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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think checkout lady was being OTT about alcohol and child?

445 replies

Potkettlexx · 20/02/2020 15:02

In supermarket yesterday with DD 7. DD struggles at school so I let her help with shopping to get her used to the concept.

Bought some bread and small gift pack bottle baileys £5 for in-laws bday.

Got DD to scan the gift box and the bread and press the correct buttons etc... (dd Aldo has some sensory and coordination difficulties so again it helps this doing practical things)

DD wanted to pay with my card so I told her what buttons to press and gave her the card to tap on card reader. Dd didn’t really understand so I just gently took it from her and tapped my card myself.

Before I took over, dd was trying and the woman supervising the self service tills piled up ‘ohh you’ll have to be the one that pats with the card’ or something to that affect.

I was thinking.... for real?!

I get that they need to be very careful when selling alcohol....

I get that a 15 year old can look 18....

I get that an 18 year old could be potentially buying it for younger friends....

I get that they could be disciplined if they were willingly selling alcohol to under 18’s....

But for goodness sake, surely common sense would say she really didn’t need to say that under the circumstances.

After all, the reason the sale of alcohol is forbidden to under 18’s is incase they drink it and quite right.

That’s not the same as the this situation. It was clearly evident I was the one ‘buying it’ and giving my consent. Does she honestly think I was planning on giving it to my 7 year old?! 🙄

OP posts:
harrietthepie · 20/02/2020 18:45

It’s along the lines of asking a 50 year d for ID

Don't be ridiculous! Where I shop they have to click the age button on the self scanners when you buy a restricted age product no matter how old you are. When I bought alcohol once when my 15 year old was with me they refused to sell it to me because they were helping me pack away the shopping, they have to be that careful. I didn't mind as they were protecting themselves from losing their job and from a fine.

cologne4711 · 20/02/2020 18:47

I'd love to see some people on here walk into the local shop here. Everyone who buys alcohol, cigarettes or lottery tickets needs ID. Even my 80 year old neighbour

It's far more sensible than the challenge 25 thing. You know exactly where you are, you need ID for those things.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 20/02/2020 18:57

I can’t say for certain, @cologne4711, but I would assume that someone could get the sack for flouting/ignoring their employer’s policy to ‘Challenge 25’, even if the customer was over 18. The employee doesn’t have to have done something illegal, to get sacked, if what they did goes against clearly stated company policy.

PointlessAddict · 20/02/2020 18:57

Thanks @lyralalala that’s what I thought, just wondered if it had changed given some of the posts here

prh47bridge · 20/02/2020 19:00

&I bet many of them have used their partners card etc to get money but that’s different no doubt.

It is different because that is not an offence unless they do it without their partner's consent.

lyralalala · 20/02/2020 19:02

@PointlessAddict Supermarkets treat it as the law for staff. If they fail it they'll get sacked. I think a lot of people are mashing together the law and the rules they have to work by

TheCakeCrusader · 20/02/2020 19:04

Not really sure why you have a poll asking if you were being reasonable or not? You’ve clearly made your own mind up that you are reasonable and in spite of the poll favouring strongly that YABU, you don’t seem to be interested in hearing these differing opinions.

At the end of the day, this is the current legislation and shop owners/ workers can get into serious trouble/ lose their jobs. Whilst you might believe what your daughter was doing was harmless and obvious to all that she was not purchasing these specific items for herself, an inspector might view this as the owner/ shop worker not following legislation. This might well then indicate that the premises could be potentially selling certain goods to other underage customers even if they’re not.

Responsible retailers can not take this kind of chance even if you personally find it annoying/ unreasonable.

prh47bridge · 20/02/2020 19:08

A couple of people on this thread seem to have asserted that using someone else's debit or credit card with their permission is fraud. It isn't. Under the Fraud Act 2006, for the offence to be committed you must intend to make a gain for yourself or cause a loss to someone else. If you have the cardholder's permission there is no gain for you - they've agreed to give you the money. And there is no loss for them or the bank. So it is not fraud.

The OP's attempt to equate what she tried to do (which would have resulted in the shop committing an offence) with something which is not an offence at all is ridiculous.

BuggerOffAndGoodDayToYou · 20/02/2020 19:10

Give over a horrible attitude

Actually @FakeFraudSquad is absolutely right and you are being horrible to them. For all the shop assistant knew you could have been a test purchaser, or the next person in the queue could have been.

I just find it ridiculous that another customer would complain about it.

That’s not the point! For all the assistant knew you could have been a test purchaser, the next person in the queue could have been a test purchaser.

My DS has special needs and I’m all for getting children to “help” as a way of learning how to do things but not when it doesn’t break the law. What you wanted to do was against the law.

DenimDrift · 20/02/2020 19:12

she has to be seen to be asking for the ID. its good practice and is on cctv that id is produced....regardless if they went to school or not.....trading standards won't know that

we had the email today ....half term means test purchases. police and trading standards send in youngsters to try to buy age restricted goods

they like to (try) to catch us out

Eeeeek2 · 20/02/2020 19:19

I used to be in food retail management and therefore also had an alcohol licence (similar to being a pub landlord) I was also under 25 at the same time. I had to get my staff to ID me every time because that was the under 25 policy. They knew I was under 25 and therefore the were required to id me to uphold the policy which we are required by law to do.

