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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Man in meeting ignoring women

125 replies

sunshinepoppy · 07/01/2020 16:30

I am a relatively new secondary school governor. I have attended a few meetings and during each meeting the (male) chair behaves as if he has not heard what any woman has said and then repeats what the woman has said as his own idea. The Headteacher is a woman and he did this to her several times.

e.g.
Sunshinepoppy: What colour hats do we need?
Headteacher?: Historically we need blue hats because the school started on a boat.
Chair: What you have to understand is historically because the school started on a boat we need blue hats.

It is baffling behaviour and very obvious that he only does this to women. He wants to meet me for a debrief and a review of how I am finding the new role and what I think of the meetings. Should I mention this to him? I am not sure that he is aware that he does it.
Has anyone encountered this before?

YABU: Do NOT mention it
YANBU: Mention it

OP posts:

Devereux1 · 07/01/2020 19:10

Ha ha. Don't raise it in the 1-1 meeting, you have to act smarter in the meetings.

As soon as a woman says something which you don't want him to repeat and claim, interject and affirm their comment. Great point headteacher, yes I agree, I see headteacher, or follow up question just to her.

If he does it, say "yes, I got that when headteacher said it, so...."

Original poster

sunshinepoppy · 07/01/2020 19:24

@Canadianpancake that is infuriating. What did you say to him?

OP posts:

Canadianpancake · 07/01/2020 19:42

@sunshinepoppy infuriatingly nothing! It was my only my second meeting and I still felt like was finding my feet. It was only afterwards when I realised we were all having the conversation and he wasn't involved that I realised I wasn't in the wrong. He's tried to do it since and I replied that we we hadn't quite finished discussing the issue. He stepped down at the last full govenors for a few different reasons.

NWQM · 07/01/2020 19:54

Personally I'd tactfully avoid the 1:1 as it doesn't sound as if you get a lot out of it. I would instead have a 1:1 with the Head and broach it with her. I'd also ring the LA Link officer and sound them out by explaining that it makes you uncomfortable.

Agree that there are tactics you can use in the meeting but better if you have some allies.

Your ultimate tactic is that he is only really the Chair because the Governing Body vote him to be.

longwayoff · 07/01/2020 20:15

Depend who's taking the minutes. I've been in many meetings where the Chair has repeated in a similar manner to ensure the minute taker caught it.

HollowTalk · 07/01/2020 20:30

I think it's up to the Headteacher to raise this with him privately. I'm not sure why he's a governor, never mind the Chair - does he have an educational background or another reason for being there?

sonjadog · 07/01/2020 20:42

This used to happen to me at work with two male colleagues. We'd be sitting around talking, I would suggest something, my male colleague would repeat it and the third one would tell him what a good idea it was.

I dealt with it head on and asked him what it was about next time they did it. As in "Why did you just repeat my idea and why did you agree with it like it was his idea and not mine?". Said in a curious way rather than an angry way. I think it took saying it a couple of times before they really got it, but it stopped pretty sharpish. Internalized misogyny, but they weren't bad men at heart and when it was pointed out to them, they got it fast.

OrrAppleCheeks · 07/01/2020 20:48

The headteacher shouldn’t be expected to raise it with the chair - the governing board holds the headteacher to account, not the other way round. It could put the headteacher in a difficult position. I think this should be raised for example by the vice chair or one of the committee chairs outside of the meeting, or should be addressed by non-staff governors directly or through the amplification strategy when it happens.

FlamingoQueen · 07/01/2020 21:18

That is so inappropriate that he came to your house, walked to school to collect your child and walked home with you. I’m sorry, that is just downright weird and should never ever have happened.
This says more about your headteacher I think, mine would never let this happen in a million years.
I would go and speak to the HT, this is not normal behaviour in any role.
I would find this intimidating. Sorry to go on, it’s just weird.

HollowTalk · 07/01/2020 21:40

I agree with @flamingoqueen. He shouldn't have come to your house. I wonder whether he had to meet you alone at all? Did he meet the male governors? OP, did you have a private meeting with the Chair at the previous school?

Original poster

sunshinepoppy · 07/01/2020 22:09

@HollowTalk no I never met with my previous chair privately or away from school. He seems very socially inept and does not take hints.

OP posts:

HollowTalk · 07/01/2020 22:12

Do you know what his background is? Obviously you don't want to out him on here, but how did he come to get voted in?

Shannith · 07/01/2020 22:39

I had this when, like a previous poster I was the only female executive director at board meetings. The COO was a fiend for it.

I enlisted the support of my other male board directors who all called him out on it when he did it.

No reason why you can't enlist the support of any/all of the other governors, regardless if they are male or female.

