'Essential' workers calling in 'sick'

[twinkletwinkle00]

What would you do?

My wife and I both work for businesses considered essential. She works for a bicycle company and I work for a food seller (online, specialised food so not a supermarket or anything along those lines).

We have two young children who aren't in nursery/school as we don't want them to be in contact with others if we can help it.

We're currently splitting our days and doing 3 each for our employers (one of us works on Saturday). We both work for small independent businesses with no cash flow issues, who realistically could shut up shop for a couple of months and get through fairly unscathed. Both our bosses want to keep making money which I understand but I really don't think it's fair for them to value cash over the health of their workers?

Would we be unreasonable to happen to come down with symptoms that require us to self-isolate? We could get a mortgage holiday and juuust scrape by on SSP. What would you do? I just don't feel it's right to put ourselves at risk like this. I wish our bosses would just close and take the government grant. I just feels so unfair.

Sorry if this should be in the coronavirus topic... I couldn't find it!!

@alloutoffucks thank you. Have changed some identifiers so hopefully not. Haven't made any moves to call in sick, more touring for opinion.

You calling people sanctimonious,OP, for questioning your little plan to defraud your employer and the country. You are trying to justify it by questioning the guidelines and twisting them to fit you.

Good grief.

@Springbubble912 I don't think people not getting their gourmet sweets or bike pedals will kill them!

@WinterCat definitely! We are currently self isolating because DH showed symptoms. As it’s progressed it am almost 100% certain he has a common cold but I’m having to do my 14 days. If we actually go get it in a few weeks we will have to do it again.

@Doggybiccys If their partner is not in the shielded group it is irrelevant. I hope NHS is challenging this.

@twinkletwinkle00 there may be no cash flow issues currently, but I expect that would change if the companies were forced to close and there was no income for the foreseeable future. No one can say how long this might go on.

I am a bit biased, as my dh owns a business that absolutely is essential. Some workers can stay home, others have to be in. He is not a key worker, but is going in every day as he feels it unfair to ask others to do something if he isn’t willing to do it.

I can tell you now that if he could close today and ensure that everyone was paid in full and kept their jobs, he would do so in a second. But if they let people down now when they need them the most there will be no business to come back to. For most employees it isn’t about greed.

No I do not think you should benefit from funds put aside to support people who are genuinely unable to work. as for people ‘in your shoes’, I am expected to work and it hasn’t entered my head to fake illness to get out of it. Do I wish I could stay at home and still get paid? Sure.
Also, if a family has to self isolate it is for 14 days. So what would your plan be after the 14 days are up?

Oh and one of my children has asthma.

@twinkletwinkle00 - then why not take unpaid leave now?

Also - I am in a life or death situation myself as I am in daily contact with Covid-19 positive patients, exposed to their blood and bodily fluids. I have health problems that make me of a higher risk (not the highest but still higher than most). I am very angry at colleagues who are not reporting for duty to protect their loved ones. if everyone did that, the country would literally grind to a halt and there would be angry. A life or death situation certainly separates the wheat from the chaff.

People who self-isolate/skive off work when they have no symptoms and their partner doesn't are selfish to the core.

You say you are asking for opinions but I think your mind is made up.

From the UK Gov website - With the exception of the organisations covered in the section on closing non-essential shops and public spaces, the Government has not required any other businesses to close – indeed it is important for business to carry on.

The non-essential shops and public spaces:
•pubs, cinemas and theatres.
•all retail stores selling non-essential goods
•libraries, community centres, and youth centres.
•indoor and outdoor leisure facilities
•communal places within parks
•places of worship, except for funerals attended by immediate families.
•hotels, hostels, bed and breakfasts, campsites, caravan parks

www.gov.uk/government/publications/full-guidance-on-staying-at-home-and-away-from-others/full-guidance-on-staying-at-home-and-away-from-others#going-to-work

From that, I'd conclude that the government advice is that you should be going to work (unless it's possible to do so from home).
Faking an illness would only get you a few days - and you have a lot of problems if you then went on to actually get sick.

