Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Care home demanding more money.

97 replies

Mutunus · 11/03/2020 20:40

Apologies for posting in AIBU but desperately need some advice and not sure where to post.
97 year old father in care home. He's been there 5 years. Poor soul doesn't have a life as such now, just stays in bed sleeping 23 hours a day.
Care home have now asked for an extra £250 a week to keep him, but I can't afford that.
3 other homes nearby but all charge much the same. Awaiting decision from council re; upping their contribution but not holding out much hope. Is there anything I can do to keep him there. I might have to consider a bank loan but the thought of him being there another 4 or 5 years is upsetting from a financial and quality of life point of view. Thankyou for reading

OP posts:
CarolinaPink · 11/03/2020 21:09

OP, I've been through this but I'm no expert. My father died two years ago, and I've managed to forget most of what I had to learn during the almost 10 years he spent in 'care'.

Still, if your father's savings have been used up, then I think the LA will have to pay.

Most homes have to keep in mind LA rates, although they may pretend that they won't accept them, because most of them have to rely on the LA to pay the bills. As others have said, you can't be forced to top them up. Also, not many families can afford to pay privately (i.e. with no LA contribution).

I think you need to speak to your father's Social Worker about this. Unless your father is in a particularly expensive home then the reality is probably that they're simply asking for what they expect to receive, and the LA may simply have to stump up and pay it. Could be the LA are paying below the going rate ATM.

As I've said below, I have every sympathy because I know how traumatic the prospect of a move can be. My father was on the brink of having to move from the place he'd been in for a number of years (not because of finance, but because we'd had to complain about the standard of care and so they'd kicked us out). He managed to die of pneumonia in the space of the week preceding the move, and so didn't have to go through it. I hope for better for your family Thanks

cologne4711 · 11/03/2020 21:14

I was also going to suggest CHC funding. It's hard to get but definitely worth a go.

Panpastels · 11/03/2020 21:18

If the contract is between the care home and the council which it sounds like it is, the home cannot just increase their fees. Contact the council contracts team (or equivalent) and let them know what's going on.

HavenDilemma · 11/03/2020 21:27

An extra £250 a week just for him to lie in a bed for 23 hours a day?

I don't mean to sound flippant but wouldn't be better off with a relative if he's asleep so much?

halcyondays · 11/03/2020 21:29

He needs to be assessed by a social worker to decide what his care needs are. If he needed residential care before and now needs nursing care, that might explain the big jump in fees. The LA should be paying unless he has enough money to be self funding. Some homes have a top up charge but not usually as much as that imo. Most people could not possibly afford to pay £250 a week towards their relative’s care.

HappyHammy · 11/03/2020 21:33

What reason have they given for the rise in fees. Have you seen his Contract.

PorpentinaScamander · 11/03/2020 21:36

@contentedsoul you do know that the majority of benefit claimants are in work yes?

I work in a care home. I will probably never own my own home. My children will have no inheritance despite me working until I literally had a breakdown. Sorry that I don't earn enough Angry

Fuck this country indeed with its low wages, high cost of living and shitty CMS which means too many NRPs don't contribute to their own DC.
I'm grateful we have a system that pays for those who can't pay for themselves. (You could always quit your job, default on your mortgage and then get everything paid for you if you like)

hatgirl · 11/03/2020 21:40

each time my sister and I had to battle against LA representatives determined to try to downplay our father's condition to try to remove his entitlement

I think you have misunderstood something here CarolinaPink Continuing healthcare is nothing to do with the Local Authority. If anything it's in their interests for people to be eligible for continuing healthcare as it means the NHS picks up the bill instead of the local authority.

OP I wouldn't worry until you have heard back from the council. If the care home's contract is with the local authority then they shouldn't even have approached you directly about the increase in cost. It's highly likely the local authority will agree to pay the increase. Worst case scenario is he will have to move somewhere else. You shouldn't be asked to pay a top up you can't afford and no one can force you to.

CarolinaPink · 11/03/2020 21:51

I think you have misunderstood something here CarolinaPink Continuing healthcare is nothing to do with the Local Authority. If anything it's in their interests for people to be eligible for continuing healthcare as it means the NHS picks up the bill instead of the local authority.

@hatgirl - thanks for correcting me. As I said, I've managed to forget quite a lot of the details. If you know anything about CHC, though, you'll know there is an annual review. I haven't forgotten that. Could be it was not LA who came to try to downplay my father's condition but people employed by a different government-related agency. My point remains the same, though. Did you have something to say about the point I was making other than my identification of the wrong agency?

CarolinaPink · 11/03/2020 21:54

Worst case scenario is he will have to move somewhere else.