Just because he is (possibly) sexist doesn't mean the other men in the room are.

N.B. I've also had women do this to me/seen them do it to other people - both men and women. These people are just arseholes and I always call them out. The industry I worked in meant I could do this pretty directly, often with humour/thinly veiled sarcasm

Original poster

sunshinepoppy · 08/01/2020 06:58

@HollowTalk He works in IT and he is a parishioner in the church that the school is connected to. I think he was voted in a few years ago when no one else wanted the Chair job.

OP posts:

Original poster

sunshinepoppy · 08/01/2020 06:59

Voted in as chair I mean. He had already become a governor a few years before through the church connection which doesn’t need a vote.

OP posts:

Daftodil · 08/01/2020 07:48

Maybe mention that there was some mansplaining and he-peating going on at the meetings that you found a bit odd. You don't have to say it was him, just a general thing you noticed. If he asks for examples, give him the blue hat one and say "there were a few... I think this is actually one from you!"

Devereux1 · 08/01/2020 08:24

sunshinepoppy
@HollowTalk He works in IT

Ah...

dognamedspot · 08/01/2020 08:31

School governors don't need to have any expertise in education. They are supposed to represent the school stakeholders and wider community. If he became a governor through the "church connection" and wasn't elected by governors then he's surely a foundation governor.

People need to realise that it's often very difficult to get anyone to stand as chair of governors, if there is more than one nomination they're lucky. So he's been in a role that a lot of governors don't want to do for some years.
Op - if you've done your training you'll know what the NGA recommendations are regarding how long anyone should remain as Chair. You're new to this school but say you're a governor elsewhere, maybe you could stand for election next time? He could probably do with a break, but even if not, it's bad practice these days to have the same person in the role for too long.
Personally I wouldn't challenge him when you're so new to the role and still getting to know the dynamics. It may be that the rest of the board just mentally raise their eyebrows and, knowing him better than you do, realise that there is no ill intention in what he's doing. If you are a supportive governor who is useful at meetings and does the job of monitoring etc well I'm sure you'd stand a good change of being elected next time around. You could even wait a few months and have a quiet chat with him to say that you'd like to offer your services to take a turn. He might bite your hand off!
Re going to your home - depends. I always have a sit down chat with new governors and offer them the choice of in school, a coffee shop or I visit them at home. Again, he's not doing this professionally. You could have managed the situation perfectly well by just telling him "OK, it's been really interesting but we need to wind this up in about 10 minutes as I have to get going". "Right, thanks very much, as I said we'll have to stop now. Lovely to meet up, see you at the next meeting". "No, I'd rather you didn't come to school with me, I've got a lot to be getting on with. See you at the next meeting". etc etc. If he ever looks like visiting again (unlikely) ask him if space and time can be found to do it at in school.

Medievalist · 08/01/2020 08:50

He is in his 60s, single and childless

Struggling to understand why that is relevant op?

BlaueLagune · 08/01/2020 08:57

Have you never conversed with an older man before? They are ingrained in this and see it as common courtesy, like opening doors for women

That doesn’t make it okay. It’s not courteous

Yes it is! Nothing wrong with opening doors or holding them open. Would you rather a man slams the door in your face? Is that really more courteous? Of course it isn't.

What the OP mentions is completely different. I was a governor for 8 years and I never experienced this. Some good suggestions here on how to deal with it tactfully and in a low key way.

BlaueLagune · 08/01/2020 08:58

He is in his 60s, single and childless

Well I guess if he hasn't a wife or daughters he hasn't had his ingrained sexism knocked out of him by his female family?

VestaTilley · 08/01/2020 09:06

That's unacceptable.

A letter signed by all the governors calling on him to change his behaviour or resign is needed. If that doesn't work, complain to the local authority/academy trust/diocese etc.

Get all staff to write to the governors complaining too if they don't act.

Also, the head should take him aside and have a private word. Don't let it continue.

sillysmiles · 08/01/2020 11:51

It's fascinating reading through this thread to see the people dismiss what he is doing as anything other than sexism. Such as - that OP doesn't know how a meeting should run or that it's OK because he is older or that the OP should not make any suggestions because she is new.

It is interesting to she the woman's point being dissected and dismissed (by some) in order to justify the man's innate ingrained sexist behavior.

Devereux1 · 08/01/2020 11:55

A letter signed by all the governors calling on him to change his behaviour or resign is needed. If that doesn't work, complain to the local authority/academy trust/diocese etc.

I think that's rather OTT. It's meeting behaviour, other people in the meetings need to assert themselves more, and need to just step up and not let him get away with it.

Debrakeppers1975 · 19/01/2020 21:12

Maybe he just doesn't like the woman. Why do people have to involve gender in everything

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