child-hating woman in Tate Modern

[bellawilliams]

I went to the Tate Modern this afternoon with a friend as we had heard they were running special family activities - and they were, and the staff were lovely and very helpful. Between us we had 5 children: two 4 year olds, a 2 year old and 2 babies. We were directed to a room in the gallery where the older children could look at the pictures and make their own collage with stickers all supplied by the gallery. While we were in there (and the older children were quietly getting on with the activity) my friend had to run outside and one of the babies started crying so I went to get out her bottle. In the ensuing few seconds of noise a hateful woman approached me and aggressively told me that 'this is not a kindergarten, this is a gallery - you can't have screaming children in here!" I was incensed but managed to keep my cool and explained that we were here as part of a Tate organised family activity. She kept on and said it should not be allowed so I asked her 'Do you think children should not be allowed to look at art?" and she said no!!! So I said very sarcastically 'What a LOVELY attitude' and proceeded to tell my friend very loudly what had happened. I am still furious!! Anyone else had such a reaction?????

why am i clutching at straws?

no, of course money doesn't replace irreplacable art - but art more often comes to grief as a result of adult negligence, interference, accident or incompetence than eager children!

The fire that wiped out t Emin's work, the builder who unplugged Mark Quinns frozen head, some massive statue that was dropped from a crane recently, etc etc - no damage at all by screaming babies!

places for SEA to avoid over the bank hols

As blu said earlier we are not talking about high or even moderate risk actiities and your whole premise that organisers wouldn't factor in babies being present at a family event ludicrous.

But Lulu, where am I saying something against that?

I have already covered the woman is a cow thing that gave origin to this thread, that all babies cry, fine. That children activites are wonderful, and being such an interesting topic with interesting posts by people around here, there are some interesting "avenues" of thought to follow in this topic, why do you want me to go back to the boring stuff?
Just ignore me, that would do

So true, Blu. Babies aren't generally art saboteurs, akaik. Though I myself did once deliberately kick a brick out of line in a brick floor picture art installation thingy. I was a surly teenager attempting to search for the meaning of art aka trying to make my friends laugh though, not a screaming baby. I did hurt my toe but felt it would be churlish to put in an insurance claim.

isababel...done!

i'll have to re-iterate what i mean tomorrow

Try harder Lulu! you can do better than that!

I'm a member of Tate Modern and they are very active in encouraging families - why else do they run so many family activities? Actually, I would strongly advise anyone with an aversion to kids to go somewhere else as the members' room is packed with kids at weekends!

Most of the installations over the past few years have been more popular with kids than adults - not that they would want to admit this, of course - Olafur Eliasson?s sun, Carsten Höller's slides, etc. Sorry, but daytime...summer holidays...Central London museums and galleries...rainy days...what the hell does she expect?

The hateful woman should be grateful she wasn't there during term time when the place is full of school trips. She might be well advised to steer completely clear of the South Bank.

Bella, you say that the child-hating woman "even had headphones on doing the gallery narration - so can't have been THAT bothered by a bit of wailing!!!"

I wonder how well the headphones worked? Perhaps the gallery narration was at low volume or difficult to hear clearly and she was having problems? Perhaps she was at a crucial bit of narration when your baby started wailing, and she didn't know how to rewind?

I do think it's a good idea to take young children and babies to galleries, generally btw. I just wonder if there was a technical glith to explain her outburst.

In contrast to the OP's experience I took my dd to The Sound of Music last week - it was Kids Week in the West End. There were two elderly ladies behind us who obviously hadn't realised it was Kids Week but they kept commenting on how lovely it was to see so many children at the theatre and what a shame there weren't more shows on that children and adults could enjoy together! It was obvious from the converstaion that they'd had children themselves though, suspct the woman at the Tate did not!

I think you should teach children that libraries/art galleries/cathedrals/stately homes are special, and behaviour there should be modified.

I completely agree that children should be introduced to 'culture', but recently I have been annoyed by the behaviour of young children and their parents in settings that are not playgrounds, or wacky warehouse, or whatever.

