Opting out of organ donation

[ringme]

So the law has changed and this spring the NHS will consider you to be an organ donor automatically if you don’t opt out. I haven’t had a chance to really consider this all yet, WIBU to opt out at this stage until I have time to think about it or is that a selfish move given that 408 people died last year waiting for a donor?

What will you be doing?

www.organdonation.nhs.uk/helping-you-to-decide/about-organ-donation/faq/what-is-the-opt-out-system

I think being prepared to let your child die for their principles is very different from actually wishing them dead. Agree.

I'm going to opt out. I have always opted in via my drivers licence but this hasn't been updated for a number of years.

I have a connective tissue disorder and this affects every part of my body, including my eyes, my bone marrow, bones as well as organs and tissue. Not enough is known about my condition and I'm worried the doctors would use my organs for someone, who would then have my duff collagen. Robbing them of an opportunity to have healthy tissue transplanted.

Opting out gives me peace of mind the doctors won't overlook this.

MGC31 Thank you I really appreciate it that's brilliant!

If my dc needed a transplant I would do whatever I could to help them.
So I'm happy to be helpful if needed when I die and am on the donation list.

@whatnow40. Can I pm you please?

@WeeSleek. Thank you. That does make sense. And you're right, it is becoming more about a 'right' to a child rather it being a privilege.

So, it’s only those who would be prepared to give who should be allowed to receive? No other criteria then?

Let’s say that in the hypothetical situation there are two patients and one donor, the one patient is not on the organ donor register, and the other one is on the donor register, but he is Ian Huntley. You really think the patient who is not on the donor register is less deserving than Ian Huntley?

I have said that they can have everything except my eyes and heart.

They are buggered anyway so no use to anyone else.

@AlternativePerspective

It would (and should) go to whomever is most in medical need, i.e. at the top of the list plus a match to the donor.

@AlternativePerspective

It's very simple. If someone isn't willing to donate, then they shouldn't be willing to receive either.
Your wild speculations about who the recipient could be are totally irrelevant. It's not a moral judgement; it's simply whether or not someone is part of the organ donation system, or not.

Very few bodies are accepted for research/ medical schools. Particularly if you die of something fairly ordinary. I knew several people who left their bodies to science. All were rejected.

@ ScarlettBlaize yes it is a moral judgement. Because you believe that someone who wouldn’t be willing to donate is selfish and therefore shouldn’t be allowed to receive. Hence you are making your own moral judgements.

As *@MGC31
Bearing in mind that the recipient hasn’t actually been in a position to donate anyway whereas the criminal has already committed a crime.

I've always had a organ donation card (since school age) but I'm not crazy about automatic opt in.
On the plus point I can imagine it makes it much easier for medics etc as you don't have to ask permission from a grieving family to cut up their recently deceased/dying relative. I imagine most people who die organs are off no use (died of old age / cancer etc) so it is mostly young people who have died in accidents who end up donating after death?
However - I hate the idea that now the state owns our bodies on death. Are they allowed to use them as research or harvest our DNA or eggs/sperm and use them however they feel? Even if they can't at the moment I am concerned it's a slippery slope.

as *@mgc said,

@ fastliving yes you still have to gain consent from the relatives.

Not opting out doesn’t automatically mean your organs will be donated. Your family still have overriding consent.

@ Toddlerteaplease I had a distant relative who donated his body to science. He essentially died of old age afaik and his body was rejected but only months down the line when his family were unexpectedly expected to have it returned to them in order that they make the arrangements for funeral etc.

@AlternativePerspective ScarlettBlaize yes it is a moral judgement. Because you believe that someone who wouldn’t be willing to donate is selfish and therefore shouldn’t be allowed to receive. Hence you are making your own moral judgements.

Nope. I'm not making any moral judgements. I'm saying that the system of organ donation is one that is intrinsically reciprocal and participatory.

You are either part of, or not part of, that system.

You can be inside, or outside, the agreed community of exchange.

That's all.

If you would opt out but still accept a donation from someone else, you’re really a very unpleasant person.

For all of those trying to make a clever point by opting out, but leaving it to their families to make the decision:

"Fewer than half of families agree to donation going ahead if they are unaware of their loved one’s decision to be a donor. This rises to over 9 out of 10 when the decision to be an organ donor is known."
www.organdonation.nhs.uk/tell-your-family-and-friends/why-share-your-decision/

Essentially, by opting out, you are making it far more likely that your family will refuse.

For all of those trying to make a clever point by opting out, but leaving it to their families to make the decision:

Nothing clever about it. My DC have carte blanche to give my organs away and they know it. But it's their gift to give, and not for the state to take.

@Italiangreyhound yes of course, I don't know how to send you one.

I've just spent an interesting hour reading some of the Hansard debates on this bill.

Striking was the contribution of Lord McColl, a transplant surgeon. He warned the house that opt out systems often destroy patient doctor trust and result in fewer potential donors.

I will explain why. For anyone who is unfamiliar with the world of organ donations and assumes that only those who have signed the organ donor register can be donors, it is easy to see the huge appeal of deemed consent. If 37% of people have signed the donor register, then introducing deemed consent is clearly attractive; even if this provoked 10% of people to opt out, one would still be increasing the total pool of donors from 37% to 90%—a huge boost.

But this is not how organ donation works. At the moment, anyone in England can be an organ donor apart from the 0.7% who have signed an opt-out register. Crucially, you do not need to have signed the organ donor register to be a donor. In fact, as I set out at Second Reading, most organs donated in England in the past five years came from donors who had not signed the organ donor register or the opt-out register. The key to their donation was their family, who made the donation decision for them. Rather than increasing the total pool of donors, the introduction of presumed consent actually threatens to reduce the total pool of potential donors from 99.3% to something more like 90%—a small but not insignificant minority opt-out.

In Wales, over 180,000 people, all of whom were previously potential donors, have now withdrawn from donation. This equates to 6% of the population. All of those potential organs are now lost to the system.

Essentially, by opting out, you are making it far more likely that your family will refuse

I don't agree with this. Assuming that opt out doesn't mean you are discounted entirely.

The automatic opt in I think makes it less likely people will talk to relatives than the donor card. That DM carried a donor card was irrelevant really. She had told everyone her wishes. We were 100% certain this was what she wanted. That was the key thing, we all knew and were in total agreement we must carry it out.

If she just hadn't actively opted out as per the new system then I doubt we'd have agreed to it tbh. We wouldn't have kept her alive for that time without knowing for certain it's what she wanted.

If someone opts out but has discussed why with family that's the important thing. Is what I'm trying to say.

I don't understand why anyone would opt out personally. If my organs are in good working order, I'd like to think that they could be used to help someone else. I won't be here to know about it so it seems like a no-brainer to me.