My head spins. Here speaks somebody who clearly has absolutely no idea of what that kind of move entails 😳

Alsohuman · 11/03/2020 21:56

Nice rant @contentedsoul, that really helped.

Kit19 · 11/03/2020 21:59

OP this is a hugely complex area. I would contact your local Age UK to get some proper advice

hatgirl · 11/03/2020 22:00

My head spins. Here speaks somebody who clearly has absolutely no idea of what that kind of move entails

Do you not know what the words 'worst case scenario' mean? I literally said the worst case scenario is that he moves Hmm

I know exactly what it entails, having made many many funding applications to my employer, the local authority, requesting extra funding is made available instead of having to move someone.

WhatHappenedThen · 11/03/2020 22:01

Does your father have a property?

I’m sorry you are having to deal with this. I hope you manage to get things sorted for you and your Dads sake.

IHadADreamWhichWasNotAllADream · 11/03/2020 22:04

Contentedsoul, how could you possibly think that your rant was justified on a thread about a vulnerable 97 year old who may have to face a hugely traumatic move because he didn’t manage to save enough money during his working life? How the hell do you work out that the moral of this story is that “those who have nothing reap everything”? Because the OP’s father doesn’t sound like he’s reaping everything to me.

foodtoorder · 11/03/2020 22:07

In my experience either social services have to cover the cost if he is still classed as needing residential care or find a home that is affordable still possible move involved.
Or the price has risen as his needs have increased in which case social services should ask for a funded nursing care assessment ( this isn't Continuing healthcare) from local NHS service, if he meets the nursing needs level then the cost will be funded by NHS (not means tested) but will need to be moved to a nursing home rather than stay in residential care.
Either isn't a nice prospect at his age but if his needs aren't currently met well then it's a better outcome.
Have the home not given you any guidance on how they/you and social services can over come this?

BudgieHammockBananaSmuggler · 11/03/2020 22:10

Just being realistic, someone who is in bed 23hrs and not ‘causing trouble’ is not going to meet threshold for CHC funding I’m afraid.

PorpentinaScamander · 11/03/2020 22:11

@Mutunus sorry for my ranty reply to ContendSoul's rant.

Have the care home explained the rise in fees? And your father shouldn't really be being left in bed 23 hours per day. Although it can be very hard to get some residents out of bed at times. If I had a pound for everytime I heard "I'm 97 years old and I'll stay in bed if I want to young lady" (or similar) I could afford to buy a care home!

foodtoorder · 11/03/2020 22:19

@contentedsoul your outrage makes you just as bad as the so called "scum fucks". Don't you see the irony of what you're saying?

Our generation in the UK haven't lived through/fought in wars and quite frankly don't deserve any of the things we have in life. Your attitude and sense of entitlement to care in Your old age before you've even reached it is astounding!
I wonder if you will feel the same about your sons inheritance when your faced with making choices in your old age wether to live in a standard care home or a plush purpose built facility?
What a horrid read your post is

HappyHammy · 11/03/2020 22:19

Many residents stay in bed all day. Sometimes that is the safest for them. Maybe he has no sitting balance or needs to be nursed in bed. If his needs have changed ask for a care needs assessment.Flowers

saraclara · 11/03/2020 22:24

I don't understand why you're paying anything, OP. You aren't responsible for his costs.
It's down to the local council if he has no capital left to speak of.

My Mum's money ran out years ago. And her care costs are £6k a month! But my brother and I have never had to pay a penny.

FunnysInLaJardin · 11/03/2020 22:25

OP my mums care home tried to do this last week. We were looking at a £1000 pcm increase up to £5,500 pcm. My sister spoke to them and they agreed to only put it up by £100 pw. Enough but not as bad as it was

ultrablue · 11/03/2020 22:26

Just gone through this with my Mom, she went into a nursing home Jan 2019 on end of life plan through CHC. Social services wanted to stop paying and were happy to send her home to live with me as she had improved slightly.. her doctor was oh no I don't think so, with the best will in the world daughter cannot meet her needs, arranged a meeting with SW and CHC, CHC ruled that my Mom can't be moved regardless of Social services and a previous CHC descion. Talk to your Dad's doctor and see if they can intervene and get CHC to reassess or assess on his behalf, 4 weeks later my Mom is on end of life care again and social services were quite happy to send her home

cabbageking · 11/03/2020 22:26

Ask for a new assessment from the Council. Is he claiming everything he should now be has no savings. The home can't take all his income and he should have a amount left each week for toiletries and clothing that may provide a buffer.

whoisyennefer · 11/03/2020 22:26

It will be mainly down to the increase in NLW. There is a 6% increase in costs when paying staff. What's the percentage increase?