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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not be surprised that some men are still dodging looking after their own children?

69 replies

Amazemae · 25/03/2020 23:09

So often you read about some men who stay busy with hobbies or come home late from work on purpose to avoid looking after their own children. Now with lockdown I keep reading about some men who just choose to lock themselves away in the study because they are working from home and can’t possibly be disturbed for even 5 minutes. Yes I accept some are genuinely busy and can’t but its a good excuse for some to hide behind a screen.

Obviously not all men.

I feel like the lockdown will exacerbate existing situations where some men don’t pull their weight in terms of looking after children.

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Amazemae · 26/03/2020 14:42

The men in these examples who aren’t pulling their weight now were never interested anyway but the lockdown has just highlighted it further. It’s harder for men to hide now but they are inventive in coming up with alternative excuses to why they can’t emerge from behind their screens to take responsibility for their own children.

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MarieQueenofScots · 26/03/2020 15:09

YANBU OP

I still don't get the motives of the NAMALT and "women do it too" tribe.

If your partner is great and supportive, then he's not under discussion.

When discussing men as a class that automatically assumes you're not discussing every man. I don't understand why that concept seems so tricky to the MRAs on MN.

BruceAndNosh · 26/03/2020 15:20

I feel sorry for those women whose partners have the all consuming vague hobby.
If it's cycling, I'm sure all lot of the hobbyists will insist their one bit of daily exercise HAS to be a 25 mile bike ride on their own, and sorry love, the government won't allow me to take the kids out for a run round the park too, you'll have to do it.
At least the golf widows are better off, as all courses have closed. But according to Facebook , their golf mad spouses are now whacking balls into duvet covers draped over the washing line...

TwoKnocks · 26/03/2020 15:33

When discussing men as a class that automatically assumes you're not discussing every man. I don't understand why that concept seems so tricky to the MRAs on MN.

Yy, absolutely. DH is more than pulling his weight. He's just done six nonstop hours of conference calls while I worked and supervised DS's schoolwork and played outdoors with him (more possible for me as not on calls), but now he's taken him out for his daily exercise and to do a parental grocery drop for both sets of parents so I can work uninterrupted.

TwoKnocks · 26/03/2020 15:36

Sorry, forgot the point I was making, which was that I'm capable of distinguishing between the behaviour of my husband and men as a class. And, as I said above -- anecdotally, I'm not seeing a lot of equal opportunity WFH going on.

AlphaJura · 26/03/2020 16:09

@Noconceptofnormal I've got a toddler and 2 secondary school age dcs. I've got dh at home but he's busy doing a lot of DIY at the moment. I can't speak for your school, but yesterday I had an email from the head saying they don't expect us to be teachers. What the kids need most at the moment is support and a loving environment. They can learn in other ways and that's fine. They do have a bit on their app but they they are not expecting structured home schooling. I too got a bit anxious seeing people post all these lesson plans Shock. There's no way I could do all that when I've got a toddler and ds (13) has Aspergers. I have noticed though, that it seems to be more primary school age parents that seem to be doing structured lesson plans. I suppose the secondary school kids are expected to get on with it under their own steam (to be fair, my dd, yr 7, does) so I'm just leaving them to it.

Amazemae · 26/03/2020 22:11

@BruceAndNosh One of my friends is an avid cyclist due to get married soon. I was joking with him and said you can’t carry on the same with the hours and hours you spend cycling when you have kids, he replied yes I will. Says it all really.

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VegetableMunge · 27/03/2020 07:18

What was interesting to me is the dads I know and mentioned in my earlier posts aren't deadbeats or anything of that nature, and I would've said they were all pretty involved under normal circumstances. One spent a year doing the solo childcare of their toddler for a couple of days a week while his DP worked. There just seemed to be an acceptance from them and their partners that asking the male partners to have full care of the child/ren under the more straitened lockdown circumstances in which we now find ourselves would be too difficult and unpleasant, and so they felt it would be necessary to use the school and childcare places. In a way that hasn't been the case for the couples I know when it would be the woman in this position.

I think this is probably more telling than deadbeats and the facilitated continuing to be deadbeat and facilitated without thought for anything else. We as a culture just don't have the same expectations of fathers when it comes to the really hard grind. Which this is.

Amazemae · 27/03/2020 07:43

I that that is true that we don’t have the same expectations of fathers but I think these fathers just don’t want to care for their children deep inside so it forces the mothers to step up and do more as not to neglect the children.

One of my friends told me when her son was a baby and woke up crying and it was her DHs turn to wake, he simply wouldn’t ‘hear’ the crying. Obviously she couldn’t just leave the baby crying so a new pattern emerged where then she has to be on night duty. The actions of these men leave women with no choice.

