Furlough

[houselikeashed]

Sorry if I'm being dim, but I don't think I understand.
What os so bad about being furloughed? As I understand it, you get 80% or £2.5k salary, and your job back when this is all over. Is that wrong?

We have furloughed our staff (small business that DH and I run).

We have enough money in the bank to pay the bills for 3 months. And that's with the Government getting the funding available for wages.

Any longer, our staff won't have jobs to come back to. We literally have no income into the business. It's terrifying and making want to punch people who aren't taking the isolation seriously.

surely being furloughed on 80% is better than the alternative of loosing your job? Or not getting any income whatsoever?

Yes it's better, but competitive suffering is not pretty and doesn't help anyone.

The advantage of furlough is that you can get a second job while on furlough so you could effectively get paid twice.

I'm pretty sure you can't.

I'm desperate to be furloughed!

I'm currently off as I'm in the shielding group of extremely vulnerable people so I've been told not to work by the NHS/Government.

However my employer still has work available which cannot be done at home.

They say they cannot furlough me as the guidance says: "You can claim for furloughed employees who are shielding in line with public health guidance (or need to stay home with someone who is shielding) if they are unable to work from home and you would otherwise have to make them redundant." Their argument is that there is work for me to do so they're not making me redundant and I'm not working because I have chosen to stop off.

My argument is that I haven't chosen to stop off. I've been told by the Government that I must stop in my house for 12 weeks to protect my health.

There is no company sick pay so I've had to put in a claim for benefits. I used my savings up last year as I was off sick twice for major surgery and needed the money to live on. This is my third "rainy day" in a short space of time and I don't know how I'm going to survive it financially.

Of course it’s much better than nothing but no one is saying that. Are you actually hearing people complain about the situation?

Although it’s not in the spirit that the government intended initially, you ARE allowed to work. A lot of the people redirected into second jobs are backing up the NHS or supermarkets etc that are keeping the country going. Initially the gov thought it better people stayed inside without needing to work.

You can get a second job on furlough. You just have to be be ready to pack it in with no notice if/when your original job wants you back.

I'm furloughed as of today and it really doesn't feel good.

Hopefully, I'll have a job to go back to as it's a very prominent company but I've only just started so who knows. I'm lucky that I'm getting two months paid in full when I'm not actually eligible for anything.

You can 100% get another job while you are on furlough, to top up your incoming money.

@userxx yes you can
See gov.uk

A furloughed worker can take another job.
If your contract allows, you may undertake other employment while your current employer has placed you on furlough, and this will not affect the grant that they can claim under the scheme. You will need to be able to return to work for the employer that has placed you on furlough if they decide to stop furloughing you, and you must be able to undertake any training they require while on furlough.

Are you sure you can get a second job whilst on furlough, that isn’t my understanding?

I have been furloughed, short term I can manage with a 20% pay cut but my real concern is whether or not I will have a job to go back to. Many organisations will just not survive or have to make huge staffing cuts and at 60+ it will not be easy to find anything else (& I cannot afford to retire yet).

My company is furloughing people on full pay but I’m busier than ever, working 12 hour days for the last few months and for the next four months at least. I wish I could share some of my work with those furloughed; unfortunately it’s not that simple with specialist roles.

dishwasher
yes, quite a few of my (high earning) friends are moaning about the pay drop, and its hard to listen to.

That’s interesting ... I’ve just re-read our company guidelines on furlough and it clearly states we may not take any other paid employment....

I am one of the three workers at my job that have been furloughed. It's an office job and they are still operating, so it's due to lack of business coming in rather than being unable to work from home.

It's not as simple as having a job at the end of it all, there might not be a job for me to go back to if business doesn't pick up back to normal. It also highlights that if redundancies were made then I would be one of the first to go, again not a nice feeling.

I do however agree it's a better situation than those made redundant or unable to receive funding.

