To be permanently skint, despite being on a good salary?

[cherriesandapplesandberries]

On paper, we have a good combined income of around £85,000, although it varies slightly and can even go up to around 90 on a good year.

But we seem to be permanently skint, and I don’t mean not much money, I mean absolutely nothing in the bank accounts, scrabbling round for loose change, stressing about how we will get to work, skint. This isn’t a begging thread by the way, I know sometimes people post on MN wanting others to offer them money and I don’t, I’m just trying to explain how it is.

We do have debts, loans and credit cards plus obviously the mortgage, childcare fees, cars which cost then obviously the needs of a growing family.

I know back when I was a young ‘un I’d have fallen about laughing at the idea my current salary isn’t enough to live on, but I just seem to be struggling all of the time!

Same here OP. Income of £4K, outgoings of £4K.

We have a large ish mortgage, and a moderate loan repayment. Cars are paid for, no childcare costs, no takeaways, shop in Lidl. It just goes. It’s not just you.

YNAB is US software that hasn’t been adapted for UK use as far as I can see. Not sure why I’d pay the same price as Americans for something that can’t be used in the UK in the same way (importing bank data)

It's tough at that point in your life - childcare + mortgage (+debt). We struggled for a couple of years with two kids in part-time childcare. It got better when they got to school and I got a better paid job.

I'm going to echo those recommending MSE to you. They have a DFW (debt free wannabee) board which specialises in looking at people's budgets and finding ways to optimise / cut spend. You'll have to post a SOA (Statement of Account) with actual figures, but you should get some really helpful suggestions.

Know how you feel we try to budget the best we can by not wasting money on things we don't need but still trying keep some aside for a fun day out I used to work but stopped after having my son so we are only on one full time salary from my fiancé I try put all my lose change in a pot so it can add to £100 sometimes for a day out or for emergency use have look and see if there really is anything u can cut down on it takes a while to adjust to but once you get used to it it doesn't seem as overwhelming or stressful as long as bills and mortgage are paid and there food on the table that the main thing x

Pay less into your pension. You can up it again when you’re in a better situation.

I agree with everyone that you need to have a clear look at your finances and find out what is really left after all essentials. Shoes are not essentials every month so I like how people include that. It’s a twice a year purchase possibly not a monthly bill, same with clothes. Although I know Martin Lewis advises you include luxury expenses into your monthly outgoings to get a real picture of your finances so if you do that then fair enough but for kids twice a year is enough.

if I needed to get anywhere a taxi SIX times a week (let alone bus journeys) was cheaper than owning/leasing my car. Anywhere further afield DH always drove anyhow.

I'm pleased that you have said this because when I lived in the UK I found this to be true, and everyone said I was bonkers. I only needed a vehicle to do my food shopping once a week, and to get to and from my elderly mother's twice a week to help her out with things. It was much cheaper to get a taxi for these things than it was to buy and run a vehicle.

Obviously it wouldn't be true for everyone but for those who aren't using their car every day and don't need to go long distances it is certainly worth considering.

Gosh how much debt are you in if £500 a month gos towards loans and on top of that you have credit card fees?

^ that’s clearly your issue.

People on middle/high incomes can still be skint with young kids due to childcare costs! The price of full time childcare for 2 kids in the South East is about £2500/month (30 000/year). This is more than most private school fees but most people don't think it's unreasonable to not be able to afford that. I don't think it is reasonable to suggest that the answer is that one parent (usually the mother) gives up her job and takes a long term hit to her career and financial independence!

The good news is that it is a short term cost so it's a case of getting through the childcare years as best you can.

You need to budget. A proper list of what you spend every month. Then prioritise, organise and cut back where you can. If you are on a joint salary of £85000 then presumably least one of you is numerate and has some degree of gumption so it shouldn’t be difficult.

Grown men and women with an education bleating about how they can’t do normal things like cook or clean or manage money annoy me. There are a million books, magazines and online resources to teach these things if you can be bothered to read them and then follow their advice.

Massive debts

When will they be paid off?

Regardless of whether you earn 8k or 85k you need to know where and what your outgoings are and then budget with what's left.
I would quite literally do what most people do and get a worksheet sorted and then look at what you actually have to spend on food and luxuries etc.

85k probably extrapolates to about £4500

Nursery 1500
Debts 600
Cars 350
Mortgage 1000

That's £3500 before passing go and doesn't leave much for a family of 4.

I’m no longer in a similar boat,’but when the DCs were smaller I was! Between us we earned about £90k, we had no money at all. This was because of the high cost of childcare, commuting and mortgage. We also did go on holidays - cheap ones like cottages but it all added up. We only had one old car, but literally had no spare money.

The DCs are older now, we have split up and I earn less! So still have no money- but I do understand where you’re coming from :-)

So, what's your partner's going on if you cover childcare, loans and credit cards? Mortgage mainly? Or does he have his own debts and cards?

OP why are you paying for all the childcare?

Is your issue an unfair split with your partner?

Opt out of your pension for now and use the money to get rid of debt.

I can’t daisy, I did ask here about it once but the overwhelming response was that would be a really bad move. It does sting though.

jelly it’s actually highly personal so I won’t go into it here if you don’t mind, it involves quite a serious medical incident.

No only I earn 50, he earns 35. I pay the childcare fees and the loans, he pays the mortgage and other bills.

What are your OH outgoings, people are trying to help but you are very defensive.

I’m going to go the other way as OP doesn’t want advice. No, most people on a decent income aren’t scrabbling for pennies to feed their kids, if they are only buying essentials and managing their money properly.

If you have spent money in the past and it’s coming back to bite you now, that’s one scenario. If you could actually afford all your essential outgoings but you’ve parcelled up lots of non essentials in with that because life is inconceivable without holidays and expensive cars and a new kitchen etc, YABU to try and console yourself by thinking that it’s ok because lots of other people do it. Of course lots of people do, it’s why credit was invented. Doesn’t make it a good idea though.

Pay less into pension

Sod the budget apps, just a spreadsheet

You must be able to cut back somewhere
How much is the mobile phone?

Anything you can sell? It’s surprising what crap people will buy.

I’ve sold quite a lot, it’s a very temporary stopgap though.

Choosing to pay a considerable amount into a pension when you are in a bad financial situation is insane.

Do you still use credit cards?

I am in the same situation as you, OP (only that I am a single parent, so with the same gross, the total net is lower). Also struggling with debt, accumulated from the times when the children were younger and the childcare bill was £2.5K.
Don't expect a massive drop in the childcare costs when your children start school (depending where you are, of course), in my experience it is a myth. My average childcare financial load is still £1100 / month, with both children at school (before and after school club + holiday clubs cost spread over the year + ad-hoc sickness emergency cover).
Fantasies upthread that this level of income buys "luxuries" are quite funny, actually.