get infected right now when we might have a vaccine by Christmas?

Yes probably.

Also there were initial reports from China that this infection could cause male sterility. Are our teenage boys at risk of this? I suspect no one knows.

I don't understand why the Op refers to 11th May as a possible reopen date.

11th May is when the schools are expected to go back in France. My understanding was that they are ahead of us in terms of the pandemic - & their figures include CV 19 deaths outside of hospitals and therefore not directly comparable to our own rates.

How would they know though @alloutoffucks?it's such a new virus ?Are they basing that on similar virus,s ?

@duffeldaisy I agree. What if it is your 60 year old dad who dies, and one month later there is a vaccine that could have saved him?
Or even a better treatment that could have saved his life? Treatments are being looked at. Because at the moment the only treatment is to support breathing. But medics are learning all the time how to better treat patients so more survive. It makes zero sense to be in a rush to get this virus.
And if it really was true that everyone is going to get this, why are we even using PPE? There would be no point. Or alternatively let 80% of staff use PPE, let the other 20% get infected, and after 2 weeks let another 20% of staff not use PPE and get infected, and so on. The fact that all medical staff including senior consultants want PPE to use, shows that they do not think it is inevitable they have to get it at some point. They think it is worth trying to not get it at all.

Yes he goes already so makes no difference here!

Has anyone actually looked at the Office of National Statistics and Nation Records of Scotland monthly and or weekly death rates? Here's some links

www.nrscotland.gov.uk/statistics-and-data/statistics/statistics-by-theme/vital-events/general-publications/weekly-and-monthly-data-on-births-and-deaths/monthly-data-on-births-and-deaths-registered-in-scotland

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

Might help put into perspective for some how this is affecting the average death rate.

No idea
Depends what it all looks like on 11/5 🤷🏻‍♀️

My youngest is on the 12 week shielding list so can’t go back in May.

@x2boys About male sterility? I don't know if it was based on similar viruses or not. I just remember hearing all about it and nothing since. It may not be an issue. But I am so aware that we know so little about this virus and any long term impact.
So for example cat flu which is a covid virus - when cats get this and recover, the virus goes dormant. One in 20 of those infected cats will at a later point have the virus reemerge and they will probably die.
Could this happen with covid 19? Maybe unlikely? But we don't know. We simply have not got a clue.
And this is what I find so alarming. The blase statements that everyone needs to get it so we can get back to work, when no one has a real clue what we are dealing with. I saw an interview with a scientists working on research into covid 19, and she said she wished they had known 8 weeks ago, what they know now. She was talking about a vaccine. Things could change relatively quickly. Seems foolish to me to panic and send all kids back to school given all the above.

@alloutoffucks
No the reason NHS staff are using PPE is so less people are off at any given time. If the let 20% of the NHS staff get it thered be a massive strain on the NHS to deal with anyone coming in sick.

PPE is used to delay not prevent.

On the whole children are low risk of getting seriously ill and some of the worst affected by lockdown in terms of development and learning and potential abuse in the home, so as a group they have a lot to gain from going back to school. Clearly for some children with severe health needs that are shielding this is not true but policy has to do what is best for the majority and for children that is for school to open.

Teachers are different , different age populations and risk factors. For teachers going back is of little benefit and increased risk at present, however longer term if wages cannot be paid then going back to work will become important. This risk can be mitigated with PPE, spacing of children, non child facing jobs for the most vulnerable, shielded teaches working from home, increased cleaning etc

With regards to the wider country there are positives and negatives. Community spread from Children going to school is an unknown, may be beneficial to get a second peak before autumn, may be a disaster. Could be mitigated by more use of busses and children walking to school alone - maybe supervised by older children? Economy wise to get much of the workforce back in work and start making money to pay for all of this social care and stuff needs children back at school and childcare.

Medical wise, if and this is all speculation this disease works a bit like chicken pox, having it younger may mean that children are less likely to have it severely when they become older. Also with the Spanish flu those that got it in the first wave were “lucky” as the second wave was a lot worse.

Conclusion on the whole lockdown is harmful for the majority of children who have the least to loose from getting the virus but beneficial to the vulnerable and elderly who are much more at risk.

@Buttons44 The ONS data has just been published for the week when deaths from covid 19 were a quarter of what they are now. Matt Hancock has said we may have not hit the peak of deaths. So seems foolish to reassure ourselves with out of date figures.

This may be being ‘reported’ by numerous sources, but it’s speculation. And if it does happen, it’ll be a gradual reopening, not a blanket ‘everyone goes back to school’. And of course if you really don’t want your children to go back you have the choice to homeschool. So no one needs panic unduly.

I think making it optional would be the perfect way to spread the infection rate. I’d send mine back today but we’ve already had it so we wouldn’t really effect the balance. I’m sure there are others who are happy just to get on and catch it, the more low risk people we can get through the eye of the needle the better.

Plus of course most schools (not all) are still open. So it will just mean gradually allowing more pupils back. Maybe from the 11th May, but no one knows.

Yes, I think the impact on their health and wellbeing of being stuck at home is damaging to be honest. They've got a lovely home bit it's not normal to spend so long in isolation, I don't want them growing up fearful of the world. They didn't get coronavirus in the months they were at school, I think people's movements are far more restricted so even if they go back to school it won't be as risky at before.