To think policing is pretty poor in this country?

[EasyPleasey]

I'm sure there are lots of excellent and well meaning individual police officers. However, my dealings with them in the past decade have been:

1. Reported a sexual assault. CCTV available, public area. Case closed not investigated.

2. Reported a burglary. Very likely suspect told to them, they didnt investigate, they didnt have time, case closed.

3. Spent ages writing to them about suspected fraud on a now deceased person. Never followed up by police.

4. Reported a fraudulent car sale/theft complete with names and addresses, nothing done.

5. Reported regular criminal damage to private property, some teenagers smashing outdoor lights and garden furniture in my road, £1000s of damage. Police said it's worse in other areas and did nothing.

But now I see police loitering round Tesco enforcing that one puts 'non essential' socks in their trolley, harassing people for using their front garden, I think where did they find all this time? Maybe a lot actually enjoy having the power to order people around, but solving crimes isnt a passion for many of them?

DS2 is a "Special" and has been for 6 years, he would make an excellent cop but would not be able to live on the salary offered. He is single (36 years old), so no family to support and pays a mortgage on a one bedroomed flat.
I think that it must be very difficult for the police especially in areas with high housing costs.
Maybe after this pandemic dies down the reassessment of what we pay the emergency services should be seriously considered.

Super, let’s have ANOTHER police bashing thread. Teachers’ turn again tomorrow, no doubt.

All the incidents mentioned in your OP would have been presented to the CPS, who decide if things will be followed up/prosecuted. The police, as you do not seem to realise, do not decide what gets prosecuted. Individual officers are as frustrated as you seem to be, they get thoroughly pissed off when the CPS says ‘No, not enough evidence to proceed, too costly, we’re dropping this’, when an officer may have had this on his caseload for months and is chasing it up constantly.

But now I see police loitering round Tesco enforcing that one puts 'non essential' socks in their trolley, harassing people for using their front garden, I think where did they find all this time

FML, both incidents were apologised for by the Chief constable. Over zealous inexperienced officers, in the opinion of the officer sat next to me. Crime does not happen consistently. After 3am this morning, there were no calls in virtually all of Hertfordshire, which amazed all of the teams working. However, the night before, my Dh, as I’ve already mentioned, talked someone down off a bridge over the M25 and responded to various domestic violence incidences. But yeah, he’s a power crazy lunatic, like ALL police, absolutely loves pushing people round.

I’d love to know, OP, how many officers you personally know, because I bet it’s very bloody few.

@DianaT1969. She gave those 5 examples and said they were from the last decade. Not 'recent'.

No matter what the police do or who they arrest, unfortunately there’s nothing to be afraid of from committing a heinous crime, whether it be drugs, assault, burglary, even carrying a knife. Absolutely no deterrent.

Also if the police gave me a clip round the ear and took me home my parents would have been mortified and given me an even sterner telling off. Nowadays the parents are more likely to go to the media about how their little angel couldn’t possibly have done that and sue the police for being heavy handed.

It’s thankless for them.

Police can "have a word" based on an unstatemented report, give "advice" where a crime isn't actually being committed, the legislation isn't actually breached (though the spirit of it may be) - for coronavirus lockdown

I see what you are saying sounds very sensible but if you think it through, could I phone the police to 'have a word' with DH because he has lost his temper, frightened the kids and is an arsehole. Well, that would keep them busy for sure.
They can't just have a word because someone's phoned them up.
Unfortunately if the courts aren't supporting your wishes in a way that, in your view, protects your DC you cannot just get a big policeman to have a vaguely threatening word. Maybe 30 years ago but not now.
What does your solicitor say? Do you have evidence of ex's behaviour.

Police can (and are expected to) pursue crimes of domestic abuse even without victim support - where the evidence exists to do so. Words of advice should happen (in my force anyway)onlyfor cases where there are no offences established (i.e. a verbal argument without any elements of coercive control).