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Amazemae · 27/03/2020 07:46

Another thing I notice is women often find excuses to defend the fathers agreeing that their work is often secondary, saying he is the higher earner he shouldn’t care for the child when ill or saying DC wants them. That’s fine if you set things up like that but no point complaining when you feel overworked, overburdened or the workplace are fed up because it’s the mother who has to keep taking time off for sick children.

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BluntAndToThePoint80 · 27/03/2020 08:09

My DH is a key worker (critical front line services - think coordinating efforts against covid) and he was having to go into work. We could have put both our kids into nursery, but chose not to in line with the rules. Both kids nursery age but 3 years apart so very difficult to keep both suitably “schooled” at the same time.

Despite being at work, distancing requirements meant my DH was phoning into meetings and not actually seeing many people. We discussed how I was unhappy he was going in, in terms of infection risk and the load of all childcare falling to me, after the PMs stay at home announcement and he formulated a plan for him / his team to wfh. Each now only has to attend the office for one different day each week.

The nature of his role however means that he needs to be fully engaged and “at work” during the day. It is time critical. He is not being lazy by working up there.

However, we worked out a plan so he gets up with the kids and looks after them till 8:30, then he goes to work in an upstairs room, then comes down for lunch so I can go upstairs to work for 2 hours, then we swap until 5. He will also come down to help if he does get any down time.

On his office day, he does any shopping needed.

We share night wakings. We also share house jobs. I am the higher earner but also have more flexibility in terms on when my work can be done.

This situation arose because I opened my mouth, explained my concerns and required that he work with me to get through this. People need to do likewise and not let the SO get away with being lazy. If your SO lacks the respect for you to do this, I’d be seriously considering the future I’m my relationship. That sounds a bit like he was forced into this btw, but he actually asked me what I needed to make it work. We came up with our plan together.

DingleberryRose · 27/03/2020 08:10

I’m not surprised. But l am confused why women let them get away with it and then moan about it

I am confused about why women still have children at all!! Looks bloody horrible and not only that women are expected to make the most sacrifices (childcare, body, life, career) while men are largely unaffected.

VegetableMunge · 27/03/2020 08:13

I that that is true that we don’t have the same expectations of fathers but I think these fathers just don’t want to care for their children deep inside so it forces the mothers to step up and do more as not to neglect the children.

Yeah absolutely, that cohort definitely exists. I was just talking about the ones where both parts of the couple thought it was better to optionally use key worker childcare and school places, even though the father is actually hands on generally, doesn't think looking after his own kid is babysitting etc. It wasn't a case of the woman having to step up as she was working anyway, it was the keyworker infrastructure doing it because they made a value judgement about what was acceptable to expect the father to do. It would not surprise me at all if across the country, children who are in school/childcare now are more likely to have a father at home who could care for them than a mother.

Halfeatentoast · 27/03/2020 09:06

Trouble is you don't KNOW your SO is going to be rubbish until it's too late. You can be together for years and years then get married for years and everything be equal. Then a baby is brought into the equation and everything can change in an instant. Women aren't deliberately having kids with useless men.

Amazemae · 27/03/2020 10:21

@Halfeatentoast yes I agree but often women find out how bad their SO is after having a child and then go on to have more children so their child can have a sibling then it’s no surprise that he remains to be a shitty father. Men quickly prove what kind of fathers they are after the first child.

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Amazemae · 27/03/2020 10:31

@BluntAndToThePoint80

This situation arose because I opened my mouth, explained my concerns and required that he work with me to get through this

That’s wonderful that opening your mouth worked for you but if the father refuses to make any changes then what is the woman supposed to do? She has to do more. One of my friends was ill with bronchitis, but her DH refused to pick up the DC from school as he was too busy with work. If he does parenting, he will mostly stay on the phone and not notice the DC got hurt. She has spoken up but he won’t change. Yes she could leave then all that happens is he continues to neglect them when he has them.

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MsTSwift · 27/03/2020 10:37

In our house I am the guilty one born girls sitting next to dh my study elsewhere he spent yesterday morning teaching line graphs as I decided my work more important than his. He has been nominated star of the week though

Ralphiemia · 29/03/2020 21:11

Got a stepson aged 27 isolating with us, just appears for meals does no cleaning or clearing up, his dad is ill so I am doing everything I feel so put on and sad feel my home is being turned into a student hostel I feel like staying in bed please help X. PS I am usually quite upbeat but now I just feel like quitting

Pickupapenguinnnn · 29/03/2020 21:19

YANBU. But it gets people's hackles up. It's one of the multiple reasons I don't want children because it (usually always) falls to the mother. I think many men go along with babies for their partners or have a very idealistic view of what raising children will be like. Many don't actually enjoy the reality.

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