To think that you've either got it or you haven't when it comes to school

[blubberball]

I wasn't any good at school (obviously). I daydreamed my way through, never fitting in. Neither clever nor naughty enough to be noticed.

My older brother was very clever and good at school. Schools would thank my parents for sending him there, and would predict him doing great things when he grew up. He passed exams, went on to higher education and university, at a time when grants were still available, otherwise my parents would not have been able to afford to send him, and he now has a high status, high paid job and is happy.

My mum was clever and good at school.

My ds is 12 and seems very similar to me. Really not engaged or interested in school. Trying to get him to try harder and do his homework, and put any effort in at all. He couldn't care less.

So do you think with school, you've either got it or you haven't? If you're going to be good at school, then you will be naturally. If you're not good at school, no amount of trying is going to get you any better? I guess we can't all be good at school. I don't know.

@Vulpine why? I used to sign on behalf of my parents since about the age of 9. It’s not like they weren’t going to let me go on a field trip/whatever and it prevent the situation where we forgot to get it signed and I missed out. By the time I was in high school everyone was signing their own consent forms.

@marashino maybe it’s just the people that I know but they all seem to think that there is a lot of spoon-feeding and wrote learning going on with a very limited amount of analysis. In particular the gap between a levels and undergraduate studies seems very big.

maybe it’s just the people that I know but they all seem to think that there is a lot of spoon-feeding and wrote learning going on with a very limited amount of analysis. In particular the gap between a levels and undergraduate studies seems very big.

It must vary from school to school then, it's not the case at my DCs school. As for A levels to undergraduate my DCs said the gap was small between A levels and the first year so that must depend on the university (one at Bristol, the other at Sheffield.

Myself and my brother were very different, despite same parenting ways etc. Same school at same time.
I did really well. He didn't ( although now he owns his own business and it's thriving despite no gcses at all)

My 14yo has never ever liked school, despite all the encouragement to do well etc. I would be surprised if he gets one decent grade.. We get him to do his homework but then he doesn't hand it in ( so doing it is a pointless task) as he then gets a detention.. Just to prat about.
It's silly as he's really clever at maths but because he clashes with the teacher he doesn't work well.
DH even had an apprenticeship lined up for him as he originally said that's what he wanted to do, working with dh for 2 yrs time and then he said nah it Means going to college, I'd sooner work in macdonalds or something. No passion in learning at all.

Our 2 Yr old.. Is the opposite, she already does so much more than other 2 Yr olds in her groups and I hope she continues to want to learn as she's always getting her number game out and doing numbers erc.

I'm hoping ds changes his tune but the more we mention it the more he digs his heels in

I agree with OP. I was academic, loved reading and learning. Our ds has always struggled at school socially, academically and with behaviour. We have always read with him and done all we can to encourage learning but he finds it incredibly difficult and a struggle

@JustBecauseItWorkedForYou Blimey, your ds sounds like mine. Part of me wants to go Fine! Do what you want! It's your life, and part of me wants to never give up, and keep spending hours battling and arguing over homework.

Tbh, it's all very draining, and I feel like it's just making me ill and damaging our relationship between me and ds. Makes me wonder if it is all worth it, to pressure, push and kick him through school if he's just not bothered.

this is why so many chose or turn to home education(we HE)

the school system has been set up for years and years as a one size fits all set up

you don't fit that box then your buggered

thew hole system needs revamping

It’s not that black and white, OP. inspiring teachers, supportive parents, happy home environment and yes, natural academic ability, all play a part.

From your posts, you are clearly an intelligent, thoughtful woman, and I would have guessed at educated, in fact. Your posts are clear, coherent and accurate. Don’t do your son a disservice by thinking he’s just not an academic kid, so there’s is no point in trying. You’ll be setting him down a narrow path, with few choices, when he actually needs to pull his finger out.

I would HE if I thought that I could do the job justice. The fact is, I am not a teacher and I wouldn't be doing myself or my dc any favours. Admire any body that makes it work though.

Thanks HelloDulling. I want to keep trying.

"school" is incredibly broad. It includes learning how to

1. be organised enough to turn up on time with the right stuff in the right place, work out what you need to do your homework, hand it in, planning bigger pieces of homework/coursework etc, meeting deadlines
2. be disciplined enough to listen attentively, concentrate on reading/writing/doing ask questions to clarify your understanding, reflect on others' contributions
3. work as part of a team, sometimes as leader, sometimes not
4. give and receive feedback, learn from mistakes and be resilient through setbacks
5. digest problems/incomplete questions, analyse data, identify and compare solutions

Etc etc. These are life skills.

Yes, those are the things I always struggle with.

OP, I left school with nothing and have a low IQ due to endogamy, another thread
I am dyslexic and my school was a living hell I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.
At 38 I gained a degree then a PgCE, but I cried like a baby when I held my level 2 certificate in Maths.
We can't all be clever and it may not click into place when you are young, but it's never too late.
Your lad will do great with you behind him, but you need to be positive, I bet if you found something you really felt a passion for you could become an authority on the subject, seriously.

I hope most people have something they’re good enough and enjoy enough to make a living out of - it’s about helping your kid (and yourself) to find that thing they can build their self esteem on.

It’s hard to give your kids self esteem if you struggle with it yourself, maybe @blubberball you should think about ways you can show your dc that you value yourself and are working towards something, and encourage them to change with you.

Palavah

Please explain how a dyslexic child would be able to do that?

Detention?

