Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2

Original poster

AIBU over joint tenancy

33 replies

AET123 · 28/01/2020 12:55

Hi,

Looking for some advice or real-life examples...

Bit of background: OH & I have lived together for 7 years, bought our first house together 6 years ago and since had two children, the oldest of which is 3. We are now moving to a bigger house as ours seemed to shrink when the kids came along!

We are not agreeing on whether to be joint tenants or tenants in common. OH paid the original deposit for our current house and I signed a document that agreed he'd get that back before splitting any proceeds upon selling the house if we split. Which I was completely fine with and in total agreement of.

OH now wants 75:25 to him if we split and need to sell the house as he pays more for the bills. What he is not taking into consideration is that I reduced my hours at work to make childcare better but also pay for EVERYTHING for the children (furniture/clothes/toys/nursery fees). If we were to split I will not be able to afford to live in the same area on my own so the kids lives will be completely uprooted as, due to the nature of his work, he can't have them full time.

AIBU to want more because of the kids, despite financially he'd be worse off?

Thanks!

OP posts:

Whynosnowyet · 28/01/2020 12:58

Marry the tight fucker and gain 50 % in the divorce...
He is a prize twunt imo.

LangSpartacusCleg · 28/01/2020 13:02

I would say ‘Sure, no problem. While we are rejgging finances, here is a bill for my services as maid, nanny and cook for the last few years. But don’t get upset, you only need to pay 50% and I’ll cover my share’.

eatyourcake · 28/01/2020 13:11

Maybe you need a spreadsheet with all expenses laid out, how much who pays for every month and for what, including cost of your time for childcare during working ours (since you had to reduce your hours at work, it's not just free time). Then compare and see if it really is 75/25 or not. If he wants to pull percentages out of his arse, then he needs to prove those numbers.

Perhaps if you do end up doing the 75/25 split, then you will need to set up a joint account and pay in for mortgage and bills also split same way. Not fair otherwise!!

Spodge · 28/01/2020 13:35

Go for a joint tenancy. If either of you falls under a bus the other will at least get the house regardless of the terms of any will. The ownership split in event of divorce can be dealt with by declaration of trust - though the court would likely interfere if it jeopardised the children.

HillAreas · 28/01/2020 13:36

I’ll tell you our set up for context. I owned my house before I met DH. When I got pregnant, I sold up immediately in order to have a house big enough for DSD to still have her own room (she’s 7, sharing a tiny room with a little one even EOW would have been awful for her)
I paid the entire deposit of around 45% on my own. This equity from my own home was a mixture of inheritance, mortgage payments, money invested in the house making a profit etc.

Even though he didn’t pay a penny towards the deposit (can’t if you don’t have it), I insisted that we be 50:50 tenants in common. In the event of a split, I don’t want my children’s father left with nothing or very little. That does not benefit my children.
Slightly different for us, as I also didn’t want to own jointly for inheritance reasons and risk either DSD being cut out by chance. This way she gets her share of her dads share automatically regardless of anything I do or don’t do in the future.

My point is, when there are children involved it’s not all about protecting yourself, your money, your assets. You have to protect the children. Married or not, he has to start to think about them and what they need. This is quite a selfish suggestion IMO.

slipperywhensparticus · 28/01/2020 13:38

Nope just no

AngelsSins · 28/01/2020 13:59

Well in one way, I don’t see the problem. Women are born with pretty much the same opportunities as men these days. If you decide to throw away your career and pension to enable a man you’re not married to to build his whilst you play skivvy at home, then more fool you frankly. He’s clearly out to protect himself, why were you so keen to give up your independence for him?

Sorry, I know that sounds harsh but I’m just sick to death of women throwing away rights (that other women fought and died for) and then complain when it turns out the man they dedicated their life to, doesn’t see them as an equal. Never count on anyone else to look after you, especially a man who you aren’t even married to.

Daftodil · 28/01/2020 13:59

He trusts you to be the mother of his children, but not with the finances? It doesn't seem like he acknowledges the input you have in the relationship or the sacrifices you have made by dropping your working hours (eg you will already have a significantly smaller pension pot, possibly be looked over/ineligiblefor certain promotions etc.). He has more money not because he deserves more money or is better with it, but because you are doing a lot for "free" with regard to childcare. In reality, you reducing your hours means that you are paying solely for the childcare on those days. Your DP isn't out of pocket and hasn't changed his working life, so he doesn't acknowledge this. You need a big talk OP and you need to show how the choices you have made benefit him and your family. It is his turn to make choices that reciprocate. I think 50:50 would be totally fair given your situation.

AngelsSins · 28/01/2020 14:13

Sorry my comment above isn’t constructive, I just want to flag this utter madness in the hope to make other women stop and think before they give up everything for a man.

