Irish racism in England

[angell84]

I am shocked. I am half English, half Irish. My Irish mum lived in England for a long time, gave birth to us children there with her English husband, and then moved back to Ireland.

The reason that she always gave me for returning to Ireland, was that, "she could not take the nastiness to her anymore". She described one incident of many to me: she went to my brother's primary teacher in England, and said that he had lost something, he must have been six at the time, and the teacher said to her , "sure what do you expect - he is half Irish".

I always thought of it in an abstract way, I never really understood what she meant. Until I spent quite a long time in the U.K this year.

I was absolutely shocked at the hatred and nastiness, and calling Irish people stupid.

How can it be possible? The U.K stole alot of Ireland's land, committed mass genocide during the famine, eradicated the Irish language,

And yet instead of apologising, many people are going around calling Irish people stupid.

Isn't it nearly unbelievable? It would be like a German going up to a Jew and calling them stupid. That it was their fault , thhat everything happened the way it did.

I am really shocked

@BillywigSting So despite all that wealth you grew up in Liverpool with not a garden to your name?

Oh, don’t rain on @LexMitior’s parade, @QuickstepQueen. She’s labouring under the delusion that NI is in Boris Johnson’s personal gift to do with as he pleases, and seems to imagine that the UK ‘striking out on its own’ means that all ties between Ireland and the UK are henceforth dissolved.

Lex, boris’ majority may make him more powerful in the UK, but hasn’t really changed power dynamics between the EU and the UK, except his large majority does at least mean that the EU has a counter party that should at least be able to follow through on the agreements that it negotiates. His large majority does mean he is no longer beholden to the DUP, which can only be beneficial to Ireland. I don’t understand what you mean when you say that what happens to NI is nothing? As the UK and Ireland become less aligned, the tensions and stresses on NI will increase surely?

No I said I grew up in Liverpool and Ireland. My dad had a place in Ireland, my mum and dad bought a small terraced house together in Liverpool. We lived in Liverpool in term time and went to school there for a few years, in the holidays we stayed in our house in Ireland. That swapped over when I was around 11 due to my dad's work, so I got, I think, the best of both worlds.

For some of my childhood I had an entire beach and acres of land to myself. For some of it I lived in the heart of an amazing city.

I decided to stay in Liverpool because as an adult I prefer the privacy and convenience of city living.

I stand to inherit a significant amount (two houses a farm and some land) and have never gone without, and have never lived anywhere rented.

My English protestant mother grew up poor. My Irish Catholic father did not.

I grew up somewhere in between as my dad moved to Liverpool to be with my mother and while he had a leg up in life, she most certainly did not.

Certainly no nannies, castles or silverware on her side. More like everyone in one room in the evening to save electricity on lightbulbs, bedsits and working from the age of 13 (didn't go to uni until after marrying my dad as my granny couldn't afford for her to not be working and the idea of someone as "common" as her going to university was laughable, despite the fact that she's actually pretty bloody clever and managed to get a 1st and a masters while I was a toddler)

And while I'm not a practicing Catholic I was raised Catholic and sure as shit know my rosary. (I am staunchly atheist as I think, personally, organised religion and the Catholic Church in particular has an awful lot to answer for), I have first hand experience of being both Catholic and privileged.

My cousin, incidentally, had a somewhat similar experience, except she had a nanny instead of a sahm, and my aunt stayed in Ireland so no city life for my cousin until my grandad bought her a house in Waterford.

He bought our current house for us outright too so no mortgage, myself and dp are both under 35.

He didn't believe that was a good idea for his own children, so they all bought their own, but as he became a great grandfather, saw fit to buy houses for his two grandaughters. They are both lovely houses with large gardens with mature trees, close to good schools etc and would be very much out of reach without his help.

Pretty sure that's the definition of privilege.

I'm very fucking lucky.

But "there are no affluent Catholics"?

No, sorry.

Bullshit.

Well I can revise my post on modest Irish people then........

Perhaps you can revise you stance on blanket assumptions?

I acknowledge that I am lucky and privileged. I do not openly talk about my wealth. I would not have nearly as much without the significant help of inherited wealth my family has enjoyed for at least four generations.

I don't really see how accepting that I have what I do, and had the advantages that I have had is mostly by sheer dumb luck is immodest tbh.

It would be immodest if I went around proclaiming my (non existent) superiority just because I'm lucky enough to be born into an affluent family.

I am however putting forward the case that 'there are no affluent catholics' is very obviously not true.

We're not all poor potato eating yokels.

I'm poor and eat potatoes! Although, with the price of spuds now, rice or pasta is more common!

As for we're not all potato eating yokels - are you suggesting some of us are?

You're not affluent btw. You grew up in a terraced house in Liverpool.

You do have the arrogant English attitude admittedly....

Dothehop this has to be a wind up...you couldn't really be that embittered and jealous of people who come from money.

Well maybe of the ones who live in the mansion on the hill.... Not the poor relations in a terraced house in Liverpool

I am in England (Berkshire) 30 years. My accent is the same as the day I left Dublin: I am female working in tech sales and I can honestly say I have NEVER experienced any kind of racism here.

On the contrary, my accent has been (I think) to my advantage.

I also grew up with a private beach.

Like I said, somewhere in between the two. I'm also definitely affluent now.

@DoTheHop, haven’t you ever read any of Kate O’Brien’s novels? They’re set almost entirely among prosperous upper-middle-class Catholic families of the type she came from herself, in the late 19th and early 20th centuries.

Doesn't anyone remember the Kerryman jokes? Exactly the same jokes but about (obvs) people from Kerry. I remember being given a book of Kerryman jokes from the local souvenir shop when I was visiting family. And Corkmen were always characterised as liars. At that time I think the same jokes in the USA were used against the Polish. It seemed to be a common attitude in those days, just levelled at different countries/people depending on where you came from

It's about the fact that Irish people who arrived in the USA were white and spoke English, but they were dirt poor, uneducated, catholic. They had to be relegated to be beneath white people
This.
Scruffy, few teeth, malnourished, arriving in droves, unique language, uneducated.
The statues on the docks always pull on my heart.
American's discovered they were also dreamers, story tellers, tricksters, most importantly willing to work for a better life.

Great to hear you're 'definitely affluent' now. Jesus. Did anyone ever come across such shite?

My favourite Kerryman joke is from the Kerry Herald.

Notice in the newspaper.

THE SWITCHING ON OF THE LIGHTS OF THE CHRISTMAS TREE WILL BE HELD AT 9PM SUNDAY IN THE TOWN SQUARE.

IF IT'S RAINING AT 9PM, IT WILL BE HELD AT 7PM INSTEAD. PLEASE ARRIVE ON TIME.

I grew up with Paddy the Irishman, the Scotsman and the Englishman.

Poor Paddy the Englishman was not the brightest...

Do you know what nationality the architect of the White House was? Interesting answer...

The poor Kerry man replaced the English man. Jokes were so unacceptable back then and always shared with DC
I am glad we moved into snowflake territory on some of them.

@BillywigSting Gis a lend will ye, or a wee weekend away on your private beach. 🤣

EmeraldShamrock ya potato eating yokel ya! Get off that beach!

I'm welsh and I get ludicrous things said to me at times. Wouldn't call it racism though.