The tone of the coverage of the Reynhard Sinaga case. *Title edited by MNHQ*

[Dogsaresomucheasier]

Just watching tonight’s news. I do not wish to minimise the trauma suffered by the victims of Reynhard Sinaga, but I’m really struggling with the reporting of the case; even from female journalists. It seems so full of empathy and gravitas, when so many female victims go unheard.

@Gonetoget and with a photo accompanied of her covering her face as if she's guilty - the Mail really are despicable

I'm sure the DM will have some kind of disclaimer in the article that will absolve them of responsibility for that statement, afterall they're only reporting what someone else as said, but the majority of the readership won't read beyond the headline before wading in with their 'informed' opinion.
They are beyond disgraceful.

the TV report I saw last night said that many of the victims were drunk - the perpetrator lived in the nightclub district so it was mere steps to walk out, find someone semiconscious and invite them back to his place.

so their alcohol intake was mentioned. He didn't go in the clubs and spike drinks as far as I've heard.

getting semi-conscious drunk is stupid - the river in our county town shows no mercy. For the MN bleeding obvious brigade, no that does not mean that drunk people deserve to get raped.

I detect a nasty air of glee in some posters on here.

Even The Daily Mail would not dare to suggest, if a man had been convicted of raping 136 women and keeping video evidence of them all clearly fast asleep while doing it, that those women were all slags who had been asking for it. Nor do I think it would be attempting to suggest that some of them were. I think this thread is appallingly counterproductive. It leaves a nasty taste in the mouth to read comments be people complaining about media bias, rather than focusing on some of the lessons learned for the future from this successful conviction of a truly appalling human being.

In all honesty, I think the most shocking thing about this case is that this man got away with his crimes for so long because men are apparently even more terrified of reporting rapes than women are. No way would 136 men have been blissfully unaware of anything awful having been done to them, so they knew or suspected but did not report. Unlike some of the women on this thread, I suspect it’s because they believed they would be taken even less seriously and be even more villified if they stepped forward than a woman would be. It took overwhelming evidence for this man ever to be brought to trial.

@TatianaLarina

You are quite right - I should have said "evidence" not "facts". My second point was not an assertion, but qualified by "I think that" - and again a request for evidence to contradict that, which you still have not provided!.

Thank you @Gonetoget The DMO headline is attributed to the footballer, it's not the paper's statement (which is normal journalist's practice - I wonder what the print edition said?). But I agree with you that someone reading it quickly could get a bad impression. Overall I've felt that the UK media have generally taken the girl's side in this issue - but I guess it depends on which media you look at.

We have free speech in this country, so vile people like Katie Hopkins can get away with saying some truly horrible things (not always - she did lose her case against Jack Monroe). I'm not familiar with the Finnegan quote about Evans - but if that's true, I agree it's appalling - and coming from a woman (and mother of a daughter) too makes it even worse.

I rarely read the comments on DMO articles (or the Telegraph) as they always make me very cross.

Sam Thompson from Manchester was raped in 2016 by 2 other men he met on a might out.

When reporting to the police, it felt like he was not believed and was asked if he was really actually gay, and whether this was a genuine complaint or if he had just cheated on his girlfriend.

Men aren't always believed either. And given they are less likely to report it in the first place..

It's a long time since I've read so much nonsense on a thread as TatianaLarina has spouted forth. Deliberately obtuse and inflammatory and is choosing her words very precisely.

The more reports I see of this, actually, the more it seems men (especially gay men) are also not believed and blamed in a similar way women are when they report sexual assault.

Not asking you to agree with me @AbsolutelyValid - likely I wouldn’t agree with you.

@mencken yes it's reported that the men were all drunk. However that's in the context that being drunk made them "vulnerable". Drunk female rape victims aren't described so.

@Gonetoget and @GlummyMcGlummerson

I can't believe I'm typing this but you are grossly traducing the Daily Mail which has been very supportive to the rape victim (as have it readers judging by the comments). You are picking out a report of what the footballer said when the preponderance of the DM articles have been supportive. Today's described the overwhelming support for her - detailing the Israelis who had flown over to support her, close ups of the placards her supporters were carrying, reporting her QC's comments on the appeal. I was actually quite moved by the compassion

To add to that - i was really interested to read on the DM website a deconstruction of the so-called confession/retraction proving that the language used would not have been likely to have been written by the victim. I hadn't seen that in any of the other coverage.

Yes - I saw that too, it actually appeared in x2 separate articles / reports in the Mail

The Cyprus case is not representative of the DM’s general approach to rape complainants - it’s unusual. Some MN noted that even the DM were apparently supporting her which is really something.

Having said that they still printed a pic of her in a low cut top on the knee of the guy she said she had consensual sex with - so that’s business and usual,p.

They’ve only taken the line they have because the evidence is quite strong. Without that - the case would have been covered very differently.

@aridane.
Your comment reinforces my point. I hadn't noticed the other articles, I was too disgusted by the one quoted to read further. It was the main story on their website when I clicked , I am sure I am not the only one who has formed and opinion for better or worse based on that headline.
If the DM wanted to fully support this young women, why the fuck are they publishing stories by the looks of it her despicable ex.

And gone have you read the comments? So many readers scolding her "hope she's learned her lesson" "no smoke without fire".

They use a photograph of her in a strappy holiday top. This is no coincidence.

Please no one be under the impression that the DM give a crap about the Cyprus rape victim - they are giddy because they love an opportunity to be subtly racist. If it had been 12 white British men, not 12 Israeli men, the tone would be VERY different.

Also, just heard headline on Absolute Radio with "lying" in the title.

That's what people hear. I hope she is vindicated because even now she is branded as a silly little girl who caused 'mischief'. I'm so angry on her behalf.

Rape is normally accuseds word against accusers so always difficult to know what went on in private. I think the difference with this case isn't that the victims were male it is that he filmed the rapes so no question of who is telling the truth.

I think the difference with this case isn't that the victims were male it is that he filmed the rapes so no question of who is telling the truth
There are multiple cases of womens rapes being recorded on phones and still the rapists get off. Still its intimated the women asked for it, what were they wearing, did they flirt earlier etc etc etc etc
There one fairly recently that the woman filmed her own rape and was still accused of wanting it.
When will this shit end.

There are multiple cases of womens rapes being recorded on phones and still the rapists get off. Still its intimated the women asked for it, what were they wearing, did they flirt earlier etc etc etc etc
There one fairly recently that the woman filmed her own rape and was still accused of wanting it.
When will this shit end.

You just can't really argue this points with so many different recordings. I bet my mortgage payment if it was just 1 guy it would go EXACTLY as it goes for 1 female victim.
Shit

Dangerfloof

Can post a link to case of a man filming multiple different women.

Not saying I don't agree with you but I like to compare myself

Who are these people that are asking if a woman if flirting, what she is wearing? I only see it on Mumsnet and loose women.

Defence lawyers would be very brave (or stupid) to use that as nowadays (rightly), acting like that towards a victim can frequently alienate a jury.

Two witnesses in the Ched Evans case gave evidence as to the victim's sexual history and behaviour. Police evidence in the Cyprus case included multiple observations that she "didn't look like a victim". Police now don't even look into a report of rape until the victim gives them permission to go through their phone, unlimited access dating back to unlimited time. It's a matter of public record that this is all admissible evidence.

To be fair, if a man was wearing a g-string and figure hugging trousers that accentuated the shape of his crotch when he was raped, I have no doubt The Daily Mail would comment on his choice of outfit and suggest he was clearly asking for it. It has never struck me as a newspaper that is inclined to be nice to anyone.