To be worried about people over 70 who aren't really taking COVID seriously

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I'm really worried about friends and neighbours over 70. They seem to be the ones who are still out and about, going for papers and pensions, refusing offers of help and generally not wanting to make a fuss. I'm sure they think old people are someone else! How do we get across to them that it's really important? They also seem to think that we will all be back to normal next week !!

Overall mortality sits at about 3.4% Impossible to be accurate.
Mortality in over 70s is still ‘only’ around 8%. It increases again past 80 years.
I disagree the young are ore likely to suffer. There are plenty of poor elderly who need to continue to work past seventy to survive. There are plenty of elderly who are at increased risk of mental health difficulties due to isolation. Most young people are not living alone.
There are jobs a plenty at the moment for young people to tide them over - Care work, driving, fruit and veg picking, retail. Might not be what they want long term but I suspect getting themselves an income and supporting the current situation through work will improve their prospects longer term. The employed older people are going to find it much harder to find work if they have been made redundant.

Youngsters education can continue apace. It’s not difficult to provide primary level educational activities and they’ll focus more without disrupting influences.
Older children can learn about self directed study as good preparation for university.

Let’s not give youngsters too many excuses. They have a moral and social responsibility to protect the vulnerable rather than simply squeals that life’s not fair. Those vulnerable are a vital part of communities.

if you personally know people over 70 not taking it seriously then remind them they are potentially infecting others. I have one relative in that category that I am refusing to speak to. They have a death wish anyway, some older people regard their life as not worth living if they cannot go outside. I've made my view of their selfishness very clear and I refuse to listen to their self justification.

All of my other elderly relatives are taking it very seriously. Some of my younger relatives are also acting selfishly - some people are selfish and others are not and it has little to do with age.

Actually overall mortality is almost certainly around 1% or possibily less (see South Korea, Germany countries where the young and fit are tested). 3.4% is the figure you get when only those presenting to health care settings are tested.

I have a friend who is 73, very fit and healthy. He is a retired pilot who flies his light aircraft regularly in normal times and has two part time jobs (one in very interesting and challenging) that takes him all over the country, and an active social life, though many of his friends live some distance from his home. He has decided not to take precautions above and beyond those the general public is advised to do. He is still going totally stir crazy, very upset and depressed that his life has changed overnight in this way. I can't quite see that he is more at risk of the virus than anyone else, in terms of catching it.I don't know anyone in my life outside work who has had the virus but in my professional life in social care there are many I know of. The main source of infection is probably visits from family who had been abroad before the lock down and, sadly, care workers who can unknowingly bring it in. I feel there is a degree of age discrimination in these comments.

Just checked 0.2 % in South Korea and 1.8% on the diamond princess (13/700) but average age on diamond princess was obviously higher.

So 1.8% on a floating Petrie dish of infection full of pensioners. Doesn’t add much to the vulnerability of over 70s argument, does it?

No I think the stats from the diamond princess are amonst the most encouraging. The lack of testing is just so frustrating.

alreadytaken

Are you refusing to speak to your younger relatives also as they also potentially infecting others? Why can't those over 70 go outside? As long as they follow the guidelines they pose no more risk than you do, or are you of the opinion that they should all be locked up for their own good?

Remember though 1/3 of those on board that ship were crew so younger than the passengers, also I have heard it said the passengers were possibly healthier than average. Also sadly probrably low BAME.

Youngsters education can continue apace. It’s not difficult to provide primary level educational activities and they’ll focus more without disrupting influences.

Yes why did we ever bother with schools, lets go back to the 1700s and stop the state providing education to children, it's clearly not needed

There are jobs a plenty at the moment for young people to tide them over - Care work, driving, fruit and veg picking

Wow, how generous of you. So empathetic. Don't know why people are crying and getting suicidal about losing their livelihoods, all they need to do is get on their bike and start picking strawberries from the fields.

Honestly, I don't understand how people can be this heartless to their younger family members and friends

I think we need to not patronise older people. They gave a lot of life experience and that is informing their behaviour. In many ways I think being towards the end of life will make them appreciate quality of life vs living forever.

They will have seen lots of friends and loved ones die over the years and are maybe not as scared if death as the young. Having watched someone dying of terminal cancer, I personally feel there are worse ways to go than covid.

According to the National Police Chiefs' Council two thirds of the fines for lockdown breaches have been handed out to white males aged 18-34. Assuming the police aren't nationally turning a blind eye to older 'transgressors', it doesn't seem like the over 70s are the main problem.

