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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be a bit shocked at how much more my colleague is paid?

119 replies

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 13:52

My colleague left his open pay slip on his desk, in clear view of our other colleague. Of course this is awful, she shouldn't have had a peak but she did.

She then text me to say how much he is on as she knows how much more it means he is getting paid than us and we were recently discussing our hopes for asking for a payrise.

So we are on exact same level, same qualifications, same experience and same responsibilities etc. I've been at the company 8 months longer than him.

I earn £30k and he earns £45k. That is quite a difference isnt it? I'm struggling to work that out.

My directors have joked about how cheap I am and it's one of the reasons they agreed to hire me despite being pregnant.

I'm not sure what I'm aiming to get out of this post. Maybe an idea of how to ask for a payrise, what do I do with this information, can I expect a £15k jump up in pay?

OP posts:

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 14:36

This is what I think too @Crunchymum ! I cant use that info at all as I found it out via snooping and Iwish my colleague hadn't told me as I would have been really happy if I managed to negotiate anything above inflation.

Regarding ML, I never took any as my son died. I took off 2 weeks from work and then returned back as full time.

OP posts:

Glittercandle · 20/01/2020 14:37

It sounds like you were happy to accept a low salary when starting (judging by the directors comments) and your colleague negotiated a much better deal for himself.
Perhaps your colleague has threatened to quit in the past and they have given him a big pay rise to stay. This happened to DH, he was offered a 25% rise to stay from a company who said they couldn’t afford to give anyone more than a 3% pay rise - he still left!

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 14:37

FYI, there is no HR as only a small company. And clearly that's the thing, he negotiated better than I did when joining and that's how it has stayed.

OP posts:

DowntownAbby · 20/01/2020 14:37

Don't make the mistake of assuming that:

a) you're not allowed to pay one person more than another - there's no requirement to pay everyone the same even if they do exactly the same role, with the same qualifications and experience.

b) the reason someone is being paid more is because of their sex.

It's absolutely not allowed to discriminate due to sex, but there can be many reasons why people are paid different salaries.

If you agree to take a job at £20k and then they need to recruit another person and can't get anyone to accept less than £30k, that's what's going to happen. There is no duty to then start paying you more.

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 14:38

It is my own fault for being lower paid I know. I was made redundant from one company when pregnant and so moved to this job just grateful that they took me on

OP posts:

DowntownAbby · 20/01/2020 14:42

Sorry @twittlebee my post was more aimed at a PP who said they could only assume the reason they were paid less was because the other employee was male.

You obviously understand that that may well not be the case, although it could still potentially be so. Very difficult to pin that down, though.

Can you compare directly with roles advertised in other companies?

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 14:43

Yes so this is what I've been doing for a while now as wanted to know what I could ask for @DowntownAbby and it appears to range from £37 to £47k

OP posts:

Coughsyrupsucks · 20/01/2020 14:44

On the bright side you know how much to ask for when you go for another job.

I once found out a man doing the exact same job as me earnt 11k more. I had been asking for a small 2k pay rise for a while but it ‘wasn’t in budget’ - yeah because the we’re giving him 11k more!

So I started job hunting literally that week I was so angry, and when I was asked how much I wanted by my prospective new employer I told them 15k more than my current salary. I got it and then took great delight in telling HR why I was leaving.

Dividingthementalload · 20/01/2020 14:47

Biker47 - women don’t push for pay reviews or rises or salaries in the same way as men do. We are grateful to them for employing us in spite of our pesky uteri and continuing to employ us when we dare to use them. Doesn’t mean the women who are paid less are not discriminated against, just because they don’t ask for more like men do. The whole unequal pay saga is underpinned by men pushing for more while women are grateful for less. That’s the whole point of the equal pay provisions I the Equality Act.

If they have a non discriminatory reason for the pay differential - a market forces argument, for example, as suggested by a pp, showing that they were unable to recruit for the same pay as the OP - then that is a defence to an equal pay claim. Like i said before though, I’d bet my bloody uterus that there isn’t one.

Bluntness100 · 20/01/2020 14:48

This is very difficult. They can pay who they wish what they wish as long as they can clearly demonstrate it's not discrimatory,

If they needed to pay him forty five to get him, and felt it was worth it, they don't then need to say let me pay you the same.

In addition the colleague has basically snooped on someone's private documentation, which is usually a dismissible offence, and then even worse she spread the private info she got to you,

I would suggest you both keep quiet you know this, as it will surely mean trouble for your colleague at least,and likely you also, for not only nit reporting the data breach, but actually using it as leverage to try to get more money.