Do they know that your situation? In which case it’s very very insensitive

Also the 80% is up to a maximum of &2500 so high earners people will have a much larger paydrop and might not be able to pay core bills

@YorkshirePuddingsGreatestFan that’s really tough

We are a small employer, of about 30 ppl, in construction/event hire & delivery so technically still able to work but most of our summer busy period went out of the window straight away. We have had to furlough half our staff but we are topping up their pay to 100% as we don’t want to lose them. We can only do that for so long. As soon as the furlough news broke all our drivers sent messages to us Effectively saying “you’ll look after us won’t you or we could just go work fir the supermarkets” as to them furlough is about 50% pay (due to overtime + bonuses) and yet with their kids off they also need to share childcare.

I’m v high risk myself so I’m self isolating, with our toddler, my hubby now single handedly running the business & then decontaminating does he can then touch our DS &me whereas I should be on full lockdown. If I do that our business fails & 33 staff lose their jobs.

We aren’t old, we are the 2nd generation in a family firm running for 30 years with staff who are 2 generations with us too. So no, furloughing isn’t the Easy option

dishwasher
I think a lot of people presume all self employed people can get help, (up to £2.5k), so the people complaining think we are all in the same boat.
I real life, I don't like saying "well that's more money coming in, than we have", so I've resorted to moaning here on MN.
I know we are lucky to earn a lot, but I don't see how we can weather this with zero income. Lots of people will love this next bit, but we're going to have to pull our asd dc out of school half way through their GCSE's. I think that hurts the most. The cars and house we can downsize, but dc's education breaks my heart.

If they are actually friends then tell them about your situation so they can understand

you cannot get a second job if you are on furlough - that is absolutely against the rules. Will be obvious to HMRC too!

This is absolutely not true. You can take on a second job whilst furloughed HOWEVER it is very likely there will be a clause in your employment contract (which you are still bound by) that says you cannot have a second job or must ask for permission before undertaking a second job.

Also, some employers have specifically stated that you can't undertake another job while furloughed however this is company specific, not a blanket rule.

I've been furloughed on 80% of my basic salary. My basic salary only makes up 50% of my normal income from work (basic salary/commission/bonus every month normally). So it's wayyyy more than a 20% pay cut for me and it's been made clear there will be redundancies on the back of this if it goes on for more than a couple of months.

And airline employees have become Tesco delivery drivers with airline support

I can't even find a temp job locally. Ridiculous.

@YorkshirePuddingsGreatestFan please do speak to your union, or failing that Citizens Advice. This is your employer not understanding/ deliberately misunderstanding government guidelines. It sounds like if they won’t listen to you, they need someone else to tell them that you are not making the decision to “stop off”, the government has made it for you.

I saw on another thread that you can take another job while on furlough. It doesn't sit right with me to be honest, because you could be earning a wage as well as recieving the furlough and doing quite well out of it.
I can see though it could help those who losing 20% of their wages will be a problem, they'll be able to work to make the shortfall up, so it's a good idea for that reason.
I checked and we are not allowed to take another job on furlough with my company.

I am grateful that the furlough exists because without this then the business I work for would have made us all redundant, there is no money coming in at all as we are ordered closed. Likely the business would have folded. This is a lifeline for them and us. However I'm losing 20% of my wages and only saving £20 a week travel, I'm spending more on food and gas/electric because I got free food at work and was at work a lot and not here to use gas and electric! Luxuries have gone in favour of necessities, and that's just fine because I'm still in a better position than with no income at all. I'm lucky though it happened now because I earned more the last couple of years, so I've got luxuries to cut. A few years ago it was a scary balancing act paying everything that is a necessity, and a 20% drop would have seen something not getting paid. And people I work with are in that situation.
I am also worried about what happens when the 3 months is over, are we going to be able to open then? Will the business be viable to open if allowed? Will anyone come through the door with money to spend or will they all be in the same boat with little to no disposable income? Will there be enough hours for me as well or will I then be made redundant?
No one knows the answers, and I don't expect them to, because how could anyone?
There's worse things that could happen than you be furloughed, but it doesn't remove all the problems and questions and the risk of losing your job anyway.