If you think that suggesting that some young people might spend a few summer weeks helping with food production during a national emergency, is heartless, don't be surprised if the word 'snowflake' is used. Fortunately plenty of people seem to be able to cope with the concept and are volunteering for driving, care work and, according to the 'Feed the Nation' campaign, fruit and veg picking.

“I hate the 'old people don't understand' line. Of course they understand, people don't suddenly become stupid because they are old.”

Whilst this is true, it's also true to say that this is the age group where you are more likely to see onset of deterioration of brain function. It's possible that some of these older people are not quite grasping the situation as well as they might ten or more years earlier, in addition to possibly feeling that they'll take their chances as they've had their "three score and ten".

I wouldn't say that they are the only ones to be going out more often than they need to though, it's definitely unfair to say that. Where I live there is a widespread range of ages going out and pretty much all of them (that I have seen) have given other people a wide berth, regardless of the age group. I do think if you are sensible when you go out, and follow sensible rules - avoiding touching things unnecessarily, avoiding sneezing/coughing into the atmosphere, using hand sanitizer and washing your hands - then you are unlikely to do harm.

Having said that, I do think that if people when going out went by the premise that they should behave as though they are infected, rather than behaving like they know they're not, we'd reduce the rate of spread far more effectively.

But there are always people who refuse to comply and go their own way, regardless of what they've been told. It was the same during the Bubonic Plague of 1665, it's the same now, it will be the same next time. People are people and don't change.

Heartless pocketem? Not at all......but telling youngsters how bad they have it , whilst vilifying those of a certain age is pretty heartless. Better to build solutions rather than creating a woe is me culture unnecessarily.

School children haven’t lost their livelihood at all. Home education can work very well. That’s not to say there isn’t a need for state education but rather all is not lost by having children at home and there are significant advantages particularly for the very young.

Employment is better than unemployment. I understand it’s not what people want to be doing long term but far greater dignity in picking lettuce than in sitting around complaining. Far more likely to find better work long term too.

My daughter didn’t sign up to caring for Covid patients without PPE or losing her leave or working bank holidays for no extra money or time off in lieu. She does it because needs must.

The young are not suffering more than the more aged. It’s really not a huge ask of anyone. It’s about being proportionate and adaptable. Great life skills.

The young are not suffering more than the more aged

They are according to a lot of people, including posters on here. There is this mentality of... you've had your life (even at 65 or 70!) so it's now the young ones turn, if you're 65 and suffering so what, you've been young and enjoyed it so ... tough. That is the ageism on MN that I deplore.

@CherryPavlova

How about you go and try picking lettuce first

What's so wrong with picking lettuce? The country is desperate for manpower. My youngest DD, if she had been furloughed, was going to do it. As it happens they've kept her on, and she's working from home.

I picked strawberries for a whole summer when I was 16, back breaking work, but I liked the money at that age.

Rousette Quite agree. And add to that the over-70s didn't have the facilities to make the most of their youth that are available now, and the age of having children was lower in that period. There was a definite belief then that you worked hard, and once you retired you would have time to enjoy yourself. And once you've reached the age to enjoy yourself, you're told "you've had your life. You should have enjoyed yourself when you were young".

MereDintofPandiculation
Absolutely.
Totally agree

@Rousette
What's so wrong with picking lettuce

Again, why don't you do it first? I'm sure you wouldn't mind working for your pension at this time of national crisis, especially as your generation apparently all died for our sins in WW2 and had to get up half an hour before you went to bed in order to work down the mines for 26 hours a day.

You may well have picked lettuce at 16. I had a paper round at 16. Doesn't mean it is a viable suggestion as an alternative career for someone that has lost their livelihood and future career prospects due to the coronavirus shutdown

Doesn't mean it is a viable suggestion as an alternative career for someone that has lost their livelihood and future career prospects due to the coronavirus shutdown

I don't think it was being suggested as an alternative 'career'...

Again, why don't you do it first?

Because I'm in my 60s, because I did this sort of thing when I was in my teens . I don't have an old age pension by the way, not old enough yet. Your hate of my generation, is pretty obvious. I imagine you are one of the MNers who begrudge anyone getting an old age pension.

Of course it isn't a career, no one said it was. It's a short term stopgap whilst the country is going through difficult times, one summer doing that is not so awful.

Because I'm in my 60s

Ageism!!! Mumsnet please delete this ageist post

Just because someone is in their 60s doesn't mean they can't pick lettuce. How offensive to old people. Disgusting

Oh you're so funny. Lolol. Can't keep up with you!