To think school shouldn’t be charging for this?

[Indella]

Our school has a habit of expecting parental contributions for everything possible but the latest 2 things we’ve had letters about I don’t think falls under what a school can charge for.

The first one is my child has now started the compulsory school swimming lessons. These are part of the curriculum and so can’t be charged for. However parents have to pay £3 per child, per week for the transport to the swimming lessons. Is this not the school’s responsibility to fund as the swimming lessons are compulsory?

The second one is an “art and crafts day”. Letter says children will be spending the day, still in school, doing Christmas themed arts and crafts. They have asked for £12 per child for the materials. This is being held at school, in school hours and is instead of the normal lessons. I legally have to send my child to school so it’s compulsory. Letter doesn’t say voluntary contribution so I assume again we have no choice but to pay but surely the school can do arts and crafts with the children that don’t cost so much. 28 children in the class so £336 of art supplies! Sounds like they are using parents to re-stock supplies for the year.

I know they are not huge amounts but add that to the fact we paid £3 each entry to the school Christmas fair (including having to pay for the accompanying parent) and £10 each for tickets to watch the Christmas performance. Plus the never ending non-uniform days it’s really starting to add up and it feels like the school are simply using parental contributions to fund what should be covered by the school.

AIBU to think these things shouldn’t be charged for?

Education should be free at the point of entry. A third of children are living in poverty and parents can’t pay to put food on the table so to be asked for craft money is awful. I say this as a teacher who pays out of their own pocket for resources and ransacks Free face book groups. If, as Whitney put it so enthusiastically, the children are our future, the government we vote for need to be putting a lot more investment in it

@SleeplessWB my kids secondary makes requests for supplies

Putthekettleonplease - it's very much a part of the state system. Swimming is on the national curriculum and should be delivered just as reading is.

There was a professional swimmer on TV a couple of years ago who said that all swimming in all schools is funded and is free and that schools should not be charging. I know one that charges and they walk round the corner so transport doesn't come into it. There must be something somewhere that states its for free.

Give the children their own craft supplies to donate! If they don't use the schools supplies, then they can't charge you. To be honest, I would be speaking with the other parents about this and maybe organise "donating" your own supplies for far less money. It will stop them dreaming up ideas to make money out of parents.

It sounds like they are underfunded, but well aware of the affluence in your area and are trying to get as much as they can out of the parents. I find it really unfair on low income families. If you don't pay, what will they do exactly? They might reduce what they ask for if it becomes an issue.

Agree that although the schools are underfunded, the more these things are a success, the more parents will be relied on to make up the shortfall. It's simply not fair on parents who are struggling financially.

Paying for the coach to swimming is unreasonable as swimming is part of the curriculum. £12 for one days art and craft is very expensive and I wouldn't expect to pay for this at primary school. I think the Christmas performance is a good way of raising money but should only be £2 each is reasonable.

'Am I being unreasonable in directing my annoyance at the underfunded school?' Yes. YABU.

But in this case the school is not managing its limited funding efficiently. I couldn't read the letter, but the OP seems to have said that the money from ticket sales for the play are nothing to do with costs of producing the play and are just a way of raising some extra cash for the school, because they have more classes, and therefore teachers, than they need.
When we put on a school production there is no charge, just a collection for charity at the end. £12 for an art and craft day is taking the piss.

Yes schools need more money but these charges sound ridiculous. Yanbu. It's not the norm in my experience. A pound here or there, an optional raffle donation, a charity donation for the nativity fine. 12 quid for a craft day and a tenner for the play is crazy. Lots of schools walk to the swimming baths.

Topazance the government have published fairly clear guidelines on what schools are allowed to charge for (rather than request a voluntary donation) and it isn't very much at all. Swimming, during the school day, is not an activity they can charge for, not even the transport:
assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/706830/Charging_for_school_activities.pdf

my daughter is at a rural school in Scotland they have composite classes all the time here the rules are generally 1 teacher per 30 pupils but a composite class can only have 25 so if you have 100 pupils spread over 7 year groups you will get 4 teachers if you have 105 you get 5 teachers, some year groups are bigger than others my daughters year is only 11 so she has been in a composite class all along this year she is in a P6/5 class ( all 6's and half 5's) and there is a 5/4 class too last year when in P5 her class was split this year all p6's together and they will be next year as a 7/6 class
in OP school the YR and Y1 class add up to 29 so in reality they will always be combined as they move up the school however if next year the intake is only 15 they will be a YR/1 class and a Y2/1 class
our school since August have asked for £ 5 for transport for school trip £1 for non uniform day ( in aid of Children in Need) and £2 for a visiting drama group so £8 altogether, the school get some money from the book fair depending on what sells,

the school has a set of costumes for nativity they have used the same ones for past 6 years and probably longer
they ask for donations of boxes for junk modelling etc
completely voluntary out of school
£1.50 for adults and 50p for kids entrance to Christmas fair by PTA
the PTA also did hallowe'en disco which was £2 including hotdog and squash, there will be a box for donations at Christmas service/ nativity but that will be for Charity

If parents continue to suck up these costs, the more costs will be passed onto you. Easier for school to get money from parents than the govt.
My advice is to decide what is reasonable and pay that. Don't pay for things you consider to be taking the piss. I wouldn't pay for the coach if the distance is walkable. I would also only send in a £5 for art and craft day.
I personally would not have agreed to pay £10 per ticket for the Christmas play - that would have led to a more formal complaint, particularly since you were charged for the baby too. If school want decent relationships with parents, they can't treat us like cash cows!
In all honesty I'd prefer schools to waste less time on rehearsals for school plays and arsing around with crafts and more time on Maths and Literacy.

@BoomBoomsCousin That guidance is very interesting. Especially as the school NEVER say it’s voluntary on their letters and have excluded children who haven’t paid before.

@Aderyn19 I did complain about the ticket prices the first year she was in school. I was told that’s the rule. I emailed the head directly to complain. She offered to reduce the tickets slightly as I said I couldn’t afford it. I went to reception to buy my reduced tickets and they had sold out while I was waiting for my complaint to be resolved. I’ve simply paid from then on as it’s my child who misses out otherwise.

the school NEVER say it’s voluntary on their letters and have excluded children who haven’t paid before.

Other than music and, to a limited extent, residential courses, if they're excluding them from activities during the school day (rather than, say, after school, voluntary activities) they are almost certainly not acting lawfully. Of course, enforcing the school doing the right thing is difficult if they outright refuse once it's been pointed out. The trouble some parents have enforcing their children's rights to an education when they have SEN is a clear testament to how poorly schools are held to account in this regard.

This is what you get after 10 years of a Tory government.

It will be interesting to see if this improves with the promised injection of money into education. Sure it can’t be compulsory what happens to the kids who’s parents have no money?

.

@Pixxie7 kids who have no money just won’t get a decent education. just like it already happens with SENDs kids - pay private or accept your child won’t get an education.

OP escalate your complaint to the governors and the LEA. A school shouldn't be selling out of tickets with some parents not getting any and they shouldn't be pricing parents out of seeing their own child's nativity play. I think you have to escalate your complaints.
My DC primary allocated two tickets per family. They sold raffle tickets on the door for the class hampers, which each child contributed to for £1 each.
It's not your responsibility to fund their management choices.
Not defending Tory cuts but I had older DC who went to school during the Labour years and schools pestered parents for money then too. This won't magically go away if labour wins the election.

@Indella all the charges are voluntary which is why in my first response I suggested you ask for a copy of their charges and remissions policy. They cannot refuse to include kids whose intents can't pay. Tbh if more people refused they'd stop doing these pointless activities . Non uniform days for example are insane

I can see the swimming charges TBH .When my DC were at primary School ,We paid £30 per term then !(about 6 years ago).But the craft day does seem expensive .

Also the Swimming pool was in the School grounds!

YABVU The school is hugely underfunded. You reckon you know how it could be run better by merging classes from two different key stages with different curriculums. What you're suggesting isn't practical and would impact the education those in year R/1 are getting in a HUGE way. Even in schools with mixed classes it's never R/1 so are you happy for your child's class to merge further up the school and go for a class size of 40+? Where do you reckon they find a teacher willing to take on that absurdity? The school is doing the right thing by asking for contributions. If you can't afford it don't pay it. Yes it will mean your child being left out of fun things but it's better than compromising the core education they receive.

My ds primary school is the same they charge for everything and are very clever with the wording so you have to ask if these charges are a voluntary contribution.

Swimming is funded and schools can only ask for voluntary contributions towards the transport - just ignore it and don't pay it

It's the same with these theme days, don't pay it

£3.00 a week seems ok if they are hiring a coach to take the kids. coach hire can be expensive.

Not when the children could perfectly well walk to the pool less than half a mile away.

It does sound as if the reality is that the crafts day is intended to subsidise materials for several months, and it would be more honest of them to be upfront and say so.

If the school has small classes I can see that they will be struggling with funding, given that a class teacher costs the same whether she's teaching 10 or 30 pupils. You are right, they should really to to vertical banding and have around four classes.

re you happy for your child's class to merge further up the school and go for a class size of 40+?

Where does it say that mergers would result in class sizes like that? OP says there are 12 children in Reception and 17 in Year 1, so that could be an entirely viable class of 29. If those classes attract more children, the school will get more funding and could rethink. However, the fact that it has only managed to attract such low numbers in the early years may well be symptomatic of a longer term problem which they cannot address by putting up the price of tickets for school plays.