It's completely counterproductive though. It means that minor crimes are "advised" and the aggressor hopefully backs off, whilst domestic violence victims have to be willing to drag themselves through full scrutiny on the victim (with little chance of success, or as I was told, him ever even being spoken to) to access assistance.

Surely, it would make more sense to have a stern word, if that's what the victim wants - as you've stated does occur with other crime e.g. ex friend slapped in face or shoplifter.

Surely it's better - and less harmful - to do something, than nothing. As "nothing" allows a perpetrator to believe that their behaviour is fine and sanctioned by society.

It does seem that DV victims do have a higher bar to meet in order to receive assistance and that this is official policy.

So that's the answer. The policy needs to change.

It’s thankless for them

Unfortunately, @Abouttimemum is correct, it is thankless, frustrating and exhausting. This is why so many people leave or try to progress as fast as possible to other areas which don’t involve contact with the public/directly arresting people.

@TomHardy - have you personally experienced 5 crimes against you in the last decade, in which the police response was found lacking in all 5? No? How many have you experienced? 1 or 2?
She's clearly in a crime hotspot.

What does your solicitor say? Do you have evidence of ex's behaviour.

Nothing to be done. Yes.

I'm just waiting for my child to grow up. That's our only way out.

@PicsInRed, what I felt when I reported being brutally raped was, luckily, being supported and heard by the police. Please don't just throw rape and DV out there like that in a reponse to me; you've got no fucking idea what I've been through. I'm sorry the police weren't unsympathetic bastards towards me and helped support me through one of the worst times of my life. And, yeah, I will always be grateful to them for how respectfully and kindly they treated me. I'm sad for you if you were on the receiving end of crappy treatment by them.

The police don’t make decisions about Pursuing cases the cps does

What's a police officer? Is it one of those people telling off people on beaches recently? Can't remember what they are like. Haven't seen one in rl in years and I live on the outskirts of a large city.

The cps make the decision on court they dont make the decision to investigate or not thats up to the police to do or not do

@DianaT1969 Yes I have, but that's due to my line of work. Also had some great help from the Police who were as pissed off as I was at the CPS failing to take it forward and some great results from Police AND CPS which resulted in conviction.

Plus, OP didn't say she was the victim of those 5 crimes did she now? Or that they were crimes against her? She said she reported them, not that she was the victim of all of them. In one she was quite clear the victim is dead and in another it was criminal damage in her street, not of her property. So you're either not reading properly or being disingenous to suggest she must live in a 'crime hotspot to have 5 crimes committed against her in the last decade' when that wasn't what she said at all.

I've also been a victim of other crimes or witnessed other crimes that I didn't even bother reporting because the Police Forces themselves have been open about not being able to investigate 'low level' crime and at best, you'd be given a crime reference number so you can claim on your insurance.

You don't need to be in a crime hotspot to be a victim of/witness 5 crimes in 10 years.

“FFS. Don't blame the Police, blame Government. The police can only do so much, as flippant as that sounds“

Yes of course they can only do so much. They are that busy they make up laws.

How is that the government’s fault?
If we aren’t allowed to talk about these issues openly then how would people know?

We all talk about issues in school and nhs. There it is and has always been evident this is down to funding.

But police making up their own rules, harassing people, intimidation, deaths in cells etc have nothing to do with funding but with those individuals and their bosses and colleagues for doing nothing.

If we sit silently nothing gets done. There are thousands of cases spanning decades showing until the public got involved nothing was done.

It is corruption running rampant. And yea I suppose it is the government. They should have sacked all the corrupt ones long, long ago and as they pop up, off you fuck, cheerio enjoy the dole.

It does seem that DV victims do have a higher bar to meet in order to receive assistance and that this is official policy

I wonder how much this is influenced by the very frequent instances of victims withdrawing cooperation?
I realise of course that the reasons for this are many and complicated, but it really can't be easy for the police investigating a case to find the victim changing their mind or even blaming them for "making things worse by winding so-and-so up"

I'm sad for you if you were on the receiving end of crappy treatment by them.

