To think apart from mortgage it is possible to live debt free!?

[Moneytalkone]

Just that really, AIBU to think that it is possible to live debt free, that debt isn’t a necessity in life! Apart from a mortgage I suppose if you want to own a house. Had a chat with a friend who claimed that debt is given these days, it’s almost an accepted/expected part of life? What do you think?

I'll fully admit that DH are privileged in the sense that we earn okay (£45k net/year between us), which makes it a lot easier to save. But we also make sure we do save a decent amount, even when there is nothing that might need replacing in the foreseeable future. When we bought our flat the boiler was 2 years old, other appliances fairly new as well. Nonetheless, we did decide to start saving £200 straight away to start building up a buffer for when things do need replacing. Sure some car finance deals are good, but what if they're no longer available in 3/5/10 years time? Then you'll have had no chance to save because you've been paying off your previous car and are left either carless or with no choice but to accept a more expensive financing deal.

I feel it's very much circumstances.

I have been lucky over the years to have received inheritance which l put into high interest accounts. Thanks to that l have a "buffer" for emergencies eg washing machine, car etc. I can then build up my buffer again over the next few months.

However, if you don't have that buffer - you're behind already when an unexpected bill strikes as you don't have the savings to use or the income left over each month to then build up the savings for the next unexpected bill.

I can totally see how people get into debt so easily.

Some is unfortunate like above but some is being irresponsible.

Would you live without a boiler until you saved for a new one?
some people have taken a weekend job to pay for emergencies like that... Again, it's a mindset.

some people have taken a weekend job to pay for emergencies like that... Again, it's a mindset

Great. You’re a single parent with no support and money for childcare. How do you do a weekend job? Or you’re already working two jobs? Or you’re disabled?

The lack of being able to see beyond one’s nose is absolutely startling on this thread.

When your life is one long shitshow, small pleasures can sometimes be the thing that keeps you going. You or I may be easily able to take ourselves out to dinner on a whim, but maybe that family takeaway being sneered at is a bit of pleasure in an otherwise hard life.

I used to find it very hard to tell clients that they couldn't afford their £70 a month Sky package, which was their only leisure spending, when we'd spend that on a pub meal and a few beers. I spend that amount on books most months, ffs.

some people have taken a weekend job to pay for emergencies like that

But you’ve got children to look after at the weekend? No childcare?
Until you have lived in other people’s shoes, you have no idea why they are forced to make the decisions they do.

That's all hypothetical isn't it Elbeagle
My boiler did break. My washing machine did break and piss out all over my kitchen floor mid cycle, I had to wait for payday to repair both. My relationship broke down and I had to sell my first home because I couldn't afford to stay there or rent anywhere else.

My point is I have managed to live a debt free life (so far). I have gone without, it wasn't easy. I saved every penny I had when I could because I was driven to.
It could all change of course. I've said I plan to continue living the same way but things change. As it stands, it's what I personally have achieved so far.

Everyone saying 'of course it's easy, I do it' you really don't know how lucky you are and I think you're extremely ignorant to think that just because you can do it everyone else should be able to as well. It's a viscous circle being in debt and it only takes one small thing to start it.

People saying you don't need a brand new car are correct but you still need money to buy an old car and then pay for it when it goes wrong.

DId you join MN just to ask for stories of debt?

Neron what if when payday comes you don't have spare money? You only earn enough to cover all your outgoings? What do you do then?

Yes, if people pick better paid careers - this is an issue for advice to your teenagers really. If they want to follow their interest into being an artist suggest they keep it as a hoabby and qualify as a doctor first, that kind of thing - tends to mean you aren't so hard up later. Writing as someone with no debt and nowadays no mortgage either (and I have worked full time without a break even for babies since 1983)

I have no debt except mortgage. I'm 34, don't use a credit card, have no loans or outstanding balances. I save when I want something new. I bought my car second hand and own it outright.

Of course it’s hypothetical. But it’s a perfectly reasonable scenario, and until we’ve been in that situation ourselves, it’s impossible to say we wouldn’t get into debt for it.
Personally, would I make my children go without heating and hot water for a year while I saved for a new boiler? No, I’d buy one on finance. For some people it’s not about waiting for payday. I imagine most people have had to wait for payday at some point to repair/replace something. What if on payday you only have £20 spare after you’ve paid for essentials? Plenty of people live in that situation.

god I hate this attitude. I was born in London, my support system is in London, my job is "well paid" in London comparatively.