The staff members could of been given an on the spot fine and disciplined for allowing your daughter to tap the card. There is no common sense allowed within the law.

heartonastring · 20/02/2020 19:21

You can be sacked/ fined for being caught selling alcohol to a minor. As previous posters have said she was only doing her job.
You just sound rather inconvenienced by it which makes you the unreasonable one. To have that accountability hanging over your head is tough. Why would you want to make things more difficult?

woodchuck99 · 20/02/2020 19:24

They knew I was under 25 and therefore the were required to id me to uphold the policy which we are required by law to do.

They wouldn't have been breaking the law if they didn't ID you knowing that you were the licence holder and well over 18. Don't be ridiculous.

BuggerOffAndGoodDayToYou · 20/02/2020 19:25

So you’re telling me that if a cashier served a lady she went right through school with in same class and knows she’s over 18, thus didn’t ask fur ID... that they would prosecute her? Absolutely rubbish!!!!

Not rubbish at all. When I was working in a pub (I was 21) I had to be seen to check my 22yo old DHs ID before I served him. Trading Standards are pretty hot with their checks and no one wants to lose their job just for an entitled person who simply REFUSES to understand OR obey the law.

Cotswolds10 · 20/02/2020 19:31

@Matildatoldsuchdreadfullies
😂😂😂

woodchuck99 · 20/02/2020 19:33

When I was working in a pub (I was 21) I had to be seen to check my 22yo old DHs ID before I served him. Trading Standards are pretty hot with their checks and no one wants to lose their job just for an entitled person who simply REFUSES to understand OR obey the law.

You didn't have to ID your own DH to comply with the law. It may have been company policy but don't confuse that with the law. The laws is that you don't serve people under the age of 18 and you knew he was over that age.

Willow2017 · 20/02/2020 19:36

Test purchasers can be any age.
If they do not look over 25 and you do not id them its on you. If a shop is suspected of selling to minors police will use underage kids to catch you out.
Stores can lose thier licence to sell alcohol if they are found to be selling to minors or failing to id people properly.

Can you imagine the uproar if your local shop/supermarket lost its licence and had to let go some of the staff to cut back and locals couldn't just pop in for a bottle of wine or the obligatory gin?
Guess who would get the blame? Oh yes the poor assistant who didnt guess the age right or let some kid use a debit card.

Iwantacookie · 20/02/2020 19:37

I do get why it's got under your skin op but as everyone else has pointed out it's the law.
My situation was I had I'd someone so I kept serving him. Turns out another shop was fined for serving him because he was using his brothers I'd. Didnt matter shop assistant STILL got a fine.
That's how strict the laws are around it.

Oldhaggard · 20/02/2020 19:40

They knew I was under 25 and therefore the were required to id me to uphold the policy which we are required by law to do.

They wouldn't have been breaking the law if they didn't ID you knowing that you were the licence holder and well over 18. Don't be ridiculous.

It's a mandatory condition of holding an alcohol licence to have and use a challenge policy. You need to prove you're using it. That means IDing people. To break a mandatory condition of a license can lead to sanctions imposed, loss of premises licence and a fine for the licencee.

SpottyShoeBow · 20/02/2020 19:42

She was not being OTT. She was doing her job correctly because her job quite literally relies on it. You are being massively unreasonable to expect her to jeopardise her means of making a living to accommodate you. I'm quite sure that you would not risk your mortgage to satisfy her whims.

woodchuck99 · 20/02/2020 19:45

Test purchasers can be any age.
If they do not look over 25 and you do not id them its on you.

People keep saying that but they don't provide any evidence. The only link anyone has provided actually states that they use underage which is hardly surprising. Not only that but they also tend to use people who look underage as "trick businesses, so basically, when a test purchase happens you should not doubt that the person is underage".

www.highspeedtraining.co.uk/hub/test-purchases/

ColourMeExhausted · 20/02/2020 19:48

Not rtft but my friend's mum was almost sacked for allowing something like this to happen. It was very upsetting. Yes, might seem a bit jobsworth but they take these things very seriously and penalties are harsh.

woodchuck99 · 20/02/2020 19:50

It's a mandatory condition of holding an alcohol licence to have and use a challenge policy. You need to prove you're using it. That means IDing people.

Yes but that doesn't mean that you need to ID people even if you know without of shred of doubt that they are over 18. They aren't going to remove the license because someone didn't ID their own husband or the person with the alcohol licence.

PointlessAddict · 20/02/2020 19:52

When I was working in a pub (I was 21) I had to be seen to check my 22yo old DHs ID before I served him. Trading Standards are pretty hot with their checks and no one wants to lose their job just for an entitled person who simply REFUSES to understand OR obey the law

Well my understanding is that you wouldn’t be prosecuted as it’s not against the law to sell alcohol to a 21 year old. But you may face disciplinary consequences from your employer or they may face licensing consequences for not checking ID. Unless breaching “challenge 25” is a criminal offence, which I didn’t think it was

Enko · 20/02/2020 19:52

@woodchuck99

Directly quoted from the webpage I linked to.

the police tend to use under-18s who look their age.

I will also again state I know someone who used to test purchase who was over 18 when she did it.

Now my question about if YOU personally would take a fine for allowing someone to do something you knew was illegal?

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