To think that we won't have a total lockdown because the Govt needs people to keep catching C-19

[KittyRainbow]

I keep seeing people desperate for there to be a full lock down. With the army on the streets and people being arrested for being more than 50m from their homes and I wonder if I'm missing something?

Everything I've heard from the Govt so far indicates that they are not trying to stop the virus, but rather limit the number of people who have it at the same time. So they actually need people to be out in limited numbers to continue the spread in a managed fashion.

In fact I'm getting the impression now that they are surprised at how well people are following the rules. And that the police are, in some cases, being over zealous in their reaction to people out and about. Which makes me think they actually expected more people to bend the rules and spread the virus a little more freely.

So I don't think they will introduce more or tighter measures to keep people indoors as it would actually be counted productive and increase the risk of a massive spike in cases when the current rules are relaxed.

I agree with the OP. If there had been a complete lock down and there were still so many deaths because of the lack of PPE in hospitals and the lack of testing available for healthcare workers, then it would be too obviously the government’s fault.

The way, with lockdown lite, when there are too many deaths, the government can blame the public for sunbathing and taking too many non essential trips out.

Macaroni you do make me giggle.........

You and people know absolutely nowt about me or my circumstances. Would I shield and send my children to school- of course I bloody wouldn't. Defeats the purpose of shielding

Assumptions are strong on here

The problem will be that the ones who are dying will be the health workers and school staff who we need

*The number of new cases it’s what’s important and that’s been steady (ie not rising) for 8/9 days now.

What do you mean? That the number of new cases each day has been steady?*

Yes - look at worldometer or the gov.uk Coronavirus tracker and you will see that for over a week now the number of new cases each day has been around 4.5K - couple of days higher, couple of days lower but overall, pretty steady. There was a big jump yesterday but that was because they included key workers and their families, who weren’t included before or something - the info is there.

A sports club I belong to has obviously been closed for three weeks and I haven't been in contact with others from there. Spoke to a friend who is a member there yesterday and was surprised to t find that pretty much everyone we know there had had symptoms in the past few weeks -all recovered, no one hospitalised. Nowhere do any of those appear in any stats. All under 50 and relatively fit.
In the absence of testing it would surely be possibly to put somewhere on live where you could report where and when you had symptoms and that days could feed into a better estimate that the medical bumpy on tv the other day who said he had no idea but would guess single figures / used /not.

What do people mean by saying we have lockdown lite? Germany for example has weaker restrictions.
What would make it a stronger lockdown? People need to be able to buy food.

Stella there is a symptom tracker app. it asks you to record if you're well or ill

@Stellamboscha
covid.joinzoe.com/

There is an app. Please use it daily. We all should be

Spread the virus more freely? At the manageable rate of 900 deaths a day do you mean? Where it might take 18 months to find a vaccine that’s 500,000 manageable deaths, with some 2,500,000 others directly affected by the loss of income etc. You are talking of major disruption to the economy in that scenario and an NHS that it likely to be torn apart.

Sorry to derail thread, OP - but I was just looking at the ‘how many cases are there in your area’ tool on the BBC website and thinking surely they can’t be accurate? If confirmed cases are only confirmed if someone is in hospital, then surely the numbers where your local hospitals are based are more accurate? For example, I live in Staffordshire and the number is 829. However, our closest hospital is part of the university hospitals of Birmingham - and local cases in that area are showing more than double - around 1700...

@YouTheCat herd immunity works just fine when immunity is achieved through infection rather than vaccination. I assume that you mean that the former is only temporary?

What people need to understand is that poverty kills people too and recessions can cause that. The virus isn’t going to go away, the best the government can do now that it’s in the country is avoid unnecessary deaths caused by inadequate healthcare. The purpose of lockdown is to prevent overcapacity thus avoiding unnecessary fatalities. However, it is important to get back to business ASAP to avoid excess suffering caused by economic downturn.

Just look at China. They went to extreme measures to lockdown but seem to have decided to lift restrictions in an attempt to avoid recession knowing full well that it is too soon to be sure of eradication (especially given that the figures reported by regional authorities are not reliable). They’re risking waves of severe outbreaks, probably because they’ve realised that poverty threatens more lives than the disease. Obviously Britain is in a better position than China but it’s not immune to recession by a long shot, especially if it pushes ahead with brexit.

