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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

45 & first baby

72 replies

Everythingnotsaved · 07/02/2020 05:12

My friend is desperate for a child- they are on their 4th round of IVF and want to keep going & trying. I really feel for them and can’t imagine how painful it must be when you really want a baby.

When do you call it a day though? I know that’s none of my business but I worry that it’s just putting them through such stress & it’s false hope when she is now 45 - I think they are going for donor eggs now so think then the odds are better.

Aibu to worry- it’s all they think about & they have been trying for 7 years now both naturally & with treatments . I’d never say anything but I do wonder too how ethical the doctors are - it’s had a big impact on them both financially and emotionally. I know you do hear success stories though

My friend isn’t the same person she was 7 years ago- she’s so stressed 😥

OP posts:

NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace · 07/02/2020 10:06

This is their decision and their feelings don’t effect you

Well they kinda do if the OP is supporting her friend

TheVanguardSix · 07/02/2020 10:07

Of course you're worried for her. I would be too.
It sounds so soul-destroying for her. It's so, so hard. I can totally understand why she doesn't throw the towel in. I could sit here and judge but who the hell am I to do so?
What I will say is that your point of view, OP, is entirely reasonable. And I would feel exactly the same as you. It's really hard to see a friend struggle with the ongoing grief of infertility. All around her, she sees bumps and buggies and families. Life must feel like such a huge tease for her. Here's hoping the donor eggs work!
All you can do is wish her the best and hope for the best and just not give it much more thought than that. Keep on offering hugs and words of encouragement with love and meaning.
It would be wonderful if she got pregnant with the donor eggs!

NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace · 07/02/2020 10:08

and I'm firmly of the opinion that someone who is in general good health is as old they feel.

No. Anyone, in any state of health, is as old as they are. Let's not go down the age self-ID route

Crumpets124 · 07/02/2020 10:14

Enough is enough when they decide it is. Maybe the heartbreak and depression of not having a child would be harder on them than the heartbreak and depression that comes from infertility and ivf. Infertility changes a person forever whether they have success or not.

You are not being unreasonable to be concerned for your friend but it is unreasonable to think if she just gave up trying she would revert back to her happy pre infertility self as unfortunately that person is gone.

You sound like you are doing a great job supporting her. Hopefully donor eggs work and she will have her baby. If they don’t I’m sure in the next 5 years they will come to the conclusion that they’ve run out of time and no doubt will then go through some years of heartbreak realising they will never be parents and hopefully find an equilibrium in their lives and some peace after that.

elQuintoConyo · 07/02/2020 10:15

A close friend went through similar and gave birth to twins two months before her 50th birthday. DC are now 8yo and they're all doing fabulously, she's a great mum.

I didn't judge when she was doing with her own life, her own body; that would have made me a shit friend.

Notmyname86 · 07/02/2020 10:20

So tough to try and support your friend in this..

In think 45 is too old to have a baby, as someone whose mum died in her early 50’s I’m awake to the not so happy endings that do happen.

I also think people should think long and hard about using donor eggs. It isn’t really in the interest of a child to be conceived by them and leaves a big question mark in terms of their genetics, that we know many adoptees struggle with and I think many donor conceived children may feel the same. I also think that in the age of online DNA kits there is no such thing as an anonymous egg donor - there is a whole world of genetic data available now and likely even more so by the time any donor conceived children are old enough to be interested.

Lollygaggles · 07/02/2020 10:21

I finally had my DS after many years of trying aged 44. I went on to try for more, unsuccessfully. I was in that dark place your friend is in, it's unimaginable. I found forums like FF and FZ life saving because there were others going through the same who could listen endlessly and be supportive. Does your friend know of these forums? It sounds like you're a lovely kind friend and she is lucky to have you.

Worried2020 · 07/02/2020 10:32

@Notmyname86 my friend was donor egg conceived. She’s one of the happiest people I know. Luckily it’s not up to you who should and should not exist.

Mycatwontstopstaring · 07/02/2020 10:45

Yanbu to think the doctors are unethical and worry for her. I’ve been through IVF, it cost £6K for one attempt, was a disaster and left me in physical pain for 8 months, (my body doesn’t respond to the drugs that are supposed to make you produce lots of eggs and the egg I did produce was crap. Problems were also found with the womb.) The doctor kept saying “Just try again!” And when I pointed out how incredibly unlikely it was to succeed, he moved to “Just do donor eggs!” (Approx £10K) And “Think positively!”

The doctors are in it for the easy money / thrill of creating life. It doesn’t occur to most of them to recommend the woman stop trying, a bit like a hairdresser won’t say “actually I don’t think you should cut your hair”

I cannot imagine going through 7 attempts, your poor friend.

YABU if you judge her for desperately wanting a baby but I don’t feel that you are, it must be horrible to watch.

