To fire my friend

[nadgug]

Just that really. She came in to help me one day and then assumed she had a job to fit around her childcare (2 half days a week).
Firstly, I didn't want anyone doing half days, it's too hard to fit around other staff and if the other person is sick I have no cover. I didn't offer her a job, she'd just assumed, and quite frankly, she's lazy. She spent a lot of time on her phone which left me to run the shop alone (it's not something anyone should run on their own).
I made a job list so she knew what she had to do. She still had to be asked and I ended up doing 90% of it.
She also brought her child in at half term which was fine if she was in the "designated area", obviously this didn't happen so I've now put a stop to that anyway, it's far too dangerous.
If it was anyone else I'd have let them go on the spot, I don't know how to do this without harming the friendship. I can blame the boss but I'd have to replace her so can't say it's due to cutting down hours etc. I'm really stuck. She's also been telling people she's running it with me! I know I should just tell her she's a CF and to piss off but she was quite a good mate.
(Namechanged as it's probably outing but been here a long time)

I'll get my role in writing first. I've verbally been allowed to hire and fire and have a witness for this. I've not paid anyone out of the till luckily, he deals with the actual paying of the wages

I'll be showing him all this and if he wants to sack me then so be it. I'm not being responsible. I'll fully admit I don't really know what I'm doing and just following orders at the minute

@nadgug check out ACAS for advice on employing people, contracts etc. You definitely need to ensure you're on the right side of the law.

@FamilyOfAliens true! I'd only be apologetic to save the friendship but like others have said, why should I when it's obviously a one way thing

Thank you @mallachy I will do!

Op, if you employ someone in the UK you pay them a wage, report it via rti making relevant deductions a d then paying them, you also need to give a payslip. You can pay them anyway you line as long as dues are deducted and paid andveverything is declared. If they are hired as self employed they are not employees so its a different type of contract needed and how you pay is different in the sense that they will probably bill you and how you let them go will depend on the contract. The owner really needs to step up here and back you up as you are left doing the firing when you don't seen to know the exact stance on employment in the business.

@mallachy beat me to it - get yourself on the ACAS website, they have rock solid free resources and model policies etc so you'll know your basics are covered.

This person is no friend of yours, so take a deep breath and treat them politely as if they were any other worker. As it happens, I took a job working for a friend - before I started I made them agree to a mutual six-month get-out point if either one of us felt it was affecting the friendship. My feeling was I could get another job, but I couldn't just find another good friend. I then worked really, really hard ...and still do, seven years later still there! My point here is that your person is not valuing your friendship OR the job, so don't feel you have to keep either one open to her. Good luck.

I think @Cuddling57 's response is really good, just change the words 'hired/worked part time' to 'not happy I let you help out'

Also pensions. How much are they earning? They may need to be auto enrolled. Cash is fine, but if they have no control over their hours then they are NOT self-employed!

I'll be showing him all this and if he wants to sack me then so be it. I'm not being responsible. I'll fully admit I don't really know what I'm doing and just following orders at the minute

Hopefully he will realise he is out of his depth as well (many small business owners are when it comes to things like employment law) and the two of you can work together to get everything in order.

Wage payment is cash in hand and employees are required to pay their own tax and national insurance. (I thought this was illegal but apparently it isn't! I've learned a lot of business law this week).

Where are you 'learning' this rubbish from?

This is a really concerning situation. No contracts, no h&s etc. Is there insurance, public liability, are rest breaks, sickness, slavery, adverse westher, it policies etc all in place. What about your risk assessments. Is your asbestos and eicrpaperwork in place, gas safety records etc. I would be seriously concerned what is going on here. As for designated area we do not allow children at work as our insurance does not permit this. You also need to be suitably trained undertake RA. I would be very worried what you've gotten yourself in to. You need a h&s advisor as well ad HR.

Sorry that was a bit rambling due to my astonishment on the situation.

If there is no contract to speak of, what are you firing her from? What are wages arrangements, pension enrolment process, holiday leave details etc, NI contributions and tax details etc?
Just tell her straight you are hiring on a formal basis, she doesn’t need to come in anymore but can apply through the normal channels, give her the last wage slip (or whatever you owe her as cash if that’s what the loose arrangement is) and put an ad with an agency. You’re doing her work anyway so you’ll cope without her for a couple of weeks.
Good luck and be brave!

Get rid with one of the many suggestions here. I wouldn't be so shocked or concerned about the way it's set up. It suits a lot of people.

@CalmdownJanet

So you are the manager? Look i'm not being funny but you are a pretty shit manager if you have managed to let her hire herself, do fuck all and bring her kid to work all within 2 weeks.

This. ^

@FuckYouBrexitVoters

Do you have any experience at all in running a successful business because you’ve clearly got a lot to learn about managing staff!

AND This. ^

@nadgug

You need to step up your game and learn some management skills. You seem to lack assertiveness and management skills frankly.

She needs to go, and never EVER employ a friend again.

WTF were you thinking?!

And WTF is a 'loose, verbal contract?!'

As a pp said, you have a lot to learn. Your friend can't be blamed for any of this. YOU are the manager FGS.

@TARSCOUT

This is a really concerning situation. No contracts, no h&s etc. Is there insurance, public liability, are rest breaks, sickness, slavery, adverse weather, it policies etc all in place. What about your risk assessments. Is your asbestos and eicr paperwork in place, gas safety records etc.

I would be seriously concerned what is going on here. As for designated area we do not allow children at work as our insurance does not permit this. You also need to be suitably trained undertake RA. I would be very worried what you've gotten yourself in to. You need a H & S advisor as well ad HR.

Now THAT is how a manager SHOULD sound!

I am absolutely shocked.

She isn't in trial period! She doesn't work there how can you just let someone hire themselve?
This is a shitshow I didn't think I would ever see.
No training, no H&S, no PAYE yet claims they are employees, staff hiring themselves....

This will not end well unless you AND the owner pull your heads out of your arses. Are you owner's family member or something? Why were you hired when you have no knowledge needed to run this?

Don't show your boss this thread ! Don't get yourself in trouble!
Just use one of the sensible suggestions and use your common sense and assertiveness in future!
Also read up on how to manage.
Learn from your mistakes in a positive way.
Onwards and upwards!

Surely though this is something your boss should be dealing with @nadgug - why isn't he and why has it fallen to you to sort it all out? Be careful you don't become the scapegoat in all this too, make sure your role and contract is secure. Get advice.

OP, this all sounds mad.

The owner sounds either very dodgy or like they don't have a clue how to run a business - do they not realise all the tax and employment liabilities they've created?

So you're registered as self-employed and declare your income to HMRC and your friend is doing the same? Why did you make that decision? Did that not strike you as an odd requirement for a job in a shop?

She doesn't work there how can you just let someone hire themselve?

Well, the employer is paying her so they obviously agree that she works there!

Well, apart from the usual Mumsnet unnecessary rudeness this has been really helpful. I think I'm better off getting out of there to be honest. My earnings are declared through HMRC because I knew he wasn't paying my tax. I thought this was legal, clearly I'm misinformed. I don't think it's my responsibility to fix his business, I may as well get the advice from ACAS, get myself on a business course and start my own. There's plenty of opportunity around here

@nadgug
I think you are making the right decision!!

@nadgug definitely the right decision. I think the accusation of shit manager was a bit harsh, you are obviously an inexperienced manager and learning as you go. It sounds to me like the owner really isn't running the place well and you will be held responsible as well if it isn't legal.

I would find somewhere that can help you develop your managerial skills and support you, not leave you floundering.

Good luck!