"I'm sorry if you feel that way", indeed.

On the back of this thread, just had an interesting conversation with Year 11 DS, whose career plan is to join the police. He says that his age group will be more clued up on the psychology of DV than older officers as they have been taught about it as part of PD (Personal Development), so that is heartening. I did point out to him that although they may be clued up they will possibly be dealing with older bosses who aren't.

Puzzledandpissedoff

When you have to jump through hoops to get assistance, where someone slapped by their mate or shoplifted gets an instant result (a stern word to the doer), many victims are just worn down and can't push forward any more.

Many women in DV situations simply don't have the internal resources left to endure a year or two of court proceedings, especially if they're also dealing with family court and/or still living with him (because it's the family home and he refuses to leave).

Or we don't, in which case we shouldn't be treating someone as if they are guilty of a crime

Unfortunately, you do though all this sinister non crime hate incident is evidence of that as per the Harry Miller case.

Posters on this thread have been at pains to point out that there are a number of good, dedicated, Police Officers, but why do they close ranks with the bad ones, why don't they speak out against them either individually or via the Police Union? Drive the change from within, if you don't like the way you are being portrayed and the dwindling respect the public has of you then do something about it.

A few days ago a Police Officer with the College of Policing published some incorrect and misleading statistics on Twitter and when he was pulled up on the inaccuracy of these threw a tantrum, accused those of pointing out the gross errors in his tweet of being trolls, he received support from other Police Officers one of whom accused those of correcting the misinformation of being 'haters'. Seriously? You are an evidence based profession, the absolute basic rule should be to check your facts before you laud them in public.

The Police have been politicised, there are now sacred castes which the Police seem to want to protect at all costs, there should be equal treatment under the law not special treatment afforded to the cause celebre of the day.

FML, both incidents were apologised for by the Chief constable. Over zealous inexperienced officers, in the opinion of the officer sat next to me.

Who should be doing the job they are paid for and the one the public expects of them, not pontificate on Twitter. In fact the Police should largely stay off Twitter and Facebook and they certainly shouldn't be using it for political flag waving.

@Cherrysoup It wasn't just 2 incidents by 'over zealous inexperienced officers'. The Government don't have to issue a statement for 2 incidents.

In at least one force it was THE Chief Constable suggesting he'd be putting up roadblocks and his officers would be checking peoples shopping.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52245937

Do you know something, I always had the greatest respect for the police. I think it's a really tough job, and not one I'd want to do. My own father is in the prison service, so I guess I've always had a healthy respect for authority.
Then recently, a close friend called them round, to report harassment and abuse from her ex husband. I went round to give her some moral support. It had been treated like a priority over the phone, so we felt that she was going to be in good hands.
On my life, I can't tell you how bad it was. The female officer said not ONE WORD and sat the whole time gazing into my friend's fish tank. The male was out of his depth, didn't have any idea what was within his remit, blustered over his words, and generally didn't have a clue. Any action he said would be taken (which wouldn't be much, as it was 'her word against his') wasn't followed up.
It was a real life case of Tweedle Dum and Tweedle Dee. My dog could have gone in and done a better job. If I hadn't been there myself, I never would have believed the ineptitude. They inspired no confidence whatsoever.
I can tell you, it was a real eyeopener for me. The thought of a more vulnerable woman ending up with those two at her door is actually quite terrifying.

Many women in DV situations simply don't have the internal resources left to endure a year or two of court proceedings

I totally get that, Pics, but I'm not sure the police's political masters and the CPS do
Only too easy to imagine some of them saying "what's the point in spending the money if these silly women aren't going to follow through?"

Puzzledandpissedoff

That's it exactly.
They don't understand the terror and the grip that these men have - especially when you have to hand the children over each week. Its enough just having to deal with the weekly fallout from that, without court proceedings.

"Well you picked him!" - have been told this (not by police) and I think it's a fairly widespread attitude. You picked him.