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to ask people in Northern Leave constituencies what changes you would like to see in your area?

109 replies

chomalungma · 15/12/2019 12:27

I really hope there is going to be change in these areas. I live near some of them and I can see some of the issues. But I don't live in them.

What would you like to see done in your area? What advice would you give to the Conservatives when they come and ask for what needs to be done locally?

Transport links?
Encouraging businesses locally
Better local housing?
Improved schools

What would you like to see change in your local area?

OP posts:
ListeningQuietly · 15/12/2019 18:07

In London, all kids under 16 ride the buses for free

In London one ticket works on every bus and train and tube

In London the buses and trains run after 10 pm

can you imagine the difference those improvements would make elsewhere in the country Sad

Difficultcustomer · 15/12/2019 18:11

I’m a remainer/labour voter in a northern city, not Tory. From a personal perspective transport is high on the list as I’m not allowed to drive. The area needs more jobs. Things like good schools would improve things for current residents but also attract people like GPs. GP shortage everywhere, less reasons to come where I am.

jimmyhill · 15/12/2019 18:15

Dream on. They will do nothing for any of these areas. I wonder when the penny will drop with the duped electorate.

RippleEffects · 15/12/2019 18:17

I'd like to see some devolved spending so local councils can work on what matters to them. It's really funny since some TV moved up North how suddenly it's slowly getting recognised that the North of England is a vast and diverse landscape, with vast and diverse economic climates and needs.

My youngest is at school in the local primary. It's a poor area, high free school meals and 10 different ethnicities in just her class. Shes year 4 and her class of 30 has 4 new children this term. 2 non English speakers, just into the country. 1 a child who is taxi dropped to school so some form of additional family/ social/ emotional need and one who was moved from another school. I don't know how her teacher keeps his head. In her school the FSM money is used for various activities and in school clubs directed at those children. The thing is that actually causes social grouping as they are mixing significant amounts of traditional downtime with other FSM children. Likewise the non FSM children are left to mix so friendship groups form - reinforcing parental financial background. Rather than levelling the playing field it draws a clear division in it.

I'd love to see libraries back in all schools. It's not just about the books. For me the library was a quieter place to be in my own head during the school day. My childhood school librarian oversaw children doing their homework and spellings in breaks/ lunchtimes. Not as a punishment as something they'd been reminded they needed to do but for what ever reason didn't get done at home.

Austerity cuts in school funding, cuts in school support staff and drops in academic achievent particularly in the middle cohort of children all appear to have a similar timeline. Can't be a coincidence. Not everything can have a metric or be fully quantifiable but support staff are the ones who remember to congratulate a child on an achievement, give an ear when they know not everything is okay at home. Those few moments of someone giving a damn can change a child's life. Yet with such a high erosion of support sstaff in schools children's mental health issues are at a record high.

I'd like to see every Tory MP with children look at the schools their child has had the privilege to attend and compare it honestly with the schools in the poorest area of their constituency. Visit them and observe. If that school is not good enough for your children why is it good enough for societies?

The background of many of the parents at my local school is a sad tale. Many have had a really rough time. Abuse, jail time, evictions, sofa surfing, poverty. We have 4 foodbanks in our local area. There are lots of chips on lots of shoulders and massive emotional barriers to children being able to break their parent/ carers cycles of behaviours.

I think that the philosophy behind universal credit was a good one and when it was starting to be established Ian Duncan Smith appeared to work hard to really understand some of the barriers around why work didn't pay and how people did actually want to work. Then austerity measures ment the system and philosophy behind it wasn't what was designed. It isn't the system that's been pushed through. A few good stop gap measures are being put in place with being able to borrow against a claim and the new deal for those setting up tradding on their own, but money really needs to be invested in the system and to accept the hit that support of the system will be needed to change and turn around lives before savings can be made by people sustainably working and a new work ethic being created across the next generation.