If he can’t have the children full time then what the hell does he expect to happen if you split? Does he think it’s your problem that he can’t look after his own kids? I mean if his money is his because he earns it and you don’t get any of it, then why the fuck should you care about continuing to do all the childcare to make his life easier? I’d tell him that you’d agree to the above but that you would leave the kids with him if you split as you couldn’t afford to house them. See how he likes that.

antisupermum · 28/01/2020 14:43

I agree with everything that @AngelsSins has said above

Alsohuman · 28/01/2020 14:48

So he’s telling you money’s more important to him than his children.

PatellarTendonitis · 28/01/2020 14:49

I agree 100% with AngelsSins. You've allowed yourself to be played by this man. I'd put a stop to that. There wouldn't be a house purchase and I'd get back to work FT asap. You've made yourself extremely financially vulnerable here. Kids' lives won't crumble by moving area when they're 3.

MRex · 28/01/2020 14:50

I'm more worried about finances with one of us dying than splitting up. It seems odd that you're both so focused on what you each deserve individually, rather than on death risks, or your children and their needs if you separate. Maybe you should hold off on getting a bigger house until your relationship is in a better state and you're back at work full-time; then you can negotiate based on what you all need as well as what you deserve.

RebelWithVerySharpClaws · 28/01/2020 15:17

He is a greedy fucker and looking out only for himself. You are in a vulnerable position. Tell him you want to get married to protect yourself and the DCs.

kingsassassin · 28/01/2020 15:23

Agree with @AngelsSins

You could suggest that it's his go to cut his hours at work so you can maximise your earning power and pay 50% of the new house.

doodleygirl · 28/01/2020 15:29

Read and digest ^

OP why would you run your life like this, it just seems crazy and no protection or equality for you.

ColaFreezePop · 28/01/2020 15:35

And to make sure you have read it fully more than once this bit again.

dognamedspot · 28/01/2020 15:36

Nope. Call a halt to everything and sit him down and explain all of this to him in words of one syllable. You've formed a partnership that's been going for some years and have committed to raising children together. If he can't recognise that you've made an equal contribution to the family unit then you've got some serious thinking to do.
Honestly, this is why I think that there does come a time, when children are being raised, to consider getting married. Or maybe do a civil partnership. At this stage in the relationship you should both be protected in the same way that you would be in a marriage.

longwayoff · 28/01/2020 15:40

A prince. I have no advice for you other than to get out asap after taking specialist advice. Don't sign up for any other agreements that disadvantage you and the children. Do NOT buy another house with this pig.

Daftodil · 28/01/2020 15:42

@AngelsSins
I just want to flag this utter madness in the hope to make other women stop and think before they give up everything for a man.

I don't think women give up everything for a man. I think women give things up for their children. It isn't unreasonable for the OP to want the father to do/feel the same and also make sacrifices is it? And if he won't, where does that leave her? If she chooses to work FT, that might not put her any better off if she needs childcare provision for 2 DCs. Sometimes you've got to do what's right for the kids now, even if that may mean it isn't right for you further down the line as retirement looms, which may well mean reducing your working hours or considering your DP's finances when getting a house. They are in a relationship. He needs to start thinking and behaving like it.

GreenFingersWouldBeHandy · 28/01/2020 15:42

Why are you paying for everything for the kids? That should be joint. As should be mortgage, bills. And everything else.

I think people are being quite harsh, but you do seem to have sleepwalked into this situation.

Get legal advice and stop letting him walk all over you.

Jaxhog · 28/01/2020 15:44

Since he's starting with the premise that you will split up at some point in the future, you should start with the premise that you and the kids will need to have a decent roof over your heads at that point, and he will continue to support you all. That will require 2 solicitors to draw up an agreement.

Or just get married!

user163578742 · 28/01/2020 15:51

Why is he not paying his share of the children's costs?

AdachiOljulo · 28/01/2020 15:55

yanbu - he may be outlaying more actual cash but you are making far greater financial sacrifices because not only are you redirecting hours that you could otherwise spend on money-earning employment to instead use for the family, you are also sacrificing future earning potential by not prioritising your career for years during which you might otherwise have been seeking senior promotions etc. these sacrifices are huge and he is getting a way better deal than you.

your agreement for him to get deposit back was reasonable before kids came along. now kids are in the picture the only fair agreement is a full 50:50 split plus agreement that in the event of a split you can stay in the family home until the youngest child is 18 and the selling and splitting happens then, not before.

HillAreas · 28/01/2020 17:14

plus agreement that in the event of a split you can stay in the family home until the youngest child is 18 and the selling and splitting happens then, not before.

This is only acceptable if he is able to suitably house himself so that he can also accommodate the children. Else I’d have limited sympathy for the thread about how “exDH is renting a room in a shared house and can’t have the DCs overnight - what a bastard”.

Flip

1 2