I have two boys, who have always been potentially very noisy and energetic, and generally very hard work. But I have taken them to art galleries and so on from a very young age, but initially for very short trips, and always prepared to remove them immediately when they become bored and fractious.

They are now 8 and 10, and genuinely appreciate these things. Yesterday we went to York Minster and spent about two hours in there - suitably reverendly - which I thought was very good going for such young children: they were fascinated.

Totaly agree with you Roisin. Kids should be welcomed, but we do need to teach them appropriate behavior. I get fed up of Tarquin Darlings running round as if it were a playground, when they are of an age where they should know better.

Crying babies are somethings else

Hello MB! I just got back from a couple of weeks away. How was your hol?

Snort at scummy.

Roisin, yes, I think that 'special' is a good way to introduce young children to historic / cultural places as a distinction from rowdy play places.

Things being 'special' or 'precious', is a valuable source of understanding whether it be about nature, living things or art and historical artefacts etc.

I introduced DS to the concept of 'use your careful hands' when handling things of value or delicacy.

We spent some of the holiday seeing NT properties/ going to museums. I was struck by how well they set up things to help to entertain the young. Mt two had a great time 'Bogle' hunting in Brodick Castle. They had fun, we got to enjoy the castle, and at the end they ran around outside in the adventure playground

i would luuurve to take my 2 year old to the tate modern, i think she would love it, but i would worry she may become a little too involved with some of the installations. Besides i much prefer the saatchi (sp!) gallery don't you know!!

But actually, i think a great deal of modern "art" would benifit from the scrawlings of my DD.

I regularly take both my girls to museums and art galleries, and my eldest is a little over four and my youngest will be three end of September.

I do know my girls prolly dont 'get' the works of art on the same level as the arty farty types walking around and pretending like they do, but both my girls enjoy it, and both are rasonably well behaved and thoroughly look forward to going on these trips.

What exactly are mothers meant to do with small children, stay locked up until their children are deemed old enough to appreciate modern art...keeping in mind the event the op went to was specially geared towards catering for young children!!!

I dont care whatever anyone says I'll continue taking my girls out to galleries and the such, it's great fun playing spot the monster amongst the works of modern art so there.....

i often take my DD to the local library when the weather is bad or i just cant face another trip to the beach. She is two, she does sit and quietly listen to me read, for about two minutes! Well enough to read a couple of books but then she wants to go and jump on the scatter cusions and follow the other children on their assualt courses made of said cushions. She now LOVES the library, she is NEVER quiet and i never read to her in a hushed voice. There are other users i agree but the reference library is assigned for quiet study and the main library is separated from the childrens library by the computors. I think if i expected DD to be quiet in the library then she wouldnt enjoy the experience and i want her to continue to enjoy this resource as she gets older.

As for art galleries - we have a local art gallery and i often take DD, she will touch if i dont stop her, so i tell her to "look with her eyes" One day i did this and she made glasses with her fingers around her eyes and put her face right up the to art, i left

I took ds,then aged about 7 to the Saatchi Gallery - was in two minds though as it was the Damien Hirst thing,Tracey Emins bed etc - lots of disturbing stuff - he was fine -I was just a bit disconverted by the Damien Hirst installation wiith the rotting cows head and flies. I did think I might be warping his mind - but no ill-effects so far.

disconcerted I mean

i loooved the saaatchi gallery and i dont even LIKE modern art. Although i fail to see how taking a picture of oneself in a fucked up state on heroin is art, or taking pictures of your stools floating in the toilet either (dont know who that was though). That i feel insults my intelligence.

There were some amazing wax works there when we visited oooh, this was in LBL (life before lucy ) they had statues of people dotted around the gallery, american tourists, the cleaning lady, a guy sitting with his back pack, that sort of thing, everyone looking VERY closely, there was also a guy reading the paper, again people looking VERY closely - til he turned the page, it was classic, watching everyone moving away pretending not to be staring. It was obviously the artist because he kept doing it, i just sat and watched the people watching.

must've been the same show lucyellensmum - did they have dead dad, the little life like waxy man - forget the artist's name ? There was Marc Quinn's frozen blood head and a room full of oil...