An example of this is a local nursery has just gone bump effecting lots of minimum wage just about coping workers in our playground (some employed by the same nursery), plus a couple of the teachers/ support staff at our school. Why did it fail? It wasn't lack of children, or need. It was that people weren't able to pay on time, so wages couldn't be paid. Why couldn't people pay? An element of very poor money management and debters taking money from accounts before it could be used but also debts existing because of benefits not being paid and the rediculous five week month rules which are complex to understand with a degree level maths based qualification. For someone without even GCSE maths working for minimum wage working out how to balance the five week months against the four week ones is causing so much hardship.

I have broken the benefits cycle of being a carer and unemployable. I run my own business but my story if getting off benefits is the stuff of nightmares. Carers at DWP, who are lovely people doing their damndest in a hard situation, are 18months in arrears on paperwork. Give them some money to catch up. Its costing the country a fortune. It has a ripple effect on tax credits, paid based on income a year in arrears. It's been a headache and since thinking I was no longer entitled to carers its taken 3 years and I'd estimate 100 hours to get the various agencies paperwork sorted. Thats whilst trying to work and still be a carer, do the significant amount of paperwork needed to support a disabled child and fight for the needs of that child.

Making work pay at or around minimum wage means the safety net needs high elasticity not to close around claimants and hold them on the ground. Its not just an easily quantifiable numbers game either. Lots I know who aren't or barely work have significant mental health issues. If/ when they work they are happier, they are at the GP less, A and E less and need less crisis support from the mental health teams. But the current benefits back logs and irregular unpredictable methods of making payouts mean working is such a big gamble. People are scared to try in the first place, the poor benefits administration means it's even harder to give it a try. It's not that more money needs to be sent to the claimants, it's that it needs to be available when needed.

The press love to talk about who couldn't live on 25k etc But who, with no regular bank account, credit facilities or family support could live on random small amounts for 6 months then get a big payout then random amounts again? It's no wonder the money lenders grew so big so fast. Whilst it's great they've officially almost gone, where do people think these people in real hardship are getting money from now, que the rise on the men in black suits knocking on doors and kids being told to hide behind the sofa and pretend they're not home.

Runningonempty84 · 15/12/2019 18:22

Stop lumping "these areas" in together, for a start. Leave-voting areas in the North aren't one homogenous mass. Are you a Daily Fail journo, OP?

I live in a leafy, rather naice, part of a big Leave-voting Yorkshire city. The concerns we have here aren't the same as those of people in Sunderland. Or Barnsley. Or Penrith. Very different cultures, different concerns, different landscapes. Though we'd probably all agree that transport is shite.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 15/12/2019 18:23

Comparing transport in London to anywhere else is false equivalence. London is one of the busiest cities on earth no other region needs that level of transport.

Our rural bus service was cut because it wasnt making profit. Supply and demand, capitalism. It's what people voted for.

Gingernaut · 15/12/2019 18:23

In London, all kids under 16 ride the buses for free

In London one ticket works oneverybus and train and tube

In London the buses and trains run after 10 pm

can youimaginethe difference those improvements would make elsewhere in the country?

Here in the Midlands, children under 16 and students aged 16-18 with a photocard pay a reduced fare.

There are different options for different bus, train and tram operators, as well as a very expensive Swift card which can be used on all trains, buses and trams within a specific area.

It's complicated.

HoHoHoik · 15/12/2019 18:23

Exactly @ListeningQuietly! Such a small thing and it would make such a difference.

Based on where I live in Northumberland, transport is an issue. If you get a job and need to take the bus, your travel will be £27 a week for a bus pass but it can only be used on Arriva buses and only in two zones, additional zones cost more. You need to leave for work around two hours before your shift to account for additional traffic in rush hour and the extra stops for people to board/alight, when I worked in the city (ten miles away) and started work at 8.30am I had to get the 6am bus and it got me to the city for 8.10am. This meant the DC had to be awake by 4.45am then fed, dressed, and at the childminder for 5.45am which cost us a hefty premium for being 'out of hours' and we're lucky she agreed to accommodate it.

