Training up colleague who earns more than me

[BIankets]

I’m a NHS employee at one of the lower points of my pay band, in a specialist role. A new starter has the same job title as me although has very limited experience. He has come from another organisation and was the same band as me at that organisation, doing an entirely different (irrelevant) role. He has moved to my organisation to do this specialist role which he has absolutely no experience of (not a problem at all - it’s very much a case of learning on the job, which is what I did). He is at the top of this pay band; earning £5k more than me. I am expected to directly train him. I know this is how pay bands work and I know my manager can’t decrease his pay or up mine, but AIBU for being annoyed at having to be responsible for training up someone who earns more than me?

This kind of stuff happens all the time, it's not at all uncommon for someone on higher pay to be trained up by someone on lower pay
Yes he doesn't have direct experience of your role but he does have experience which he is bringing to the job for which he is getting paid for. One day it might be you who is in the same position in a new job.
Don't ruin your future working relationship with resentment it's just the way the pay scales work.

It does seem odd but I suppose that is how it works.

He was on the same band and pay at his previous role then?

Are there ways to move up a band?

p.s. this isn't a equality issue, the situation would be the same if he were female.

I think perhaps YABU - a little. I'm a nurse (band 5) and we got a new band 6. I was the one who basically showed her all of our audits and how they were done (they were specific to our area therefore she wouldn't have known anything about them) how one of our computerised systems worked as she worked for another trust previously and they didn't use this particular system, lots of other things that us band 5s and mainly myself showed her, because you know, teamwork. I would never have crossed my mind to begrudge helping her out because she earned more than me.

I know that may be a little different than directly training someone but still the same idea when you take into account the amount of hours I put in with her.

You'll be on the same pay as him soon enough due to banding progression so don't worry.

Are there ways to move up a band?
You only move up bands by changing jobs.
The agenda for change programme decreed that all jobs of a similar type across the country had to be paid at the same band to stop wage variation across trusts. So it's the job you do not your experience or abilities that decide your wage.

I’m NHS and been in the position of earning more than my line manager due to the bands overlapping! I was top of my band and he was bottom of his - just the way the band ifs work.

No experience of NHS pay bands but this sounds so unfair. I don't understand how he's automatically been given a higher salary than you for doing the same (or less since you have to train him!), surely when yours was advertised if it's for the exact same position they would have advertised the same salary? Maybe I misunderstand, or is it because he has worked for the NHS longer than you but in a different trust? If it was a different role this shouldn't matter though...

On a plus side you get your pay rises whatever, unlike much of the private sector where its secret and performance related and in years to. One you may end up moving roles or being deployed and getting retrained by someone on less money and with less NHS service.

He must be bringing additional skills/ attributes to the role, other than the things you are having to train him on. New starters will always have to be trained on systems/ processes that are unique to that role, whatever band they're on. I wouldn't get too hung up on it, if you want to progress, it's a good idea to demonstrate your ability to train others. Think of it as a learning opportunity!

There is no point getting worked up over this. They might actually be better than you once they're trained on the ins and outs of the new role because they've got longer service... or they might be a coaster who has got to the top of their band and is content there. I've experienced the joy of having lazy or incompetent colleagues be in the same band as me but paid more, it happens everywhere. In the private sector it might be the norm more to negotiate your pay but you are less likely to know what your colleagues earn.

By the way, you can negotiate your NHS pay. I've seen it happen. I have been hired onto the midpoint of a band, rather than the bottom, known friends to negotiate their salary when they're offered jobs and seen people get their roles rebanded based on their argument that they're working ay a higher level. It isnt as fixed as people think.

Have you asked your line manager about this? If you don't ask, you don't get.

@MummytoCJSH this is the way NHS pay bands work. The band is stated in the job ad. The pay point you go in on depends on years of experience, then you go up a pay point for each year of service. So this person must have been at a higher pay point in their old role.

I don't really understand the problem in an area such as yours, OP. That's how the system works. Same in teaching.

I worked in special education. Experienced mainstream teachers would get jobs at our school, but still had a lot to learn about our specific children and our methods. Sometimes it would be a young teacher earning less who would need to manage their day to day training, simply because they were working in the same year group, so it was the only viable option. I don't recall anyone complaining or feeling bitter about it. And it's something the younger person was able to add to their CV.

I think it depends. Is he going to be doing exactly your job but being paid more and presumably less capable since he has less experience? In this case yes I'd be very annoyed.

If he's going to be in a more senior role but needs to be trained "on the floor" in order to for example manage staff then I think it's fairly standard for him to be trained by a more junior staff member.