All in it's a very bad situation and I'd advise negotiating your salary increase like you don't know.

cantfindname · 20/01/2020 14:50

This happened to me, although a far lesser amount.

I requested a discussion with my boss and told him my findings. He laughed in my face. This was despite the vast sum of money I had saved him that year by 'shopping around' wholesalers (Over £120k)

My colleague could do some of but but definitely not all of my job worked many fewer hours and took home more. The real irony is the fact I had been the one to train her.

He then made me redundant; re-titled my job, and gave it to her, I think the fact I had sussed out his tax dodges may have paid a large part.

Dividingthementalload · 20/01/2020 14:52

You don’t need to say where or how you got the info. You just need to state the facts and ask for justification. In a tribunal claim, the pay details would come out in the disclosure process anyway.

The smoke and mirrors of opaque pay systems is how the inequality is perpetuated. We have to smash those mirrors up.

Crunchymum · 20/01/2020 14:55

@Twittlebee

Fucking Hell, I am so sorry I mentioned ML and I am so very sorry that you lost your son.

FWIW, I think a company who pays such vastly different salaries / doesn't have a HR dept / only gave you two weeks off when you lost your baby is not a place you can build a future.

There has to be better out there for you?

MaisWeee · 20/01/2020 14:58

That's a disgusting difference. I'd be straight onto the boss!

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 15:00

That's my exact reasoning for coming to MN @Bluntness100 as I know it's wrong to have had that info shared with me and I was sure I couldn't use it but needed to have someone bluntly put it like that so I know I'm not just being OTT nervous.

I actually really like my colleagues and the work though @Crunchymum and it was my choice to return to work so soon, they said I could have as long off as I would want but I needed work to help me keep sane

OP posts:

aroundtheworldyet · 20/01/2020 15:06

Just go in and ask for a 15k payrise
You don’t need to explain or justify why you’re asking

The thing is. He had the cahones to get it in the first place.

You on the other hand seem to be apologising for being alive and even having a job in the first place.

Get some oomph about you and quit worrying what people say.

If they say no. Then ask for a written reason.

FFS people. Stop analysing - start action

aroundtheworldyet · 20/01/2020 15:09

In fact ask for a 17k payrise.

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 15:13

You are right, I am a horribly apologetic person @aroundtheworldyet ! DH always calls me up for it

OP posts:

TeachesOfPeaches · 20/01/2020 15:13

Your colleague might have been earning £35k/£40k in previous last job so not that much of an increase for him. How much were you earning in the job before this one?

Original poster

Twittlebee · 20/01/2020 15:15

The same amount @TeachesOfPeaches as I was just desperate for any job and didnt think I was in position to negotiate whilst I was obviously pregnant

OP posts:

aroundtheworldyet · 20/01/2020 15:16

It’s irrelevant why he has the extra
It’s irrelevant how he got the extra

Just go and ask for the extra. Tomorrow

And let us know how it goes

Dividingthementalload · 20/01/2020 15:16

You haven’t responded to my posts op which leads me to think you may be all talk no action... you can do something about this. The future direction is firmly in your hands. But if you choose to do morning then you can’t really moan about it? You have options here.

thecatsthecats · 20/01/2020 15:18

My advice would be to try and ascertain what it is you don't know. And don't give any indication that you do know this salary discrepancy. It won't do you any favours in the short term to be associated with such snooping.

Ask for a salary review. Ask for a role review. Ask if there's any training, experience or progression available to you. Ask if there are interesting opportunities coming up that you can prepare for. And do your research on what competitors are offering.

Be the person they don't want to lose, and be clear that you see this as a work opportunity. Make the pay look like a consequential thing.

(For what it's worth, this is coming from the perspective of a woman who has negotiated 15k+ pay rises plus an extra week's holiday in role. Also, I've had to bat back accusations of 'unequal pay' from an absolute dogshit employee who I'd fired, who couldn't understand why her continual agitation for pay on a level with her far more experienced and capable male colleague was continually pushed back.)

TeachesOfPeaches · 20/01/2020 15:18

@Twittlebee well that is the reason why your colleague gets paid more. The best time to negotiate your salary is when you join, unfortunately you were desperate so weren't able to take advantage of that.

DrManhattan · 20/01/2020 15:18

He might have negotiated a better starting salary. Not much you can do about that. Pretty awful how they comment on you being cheap though! Rude, even if said as a joke

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