If you work varied shifts and use public transport, you're tied by buses because on a Sunday and Bank Holidays there are none before 10am and then they only operate once per hour. Monday to Saturday, first bus is at 6am, last bus is 11pm but only serves part of the route, buses after 6pm are once an hour.

Many 'local' destinations may be two or more buses away and the buses take a long route. There is a hospital that is twenty minutes away by car but two hours by bus and you have to get two of them, one bus to Blyth then another bus to the hospital itself. There is a council run play centre the DC like to go to, it's only five miles from us but if we have to bus there it is two buses and one of them only runs once an hour between 9am and 5pm so if you miss it, you have an hours wait beside a load of fields for the next one.

Lots of children are "four" until they're pushing six years old because four year olds are free but five year olds are half the adult fare.

I might actually email a link to this thread toniur new MP! "Here is a list of what we want..."

BarbaraofSeville · 15/12/2019 18:24

Exactly Listening.

Some years ago I watched a programme that featured troubled young people who used to ride buses in London as it was something they could do for free and keep warm and there was a comment about the night buses 'only' running every half an hour.

The rest of the country would weep with gratuide for buses that ran that often in rush hour and as for buses at night, well that sounds like witchcraft.

BoneyBackJefferson · 15/12/2019 18:29

GhostofFrankGrimes

Our rural bus service was cut because it wasnt making profit. Supply and demand, capitalism. It's what people voted for.

Ours was similar but it wasn't profit making/cost effective because it wasn't fit for purpose. So people went out and bought cars.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 15/12/2019 18:31

That's great for people who can afford cars.

Biancadelrioisback · 15/12/2019 18:37

@HoHoHoik I'm wondering if we're from the same area.
I have the same problem and it's a right nightmare.
For me, after 6pm there is only one bus per hour back to my town. If I miss it, it's a long, cold wait at Haymarket bus station which isn't the safest late at night or I have to somehow get to the otherside of the city to catch the train which comes again, once per hour but only just after the bus so chances of catching it are slim to none.

CactusAndCacti · 15/12/2019 18:38

I live in a leafy, rather naice, part of a big Leave-voting Yorkshire city.

Yorkshire isn't North, it's pretty much south.Xmas Wink

Disclaimer: Dad from S.Yorks, me from the Midlands, now live in the NE.

Biancadelrioisback · 15/12/2019 18:41

I've been attending the Clean Air Zone consultations in Newcastle lately and one thing that keeps getting repeated is they want to drive as many people onto public transport as possible (obviously) but they keep saying we all have to make allowances for the shitness for a while before it'll improve (more buses and improved routes if the demand is there). I tried to explain that that's fine, but I don't think DSs nursery or my work will be too happy with me coming and going to suit the buses rather than there being buses which suit modern day workers. Heck I work Mon-Fri 9am-5pm and I struggle to cope with the public transport

Biancadelrioisback · 15/12/2019 18:42

Anything south of Durham is the south Wink

CactusAndCacti · 15/12/2019 18:43

Are we going for Durham City or County Durham?

BoneyBackJefferson · 15/12/2019 18:44

GhostofFrankGrimes
That's great for people who can afford cars.

I didn't say that it was a perfect solution. In fact my parents couldn't afford a car for many years.

Biancadelrioisback · 15/12/2019 18:45

Hmmmm county Durham I think

CountFosco · 15/12/2019 18:54

I don't live far from Hartlepool, about 30 mins in a car, but I don't drive and the transport links from further afield where I am are not good. People can be as qualified as you need to be, but it's not much use if you can't get there.

I agree with your point in general and absolutely agree better bus services and train links are required (and I don't mean the likes of HS2, I mean replacing all the local lines ripped up in the 60s) but specifically for my company it absolutely is about the qualifications we require, it's high tech work and half the workforce has a PhD, new graduates earn above average and would easily afford to buy a decent car on finance if working for us.