For those who don't understand NHS pay bands, you only move up a band when you get promoted/change jobs e.g. nurse to senior charge nurse. Within a band, you start at the lowest end of the scale and your salary increases over the next few years until you reach the top.
OP, its perfectly normal in my NHS role for me to train people of any grade in things I know about. Very few people would start a new job knowing ALL the things related to that job.
I think you probably know that and there's something else at play here.

Hmm I get where you are coming from, but he will have had years of experience to be at the top of his band. I appreciate he's not experienced at the current role yet, but presumably he has some transferrable or appropriate skills for the role or he wouldn't have got the job?

Thanks @VioletCharlotte I think I get it now. Can understand why that would be frustrating if he was doing a completely different job before!

That is just how NHS pay bands work! I cannot see why this is annoying, it happens all the time - literally every department/ward there is.

For example, I was a top band 5 - having been qualified for nearly 16 years when I moved to a completely new area for me - new speciality - so a lot of new skills to learn, and I was being taught by other band 5s - and yes some of them would have been lower down the band than me. So whilst I had to be taught specific skills that were new to me as they were not something a general nurse would ever have had to do - I had many years experience in dealing with patients/relatives/emergencies etc - which some of the Band 5's lower down the band did not have or did not feel comfortable with.

And in the same vein as a lower band 5, I would have taught new starters to my area who might have been higher up than me. It would never have occured to me to wonder where they were on the Band compared to me.

It is a non issue really. If you had to go down a few points on the band every time you moved areas no one would move!

I’m sorry but that’s just how it is! Everyone starts from somewhere. I’m sure teaching/ mentoring is also part of your role. If you are not happy then you know what to do, don’t teach him and state your reasons why! Take it further up management and see what happens. May I also suggest you familiarise yourself with your organisations grievance policy.

Sorry but I think you're being a little bit unreasonable. Due to NHS pay scale being restructured you'll be at the top reasonably quickly. He's hardly going to move to a role on the same band and earn less than he was before.

Having said that I've been in a similarish position (NHS) and it did piss me off. In my case I was the same band as a colleague but I was bottom, he was top. Due to the nature of my role I spent half my time correcting his mistakes. Was very frustrating.

I don’t get the issue either with training someone on a different salary.

He’s higher up as been at that band for longer, just as you will be higher up than others doe to your service length.

In my experience this is pretty standard practice in a lot of different industries and jobs. Presumably you could have applied for this job yourself but chose not to?

On the job training is only a part of what you need to perform a role and this part is commonly delivered by people on a lower grade, many of whom are pissed off about it like you are! I think YABU not to want to train people on higher pay though, it's how the world works. This employee has been selected for their skills and experiences and potential and their ability to learn and develop.

It's clear that those who are highly paid in an organisation will often not possess the level of detailed knowledge and skills of those who are paid less.

I hear you but the advantage you do have with that set up is that you can switch without going to the bottom of a payband.

No experience of NHS pay bands but this sounds so unfair. I don't understand how he's automatically been given a higher salary than you for doing the same

@Ginfilledcats gives a great explanation

Rewarding people for length of service rather than the actual value of their contribution is not at all fair
Hardly 'rewarding' though, is it? An annual pay increase for each year of service until you hit the top of the scale.

My workplace has a banded pay scale as well. I'm about midway and will eventually hit the top. I'm well aware that if I want to progress, the onus is on me to ensure I have the skills, experience etc to apply for a job in a higher band. To do this might mean moving to a new position to learn new skills and gain new experience and I do not care one bit that someone who may be at the start of the scale may feel put out.
I also work everyday with people who earn a ton more than me even though I have the most experience than many in my team. That's life. I didn't get the degree they did and didn't work in other areas or put in the time to cultivate a 'career' I earn pretty well because my experience is acknowledged by the remuneration system we have.

I've been on both sides of this. Many years ago I was working as what would probably be a band 3 (as i was training). They decided that they should upgrade the support role vacancy in my team to an equivalent to a band 4, but "couldn't" upgrade my job, so I trained someone with zero experience who was getting paid more than me. I left soon after

But, years later I moved from one band 6 role to another where I didn't have much experience of the specialist skills needed. That was fine and acceptable, you train on the job and I had plenty of transferable clinical skills. But I was trained up by someone who'd been a band 6 in that job for a couple of years. I was at the top of my pay grade as I'd been in my previous job for such a long time. So, I was getting paid more.
There was no other way of doing it. No way would I have taken a job that would have downgraded my pay (nor would anyone else), but my colleague had no negotiating power and you have to work up through the increments through length of service and by meeting your yearly objectives. Frustrating yes, but that is how the system works and there's no easy way around it.

Just to say it is possible to not be on the pay bands, I wasn't on them for years before I left. Every time I changed jobs I had to argue the same point but yes you can be off the banding. It's just everyone has been so conditioned to think otherwise.