I remember in primary thinking this is so boring and then looking at clouds in the sky out the window. I just had this attitude that if it didn't interest me I wouldn't learn it. But I wasn't disruptive, I was shy quiet and well behaved. I don't think anyone cared or noticed me.

My parents were very self motivated learners and just left us to it. I consider myself quite stupid due to all this. I do have a degree but I have a third.

I see this poor attitude already in my 3 year old DS, I haven't told him about me at school and I try to make learning things fun. It's all a game at three, but he's just as stubborn as me sadly.

How they would be able to do what, @GreenTulips?

Some people are naturally more intelligent, or have a particular aptitude for certain things. I had to work way harder in maths and physics than any of my other subjects, and still got my worst grades in them. My parents both have STEM degrees, so I wasn't discouraged from studying these subjects at all. I do think I'm just naturally worse at maths than at things like English.

On the other hand... at the school where I teach, over 80% of our year 11s got 4+ in maths and English. At the school nearest to where I live, only 34% did. These are both non-selective state schools, in different areas of the same town. The pupils at my school don't naturally "have it" more than their peers living 4 miles away. They do have very different environments, inside and often outside of school.

Green Tulips We learn like everyone else, We may need more support, we may need more time. I found I got most of those skills after I done my GCSE when I studied nursery nursing then uni. Dyslexia doesn,t equal impossible. (And I had a lot of support in some ways).
Also non educational activities can help organisation and teamwork.

How they would be able to do what

be organised
turn up on time
do your homework,
planning
meet deadlines
listen attentively
concentrate on reading/writing
clarify your understanding
learn from mistakes
be resilient
digest problems.
analyse data, identify and compare solutions

This^

All things dyslexic students find difficult to some degree due to memory and processing issues.

Please tell me you’re not a teacher?

Schools are pretty much one-size-fits-most. Unfortunately budget cuts and government targets (such as eBacc restricting the curriculum) are making that size less compatible for many students without interest or aptitude in a narrow core of subjects.

Some things are innate, intelligence, specific learning difficulties.
Some are environmental, the ethos of the school and individual teachers, family support and encouragement.

I've taught bright, lazy kids who were a pain in the butt because they believed they knew it all. I've taught accademically very weak kids who were delights because they wanted to do their best. It was kids being open minded and curious that made it for me rather than academic outcomes. I'd far rather have an engaged bottom set than a bunch of coasters in the top set.

DS functions through school, but it takes his toll on him. He's intelligent, and curious with the benefit of DH and I being well educated and investing into life education (culture, books, going to interesting places, chatting about a range of subjects). DS also has pretty major disadvantages of high functioning autism, dyslexia and dyspraxia. Fortunately with a background in teaching, I spotted his traits were out of sync from averages and have managed to get interventions and diagnoses far quicker than if it was left to his teachers to identify. The environment of home and his particular schools will make a massive difference to how he manages through the school system.

OP you have mentioned several traits strongly associated with dyslexia. If you decide to re-enter education, look into assessment for it. Even just knowing about specific difficulties makes a difference, plus there are strategies to play to your strengths.

OP you have mentioned several traits strongly associated with dyslexia

Get your son tested as well.

Some kids are just more naturally academic than others i think. My dd is very well behaved, always listens and does her homework, revises etc etc. She does well but some of her friends put much less effort in and do better. One of her oldest friends never really revises and gets grade 9s in everything (she's always been incredibly advanced). Nothing to do with parents being more involved or more intelligent its just a random thing. Dd gets a bit frustrated but i always tell her id rather she worked really hard and got a grade 6 than mucked around and got a grade 9.

Teachers make a huge difference though. The good ones dd has had have got her really interested and doing really well.

There are so many factors that can affect a child's learning: the teachers, the teaching, the parents, the other schoolkids, innate ability, learning difficulties, child's personality... a child who is told "you'll never amount to anything" or "you're so slow" will respond in a way dictated by their personality. A timid child with poor self-esteem may be crushed and demotivated, as they feel that it's the truth and so pointless trying; a child with more grit and a stronger self esteem may feel determined to "show them" and be as successful as they can.

I was crap at school, as only maths abilities were valued (or so it seemed to me). I was in the bottom group throughout primary as the tables were set by maths ability, although my English wasn't actually bad and my SPaG very strong. The teachers were disdainful and used humiliation and insults. They talked for long periods and I wasn't able to keep up as my brain could only process so much, so when it reached saturation point I stopped listening (not consciously, I wasn't aware of it) and thus missed a lot of information and instructions.

I ended up doing the bare minimum as it was pointless my working hard - I was thick, I knew I was as so many had told me so, so what's the point in trying when failure was inevitable? My mother was indifferent, she didn't even know when I had exams, didn't advise on revising (I didn't know how to revise actually), just didn't care. She was the type to criticise when I showed her my drawings, she doesn't do praise (unless you're the golden child, DB).

I have ensured that my child is encouraged, praised for his efforts, supported as much as he needs and goes to the schools that will suit his personality and way of learning best. If I feel something is not going as it should, I will do what I can to put that right. I will advocate for my child, as he can't do it for himself.

It's all you can do in the end - you can't do the learning for them, but you can support and encourage them to do the best they can.

I ended up getting five O grades - I wasn't allowed to do maths, I was so bad at it, but I did O grade arithmetic instead and scraped a C. I could actually have done so much better in my subjects (except maths), but at the time I genuinely believed it wasn't possible for me to do well.

Not sure success needs to be measured in results, but it is, and will always be.

I work in a school. There are some very unhappy pupils there. Results are good, mental health and happiness, not so much.

I'm not sure our system is quite right. Results are everything. But there are other ways to measure success.