So no - I think ringing in sick would be a bad idea.

Thank you for the responses everyone. I agree fraud is NOT the way to go, it's difficult to step back and see the bigger picture at a time like this. We may both request unpaid leave although not sure if our employers would allow this.
I normally have a lot of provision to work from home but it's not possible ay the moment due to the business responding to the crisis in a certain way (without going into too much detail!)

I think it’s a really tough one. I don’t think bike and gourmet food companies should be open/operating from offices right now but I don’t think you should lie/defraud people.

I’m a teacher in an SEMH/SEN school (1 student with two key worker parents out of 55 butvthey all have “the right” to send their kids in) and am currently quarantined due to having a fever and cough earlier this week. I care deeply for my students but I know we would all be better off at home. The fact that we are still open and I will expected to go back in next week scares me. As does the breaking news of the death of a 36 year old woman with suspected COVID-19 in my school’s area.

We run a small business with no cashflow issues, but months of closure is far from regular.

The SSP reclaim is only 14 days, and the process doesn't even exist yet and won't for months.

rather take time off unpaid and try and struggle through than out myself and my family at risk.

If this is how you feel than why did you even ask in here instead of just take the unpaid leave?

You are not touring for opinions, you're looking to justify to yourself why it's okay to commit fraud. It's not.

@GreytExpectations because it will be very very difficult to manage financially.

I don't think people not getting their gourmet sweets or bike pedals will kill them!

Resign your job and let someone else do it then - someone who has lost theirs or is a freelancer or similar. It will salve your conscience over what you have decided is the triviality of your work. Only that will be financially trickier for you, won’t it ?

Absolutely selfish, if you aren’t willing to work, then you shouldn’t be paid. There are people that have lost there jobs, been told if they want money to work for supermarkets. You must follow advice and precautions, but the bottom line is if you can work you should, or not work and not get paid, there are very few sitting around doing nothing but getting paid. Most businesses will not be able to withstand this for long. Our boss is genuinely worried about people having jobs at the end of this and is doing everything he can to keep people in jobs but there’s not enough money coming in to do that indefinitely,

@alloutoffucks...yeah you'd think. But one of them is one of the so-called nurse leaders, it makes you wonder. Its really quite sad to see some of the in-fighting that is starting now that the numbers are ramping up and people STILL don't have the PPE they need. On the one hand, some staff are staying in hotels indefinately, not seeing their families and reporting for duty/doing extra hours whilst being massively exposed. Then on the other, you have those who seem happy to desert the profession they signed up to and to selfishly lock themselves away at home for the forseeable future because their DPs mother lives with them and she's got high blood pressure. I suspect it will be challenged in the not too distant future. I think it would look insensitive to challenge people at the moment but I think it will come.

What would be your plans for the rest of the crisis, once the max period of self isolation (14 days) is up?

• We couldn't afford to take unpaid leave. I'd like anyone reading this post to put themselves in our shoes and ask yourself honestly what you'd do.*

I actually COULD afford to take unpaid leave. BUT I work in a school, we are providing childcare for key worker children. Telling a five year old that has just tripped over to keep two meters away from me is NOT possible. Providing first aid while maintaining two meter distance is NOT possible. I would definitely rather not risk bringing this thing home to my husband and autistic son. I’ve told my daughter to stay at university (where she is alone) rather than come home and risk me making her ill. I don’t WANT to be at work at all but this country is in CRISIS. Two of my colleagues cycle to school - people like them are the reason your wife is still working.

@JellyfishandShells ok yes thanks will do!

@Singinghollybob not sure. Was just thinking of the immediate rather than long term. I'm so scared.

Don't commit fraud and keep going to work unless you resign or take unpaid leave. Many of us have to continue working, it's not ideal but this crisis doesn't make it ok to lie. We are all in this together.

How is a bike essential, hardly anyone I know has one?
Asthmatics need to self isolate, healthy people are dying, with no underlying issues.
I know it's tough, my dil has just give her notice in at Asda.
She is pg and told to go back in 10 days.
Absolutely no way, they are just tightening their belts and won't starve on one income.