I used to live in the SE. I moved up north because there is no way I could ever have afforded to buy down south. I was spending a fortune on rent each month and had no means to buy a house. I simply couldn't afford to save the amount needed to get a mortgage on anywhere that wasn't a bedsit (and even that would have been a struggle). I moved away from everything I ever knew to become financially secure.

People make choices in life. Some people would rather live in expensive areas to remain near their family. Others move for their jobs, or to increase how far their money goes each month, or to live in the countryside, or to live somewhere with better schools. I now live extremely comfortably on 18k a year. No debt, decent savings, low outgoings and a much better quality of life. I had to make plenty of sacrifices to be able to do that, though, and not everyone would want to do that. Which is fine.

There's no way I could have that down south. So I moved. That was my priority - financial security and less work-related stress. You've made a different choice. You'd rather be close to your family/support network and incur more financial stress and strain. Which is fine, and a perfectly acceptable choice, but lots of people have no option but to move away from their support network because otherwise they can't afford to live.

A downside of where I live is that I have a long commute to work and I live somewhere pretty rural. That's not for everyone but it's a compromise I've made because for me, I was approaching thirty and wanted a family and DH and I wanted to own our home before we TTC. I have colleagues who laugh because where I live is considered a little rough and has few amenities, but then they complain because they pay double what I pay on my mortgage on their rent.

People prioritise different things in life. But I do think people need to own their choices.

Do people not watch the news? There are people who can't afford to buy food, who have to choose between eating and the gas bill. You have to feed your kids so you pay a bill a little bit late but...then they add late fees and interest and you're screwed. Or you go into your overdraft for a few days...then they add fees and you're screwed.

It's not all about luxuries.

@Neron but you didn’t have dependents at the time who cost more, who cannot function in the same way as adults e.g. without heating in winter. An adult can layer up, a newborn needs a decent room temp.

Nope. Never had a debt in my life.

Debt certainly isn't 'a given', but, as 6 pages of answers backs up, it is so dependent on a whole myriad of circumstances.
I do think it always ought to be something to aim for, but there is no "should" about it for some people.

Everyone saying 'of course it's easy, I do it' you really don't know how lucky you are

but it is "easy". It's a pain in the ass at times, it's uncomfortable and it's tempting to buy luxuries you can't afford, but it's not difficult.

What is easy is calling it "luck" and ignoring the fact that other people have made other choices, and have worked harder to stay debt-free. It's a choice.

"Neron what if when payday comes you don't have spare money? You only earn enough to cover all your outgoings? What do you do then?"
Dont have outgoings I cant afford.

Do people not watch the news? There are people who can't afford to buy food, who have to choose between eating and the gas bill. You have to feed your kids so you pay a bill a little bit late but...then they add late fees and interest and you're screwed. Or you go into your overdraft for a few days...then they add fees and you're screwed.

I don't think people are saying that everyone can always live debt free, but that for a lot of people it would be possible if they made different choices.

DH and I are considered weird and old-fashioned by our peers because we bought our house and got married before we started trying for children. Lots of our friends had children young and are unfortunately now stuck in private rent because their high outgoings (childcare mainly) mean they can't afford to save for a deposit.

These aren't people who struggle to heat their homes. They just made the choice to have children young which unfortunately had an impact on their ability to save for a house and the future.

Yes it is. I've had periods of my life when I was jobless and on the dole, and periods when I've had a reasonable income (as at present). But apart from having a mortgage, I've only once got into credit card or other debt--a brief period when I was at university. The resulting interest charges from the credit card company were so high that it shocked me into never again allowing myself to get into debt. Finally we are mortgage-free too (we are old!) so we have zero debt. I accept that others' circumstances can force them into debt however responsible they are. But for myself, I have made big sacrifices to avoid the debt trap and consider myself fortunate that I've avoided that particular stress.

It's not all about luxuries

kids are a luxury. There are many of us would would have loved a bigger family, but can't afford one. It's a choice.

Dont have outgoings I cant afford

What, like a roof over your head, heating and food?

@JosefKeller

Unless you’re unfortunate enough to find yourself suddenly seriously unwell and disabled and cannot do a lot of the things you used to do.

This isn’t even something that has happened to me but I have my eyes open and the world can be much harder if you’re ill or disabled.