considering banning dd from playing with friend if she does this again

[shesgrownhorns]

My dd has this year endured an on/off relationship with her friendship group. She's 10. I have got involved before, telling the mums (who have become my friends) what seems to be going on and the exclusion of my dd resolved for a bit, but then soon started again in an intermittent way. My dd has low self esteem now because of this, and has become quite lost I think. She plays with other children (children who themselves are on the fringe of friendship groups too, poor loves) which I think is great and I encourage her to encourage them to all play together. Anyway one of the friends of the friendship group that keeps isolating her was horrible to her and pushed her out. Dd came home sad but recovered at home. (She's getting used to it which is really worrying me) Anyhow, after a full week of being ostracised the little texted her to say sorry and could they be friends. This is after dd had texted her to chat and she blocked her... My dd said of course. So they're friends again. Dd phoned her asking if she could come round and play soon and she said maybe, she'll see.

My AIBU is.... I don't want her round, and I'm not happy that my dd has let her back in so easily.

WIBU if I told my dd that if it happens again I will ban her from being friends with her again?

I don’t think you can really get involved unless it’s clear bullying in which case you wouldn’t encourage any relationship.

I completely understand that you want to protect her from her ‘frenemy’ who is unfairly vacillating between allowing/not allowing her in, but I think you have to support your dd and allow her to do what she wants as opposed to what you think is best. Kids go through phases and next year, in secondary, she’ll hopefully make better friends.

Try to teach her resilience as opposed to banning her mate. It’s fine to tell her the mate is being a cow, but better to ensure she’s able to make friends with others and not relying solely on this one.

Yanbu not to want the friend in your house but you cant stop them being friends in school unfortunately.
Are they year 6? If so a lot of friendship groups go through a nasty phase. You only have 6 months left.
Hopefully your dd will find nicer friends at secondary school (is there a group she could join in a particular interest where she might meet other new starters over the summer? Drama group opened up a variety of new friendships for me at that age).

I wouldn't get involved at all in this.

Yes, they're year 6. And I'm so worried that this will continue to happen throughout her school life (and all her life maybe) and that I should in some way get involved and try to help her see that she has great worth and doesn't have to accept poor treatment.

It's a power play. Same thing happened with my youngest. She didn't understand friendships,especially with girls. I talked it through many times, that they enjoy telling her yes then no. Eventually she realised she didn't enjoy hanging on waiting for them (and played with the boys!)

I know that friendships wax and wane at this stage, but one of the others in the group are ostracised by the whole group ever, which has happened in the past.

non, not one, of the others 🙄

I don’t think you should ban her, no. You can only support her and try to encourage her to be less reliant on this girl/group. They will all get mixed up/make new friends at secondary.

Unfortunately when it comes to good and bad friends children do seem to be driven to reinvent the wheel and advice from adults seems to be ignored in favour of finding out for themselves.

I would focus on her self esteem. That you value her. On praising skills she has and can be proud of. Getting the odd comment in about "that doesn't sound how a friend would behave" will hopefully get heard. But from you a steady presence on her side might be all you can be whilst she sets her own limits.

It is really tough when it’s like this. I always tried to give the best of my wisdom and support while keeping out of it all.
Dd seems to get boys better. After primary she joined scouts and cadets which seems not to attract game playing girls. DofE good too, not to many bitchy girls seen to want to yomp across Dartmoor with all their supplies and provisions on their backs in the snow!
It fires all get easier somehow in senior school.

I have the T-shirt OP both from when I was at school and from my own girls.

You need to talk to her about frenimies, how to spot real friends, users and abusers.

Get her involved in after school activities that have a different group of children.

My girls went to a small primary but did all outside clubs away from those children and were much happier because of it. The whole world didn't revolve around a small number of nasty girls.

It's best she learns what relational aggression is now so she can spot, deal and avoid in secondary.
A mighty girl website has some great tips on this.
My dd has been very picky with her friends at secondary school, she had friends at scouts, friends at band and school friends. Very healthy friendships to nothing like the bitchyness at primary.

Have you spoken to the school? We had a great teacher in Y5 who didn't tolerate nasty 'girl' behaviour, she hated the girls being girls and boys being boys school of thought and really talked about this behaviour as bullying.

I'd also say no to this girl in the house.
Tell your DD that you don't like the way these girls treat her and that you want home to be a safe space for her, explain that it is your job to protect her and so you will not allow a bully into your home.

Don’t get involved
She needs to sort it out for herself
Or she will end up like me ,47 in the same situation,with a friend I can’t escape from who treats me like shit .
Distract her with nice times with u,encourage her to join groups outside school where she can make more friends ,encourage her to play with other children and to walk away from someone who is nasty

100% agree with @thetreeisstressingmeout. Banning the friend is probably not going to help, but this is a good time to open up discussion with DD about how she deserves and wants to be treated by other people, and what a real friend looks like vs how she is currently being treated.

Don’t get involved you could make things worse. I do understand how you feel though.

My daughter has been through similar since starting in year 6. She'd had a friend for a long time who was very aggravating towards other children but my daughter always got on with her. October half term she confessed this girl has been bullying her too since the beginning of year 5 and forcing her to be friends with her by using emotional blackmail.

My daughter has tried many times to get away from her as she realises she's not a proper friend, she's a bully. We've now had to involve the school to ask that they stop her following my daughter round the playground crying every playtime. My daughter feels so sorry for her but she really can't tolerate any more from her.

There's no way I'd encourage this friendship tell her shes not the kind of friend you want her to have so she won't be coming round to play.

Don't ban her, she'll be friends with her in secret. 10's old enough to sort things out for herself.

Christmaspug- yes she does need to sort it out help self but these are still children and need to be taught these things. You teach toddlers to share you don't expect them to just know.

8-12 is a tough age and involves a lot of learning around social behaviour and relationships, children very much need parental guidance I. This and learning to deal with this bullying behaviour now will set them up for life.

These boards are full of people who were never taught to spot a frienimy, who can't walk away from toxic friendships because they were never taught the tools when they were younger.

I see this a lot in school - it's called relational bullying. Excluding from play is a bullying behaviour.

I would ask your daughter why she wants to be friends again, friendship is reciprocal, so what is it about this friend that she likes?

You could encourage her to be friendly, but cool it off and find someone else who won't treat her this way.

I would say to my kid that that other kid is being an asshole and that I'm not happy with them putting up with that shit, but I wouldn't outright ban them from being friends - that's not likely to achieve much anyway.

I think it is likely she accepts this behaviour because her self esteem is low.
Focus on that.

I'd talk to her about what she thinks makes a good friend and how good friends treat each other. I'd give her the tools and self esteem to make the decision for herself.

I can totally see where you're coming from and would want to do the same.

But what you don't want is it backfiring in that when Dd feels ousted again she directs her anger at you for not letting x friend around because you having that open line of communication is what she needs to navigate this.

It would pain me greatly to have the little brat in my house, but, at 10 DD needs to be free to make her own choices, whilst having your support. Obviously I wouldn’t call her a brat to DD, but I would discuss her behaviour, ask DD why she wants to be her friend and what she feels she gets out of the ‘friendship’ etc.

It’s bloody difficult.

But banning their friendship is a sure fire way to make your DD more secretive with you and more invested in this ‘friendship’.

What’s that girl’s mother like?

Thank you everyone, I am listening intently x