I hope the donor eggs work out for her. I don’t think 45 is too old to look after a baby, but I do think 7 tries is too many and am surprised they didn’t try donor eggs / surrogacy earlier.

opticaldelusion · 07/02/2020 10:47

As the mother of a child conceived using donor eggs, you really need to mind your own business. Literally no one in that situation - child, parent or donor - is interested in your opinions about something you know absolutely nothing about.

SerenDippitty · 07/02/2020 11:05

I also have misgivings about donor eggs. Altruistic donations are one thing but possibly vulnerable women selling their eggs (as happens in some countries where people go for treatment) is another.

opticaldelusion · 07/02/2020 11:05

The world would be an infinitely kinder place if women stopped commenting on other women's infertility struggles whilst smiling indulgently at their own brood of cherished, easily-conceived biological children.

If you don't know what it's like, then STFU about it.

PersephoneandHades · 07/02/2020 11:08

No, you are not BU to worry, that's all you can do though (as you have stated) so ignore people telling you that you're overstepping :)

ThunderboltandLightning · 07/02/2020 11:11

SIL has just had her first and likely only at one month of 44, so not much younger. Natural conception after many years of trying, no donors, no IVF etc. I don't judge, I am delighted for them, and not in the least envious of sleepless nights and nappies.

Morningirl74 · 07/02/2020 11:17

Good for you Everythingnotsaved for being such an amazing friend.

It is so hard. We had fertility treatment. Ended up with two lovely kids (lucky us) but were treated by four different clinics (two n h s, two private). First n h s clinic were brilliant (then we moved) second n h s rubbish (didn't listen or understand our problem, tried to do unnecessary invasive procedures), third private clinic rubbish (didn't understand the issue, tried to push us down unnecessary treatment routes), fourth private clinic was superb. They listened, and we worked out the treatment together.

Nearly all of my friends had fertility treatment. We were career girls who unfortunately didn't meet our partners until mid to late thirties. So I've observed lots of friends going through it.

Clinics make a hell of a lot of money out of IVF and various other procedures. So they will be trying to help but they do have financial targets to meet too so they probably will err on the side of encouraging couples to keep having treamebt. Plus they want a high live birth rate. (This is what counts. very sadly, some IVF and ICSI babies are not healthy or have additional needs).

Our problems were on my DH side. So we had to push and push to be allowed donor IUI rather than IVF. So a relatively simple case. But still made me aware of what goes on and how they love to encourage you to keep having treatments.

I really feel for your friend. I hope she gets her child. And if she doesn't I hope she survives it all.

(If she is using donor eggs or sperm then Donor Conception Network are amazing. You could go on a workshop with her!)

SVRT19674 · 07/02/2020 11:17

Had mine at 43. YABU as it is none of your business. Only they will be able to tell when enough is enough. Just leave them to it.

MintyMabel · 07/02/2020 11:21

I hate these kind of friends. Dressed up as worry but is actually full of judgement.

Either be there for her, or don't. If it's too hard for you to watch someone go through something shitty then don't.

She's not an idiot. She knows the risks in older pregnancies, she has decided it is worth the risks.

The last thing I'd want in her situation is a pretend friend who is sitting in judgement of me.

MintyMabel · 07/02/2020 11:23

His child will always have the social capital to be successful even if he does the square route of fuck all.

Sure. There are no examples of celebrity kids going off the rails because of poor parenting.

Notmyname86 · 07/02/2020 13:03

I didn’t say that anyone’s child shouldn’t be born or that geriatric pregnancy or egg donation should be banned, they shouldn’t. But I do think that the combination of donor conception with an older mum does have potential of difficult outcomes for the child for some of the reasons I mentioned. Obviously this isn’t always the case and I’m glad that The posters friend doesn’t have this experience but I think it’s naive to completely ignore these outcomes because they can raise difficult questions.
Especially as egg donation is relatively new so in the coming decades it there will be many more donor conceived children born and going through into adulthood.

Nofunkingworriesmate · 07/02/2020 13:12

Just had second ivf baby at 46 feeling great!
I was permanently knackered with my first when I was younger
Age gap was to save up for second go
I asked Every midwife and they said older mums more common now I’m sure s lot to do with money mortgages etc , my mum was married with a mortgage at 21!!

SnoozyLou · 07/02/2020 14:23

*I hate these kind of friends. Dressed up as worry but is actually full of judgement.

Either be there for her, or don't. If it's too hard for you to watch someone go through something shitty then don't.

She's not an idiot. She knows the risks in older pregnancies, she has decided it is worth the risks.

The last thing I'd want in her situation is a pretend friend who is sitting in judgement of me.*

It did come across this way a bit to me too. And if it were my friend, I wouldn't be gossiping about something so massively painful and personal to her on MN, but each to their own.

itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted · 07/02/2020 16:39

I have to agree with Notmyname86

And actually the posters who have donor children or had a child at 45 on here also have no idea yet how the decisions they have made will impact their children as adults - it's naive to think there will no mental health implications

(And I do know donor children coming up to their teens who are very much struggling with the truth of their conception)

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