All those who cry that x number have died today and insist on full lockdown need to ask themselves just how much will this cost. How many will die as a result of hunger or homelessness? How many will die because there isn’t enough money to fund the healthcare that they require? How many young people will find that their careers have ended before they even began? How many children will grow up in under resourced households? How many people will find themselves retiring in poverty? The effects of lockdown don’t end when restrictions are lifted.

Apparently WHO is investigating reports that people recovered from CV19 are testing positive again. Hope this is some testing or reporting error.

Mers wasn't stopped

www.emro.who.int/health-topics/mers-cov/mers-outbreaks.html

Please stop saying UK is on lockdown lite. As someone has said we are on a stricter lockdown than some EU countries including Germany which has had more success at reducing infections than us.

In Germany and Denmark for example children can play with neighbours. People can meet in groups of under 10.

The media hysteria around people using parks gives a false impression. In fact we are under a very strict lockdown and the vast majority of the UK has completely restricted work and social activity

Central London is deserted. Planes have stopped 95 per cent across UK. Transport same number

It makes me furious the media is misrepresenting as the lockdown has a very negative social and health impact and there is no evidence that Italy and Spain made wise decisions in stopping children exercising.

In Italy the mafia have stepped in to help feed families left destitute. Children have not had sunlight and air for three weeks.

There will be a huge fallot from the unnecessary removal of this and it needs o be balanced against the virus.

@MilkTwoSugarsThanks this is what I keep saying! But keep being shot down! At the minute there is no distinction between the two and god knows if we’ll ever find out the true number

Please stop saying UK is on lockdown lite. As someone has said we are on a stricter lockdown than some EU countries including Germany which has had more success at reducing infections than us.

I keep hearing people who keep calling for total lockdown and think only medical staff should be working, yeah just medical staff, they don't like it when you point out that all infrastructure will go off, food won't be getting produced ect, these are the same people who would complain if their bin didn't get emptied.

Each country is different and you can't compare lockdowns in different countries, We really cannot go into a much tighter lockdown as a society in this country to be honest.

In parts of Germany you're allowed to have friends over for dinner for example.

@Reginabambina

The effects of lockdown don’t end when restrictions are lifted.

Covid-19 will not end when restrictions are lifted either.

Our economy is already down about 12% which will lead to cuts to education, nhs, care services etc - that’s in one month.

We really need a good exit plan and fast.

Newgirls It doesn’t need to lead to cuts. That would be a political decision. Government debt isn’t like household debt and we’ve treated it as though it is for too long - that’s part of the reason the NHS is in such a poor state to cope with this pandemic.

I keep hearing people who keep calling for total lockdown and think only medical staff should be working, yeah just medical staff, they don't like it when you point out that all infrastructure will go off, food won't be getting produced ect, these are the same people who would complain if their bin didn't get emptied.

Indeed not. They are also the same people who will complain about the economic and social effects of the lockdown afterwards - the inevitable recession, which may be accompanied by mass unemployment, tax hikes, a house price crash and reduction in our standard of living. All of which will be worse the longer the lockdown continues.

At the end of the day lifting or relaxing the lockdown is more a political decision than a scientific one. I don’t envy the government making that call. But they shouldn’t imagine that the hysterical people shrieking for tighter lockdown measures will still be on their side in 6-12 months’ time. The public have short memories, and in a year’s time the same people who are calling for the lockdown to be tighter will have lost their jobs and will be saying they knew all along the stupid lockdown was an overreaction.

Cardi - is this continues for months I don’t think not having cuts will be an option?

Where will the money come from? Even banks are struggling having already paid shareholders and now have falling profits. In an ideal world the government would prioritise money to nhs, education etc but there will be so many more calls on money eg more UC, furlough salaries etc

Agree with monkey nuts - lockdown seems fine when you have a partner with a job, savings, furlough pay but that can’t be relied on for many more months

People saying they won’t go back to work if lockdown is lifted, how will you pay for food and rent?

It terrifies me that people want stricter restrictions.

A WHO is investigating reports that people recovered from CV19 are testing positive again. Hope this is some testing or reporting error.

Those reports have been around since before we started deciding on our policy. There was some discussion about whether it was a testing issue, whether the illness might be biphasic or whether it’s possible to catch it more than once. IIRC coronaviruses don’t necessarily give long immunity.

It’s difficult to see what a good, fast exit plan would look like at this point.