The lack of family money is absolutely the barrier to getting a degree though, the level of debt is terrifying for people who come from families where no-one has a degree and there's no cushion if you don't get a job out of Uni.

PosiePie · 15/12/2019 18:55

Our rural bus service was cut because it wasnt making profit.

But if it's not running at the times it's needed, then it's not going to be used is it, because people still have to make other arrangements. I'd start at 7am and finish at 10pm should I work days, can get there for 7am, except Sunday and bank holiday (busiest days for hospitality!) Finish at 10pm is a £20 taxi because the last bus goes at 7.30pm - can't even go for a meal out in the evening on public transport. So it's a vicious cycle, no one uses them because they're not running when needed, so they're cut back even more.

FormerlyFrikadela01 · 15/12/2019 18:57

but they keep saying we all have to make allowances for the shitness for a while before it'll improve (more buses and improved routes if the demand is there).

It's all a bit chicken and egg isnt it. People wont use the service until it improves but it wont improve until people use the service.

user1497207191 · 15/12/2019 19:04

Our rural bus service was cut because it wasnt making profit. Supply and demand, capitalism. It's what people voted for.

Was it fit for purpose? I.e. was it a 24/7 operation with early and late services? Our village lost it's bus service under Blair due to lack of custom. Hardly surprising really, there wasn't a service early enough to get to the nearest town by 9am for school kids and workers, nor a bus service after 3pm to bring them home again. It was literally a 10am to 2pm service, Monday to Friday - a prime example of a chocolate fireguard and then they wonder why it wasn't used. The people who devise these things are absolute muppets.

Like how we can't get a train to Manchester Airport for the morning prime departures - the soonest flight we could catch in a morning is 10am - most morning flights have long departed. Same coming home, no train to service the latest night arrivals. As I say, run by muppets.

SupportHuman · 15/12/2019 19:14

The "service" isn't fit for purpose and is essentially unusable in many areas.

Round here (not the north, I'm actually in the south west) the village we live in has one bus that serves us. It runs hourly between 8am and 6pm. It costs £6.40 for an adult return to the nearest small town which is 4 miles away. When you arrive there, you have just missed the 3 different buses that run 2 hourly to other larger towns so you now have a 1hr 45 minute wait for an onwards service. The same is true on your return. A trip on the bus to a town 20 miles away (where the nearest Jobcentre and hospital are located) takes about 7 hours and that's if you turn round and come straight back without actually doing any shopping!

It also serves the nearest town with a train station (14 miles away, just shy of £8 for an adult return) but drops you off about a mile from the station (a steep uphill mile) and the first and last buses of the day just miss train services, so it's not possible to commute to the city that the train runs to.

It is run by a different company (with a different timetable) at weekends so a weekly ticket can only be used on weekdays.

FlatterNow · 15/12/2019 19:24

Our extremely marginal constituency has just gone Conservative. I would love to see:

a) Cheaper and more integrated public transport. To go by bus from our town-edge village into the town centre, a bus journey of less than ten minutes, costs a fiver, and drops you ten minutes from the train station at times which don't line up with the commuter services into the local city.
b) Help for the town centres - possibly something with business rates and rents to help businesses establish themselves, and, as above, make the transport work to bring people in cheaply.
c) Schools, colleges, and apprenticeships - giving young people real local opportunities.

chomalungma · 15/12/2019 19:26

Stop lumping "these areas" in together, for a start. Leave-voting areas in the North aren't one homogenous mass. Are you a Daily Fail journo, OP

I live in the North as well. I am well aware of the differences. I've lived up here for most of my life, apart from when I lived in London. I live in a Remain voting, Labour city - it's doing ok, but could be doing better.

I have been to many of the different areas that did vote to Leave.

This thread is about local ideas for local areas - what could improve their town.

But hey, thanks for explaining to me about how parts of the North are different to other parts. No fucking shit, Sherlock.

OP posts: