I know IABU... but why would my friend choose to get pregnant?!

[IShineAShoe]

I’ll start by saying this woman is a very dear friend, I have known her for years.. but she can be very hard work.
She has a lot of issues around money. She has plenty, her husband drunkenly mentioned her savings account with £40k in it one night we were out together as a group. She is notoriously tight, hates spending more than she has to. For her hen weekend a few years ago we travelled to a uk city a few hours away by train and spent every night in a cheap chain pub because she didn’t want to spend a lot, and chose a hotel 2miles outside the city centre and made us walk everywhere because it was cheaper (by about £10) and taxis were a waste of money. At times she has ended up on medication because she gets very anxious about spending money.

She also has a few issues around her weight, she has worked well in the last couple years doing strict diets and she goes to the gym 3/4 times a week. She is very image conscious and gets very anxious if she thinks she’s putting on weight.

On top of that she is very house proud in terms of cleanliness. If anything is out of place she gets very upset and plans her week around her cleaning schedule.

Everything in my head is screaming that why on earth does she want a baby?! I had my first 3 years ago and there were a lot of comments from her about everything that a baby brings e.g they are so expensive, they’ll make a mess, pregnancy changing her body. I honestly thought she had ruled out children. 6 months ago she announced she was 7 weeks pregnant, and on the same breath asked how I was getting on Ttc, unfortunately I had the previous week suffered a miscarriage at 6 weeks, so I told her this. I get that I might be feeling a little raw about this due to the circumstances, but she’s complaining to me about everything despite knowing I should be going through the same things she is, and I’m not.

Her latest thing is about towels. She’s had long serious discussions with me about blankets, how many does she need? Are they essential? Can she just use a throw she already has for the sofa? It’s ridiculous. She’s also got very upset about spending money on other “essentials” such as muslins (!!), bottles, steriliser, baby furniture and the pram. I remember the joy I had when I was preparing for my first and getting to choose all the things he would need. She has none of that, everything is about trying to save money. She’s already saved a lot by buying second hand, but it’s not enough! She’s kept a running total of it all and in her words “it’s made her feel sick”.

I can’t help but really worry about her, and her baby! I’ve encouraged her to go to baby groups to make mum friends and get out the house when she’s on mat leave, but it’s always about the cost and how she can’t afford it (when i know that she can). I’m hoping when baby is here she’ll relax about things and spend the money on what baby needs (and the things that will make her life easier!). I don’t want to distance myself from her, but I’m exhausted by it all and a little resentful that she’s having a baby and miserable about it when she knows my baby would have been almost due too.

YABU. I'm not really seeing the issue to be honest, just lots of judgement. My SIL is a huge 'saver' and bought everything secondhand for her firstborn. She scoured local selling sites for hours to try and find the best deals. Not my thing, but she was very proud of how much money she had saved - money she was then able to spent doing fun things with the baby once he was here! She's a brilliant mother and dotes on her DS hugely.

And I hate this myth that wanting to have a clean house makes you a terrible parent. My house is immaculate because the baby naps for three hours a day and the 4 year old is at school. Neither of my children are remotely deprived because I want them to live in a clean house

It really doesn't sound like you like your friend all that much.

Sorry for your loss. That is hard. But maybe being in company with this friend a lot is not a great idea when your loss is so raw and she doesn’t seem to be tactful either. I think distance yourself for the time being. And let her get on with things her own way.

I’m not really sure what I can do right now.
Half the people on this thread have said I am unreasonable and resentful because she is pregnant and I am not.

Baby is not yet here, she is still coping with her day to day life, she’s not yet started mat leave, she is attending fortnightly midwife appointments, she is stressing and trying to prepare for her baby’s arrival. This has been her for the last 6/7 months, there’s been no escalation. Every week it’ll be a new phone call or messages “do I need a thermometer? This one is on sale, should I try and find one 2nd hand?”. But it won’t be any more urgent than the discussions about towels, or cot sheets. It’s exhausting going through this for every little thing, for both myself and for her, but as some PPs have said, it might ease when baby is here.

If there are clearly issues continuing when baby is here then I’ll tell her straight. She’s sought all the help before with her anxiety when she felt she wasn’t coping, I have no reason to believe she won’t do that again if things get bad? I know when I had my little boy there was a lot of checking the mums mental health and lots of questionnaires, if anyone close to her doesn’t pick up anything that could be a concern, I’m sure the professionals will.

So this lady

• is slim and healthy
• has a tidy house
• does not enjoy spending unnecessary money
• is different to you

None of that is a reason not to have a baby. Lots of people have babies, and we're all different.

I am slim, healthy, very houseproud, funny about germs, and careful with money. I absolutely loved the baby days. My house stayed clean and tidy, my bank balance ok, and my friends were mostly not jealous.

After babies 1+2 I stayed very slim, mostly due to exercise. After baby 3 I found no time to exercise, and had diastasis recti. I no longer have such a nice figure, but I do not regret my babies! My bank balance is also less healthy, but my house is still clean.

Nobody is going to know the type of mum she will be. I worry at the moment because it seems to be all about spending as little as possible. It will be much more obvious when child is older whether they are potentially missing out on things that they need, the things that a newborn 100% “needs” are very few.

Their financial set up to me is very odd, but nothing has ever been said which makes me think that either she or her husband are unhappy about it. So that is none of my business.

So it wouldn’t worry you at all @Poetryinaction if your list was thus:

• deprives herself to the point of exhaustion to preserve her figure
• leaves baby to cry endlessly so she can clean, or falls into depression because she’s putting unnecessary pressure on herself
• makes things harder because doesn’t want to spend additional fiver on new bottles, like the baby has wind issues and could do with a different style
• have no counter to ‘is different to you’ because it’s a ridiculous thing to say

I think you’ll find that most people plus OP’s concerns are that this woman is ripe for PND if she find herself stressing too much and not being able to fulfil her obsessive tendencies; this could lapse into detriment to the child.

But hey, you were slim with a clean and tidy house so it’s exactly the same, right?

@Poetryinaction she does not enjoy spending money full stop. She spends so much of her time obsessing over money she has to spend that she has been given anti anxiety medication because she gets herself into such a mess. Was this the same as you “being careful with money”? my worries are not fictional because I am jealous.

I agree about the MH issues - that is a lot further down the line than being "careful with money".

I would only say that she is likely to need a lot of support when the baby comes, and it sounds like you don't want to give that (you are not under a duty to, of course!). Does she have any other friends or family who will help her?

Sorry for your loss OP. Your friend could be a great Mum, you just don't know. Maybe you should withdraw somewhat from her. I'm sorry but you don't seem to like her much

Tell her you obviously can't advise on baby-related questions and that while you're pleased for her, you are also finding your own situation hard. You are not responsible for her, and your feelings count too.

Firstly, sorry for your loss.

I cannot hugely relate over the body consciousness (my form of exercise is lifting up my bar of chocolate!) or the obsessive cleanliness, but for the tidying I know people who are very house proud and bordering on obsessive with it. She may well not be so much after the baby is here.

The money side I completely relate to. You almost sound annoyed that she has money in the bank and has more money than you. I don't like to spend money either and like to have money in the bank just in case. You don't know what the future will hold, so having money as a safety net is important to me as well.

As far as buying things for the baby, I am pregnant with my first and it is daunting so I can see where she is coming from. I do not want to spend lots of money on things I don't need either but have no idea what I do need. For example, for babygrows I have seen everything from having 8 to 20+ and then deciding on sizes etc. For baby bottles I would have no idea how many you need - most seem to come in sets of 4 or 6 but have no idea if that would be enough. You know you need things and want to make sure you have what you need, but don't really know what you need and don't want to waste money buying things you won't use when you could use the money for something else that you need later.

As I say, I can completely understand how she is being (not so much about not wanting to spend money on petrol!). Perhaps just make her a list of what you needed and suggest she checks out charity shops and sales for what else she needed. I know there are some nearly new baby sales and the like so she may be able to pick up some things she needs cheaply so she will not feel bad if she ends up with too much going to waste.

As far as muslins are concerned I see her point about them - until I started reading some of the threads on here I had no idea how many people use and how much they use them for!

As I said, speak to her, and ask her to ask her mum or the midwife, if she has any questions, because you're finding it hard, due to your loss.

Maybe you need to remind her about that.

Your friend just seems like the greatest worrier of all things that's all,and should not really have the well worn mental health tag put on her. She maybe extremely worried about having her baby.and how she will cope,and how it will change her lifestyle in all things. All the things that you have stated about her,she is probably doing,to mask other worries about a baby in her life.

Hopefully,a new baby in her arms,will change her perception about most things then.

The money side I completely relate to. You almost sound annoyed that she has money in the bank and has more money than you. I don't like to spend money either and like to have money in the bank just in case. You don't know what the future will hold, so having money as a safety net is important to me as well.

She's not just "careful" with money, she's on medication because spending any, causes her deep anxiety.

This woman doesn't need to be so obsessive about having to spend money on the baby, as she's not in poverty, but she's involving OP too much, when OP is still having to deal with her own loss.
It has nothing to do with OP having less money and being jealous or anything.

I changed my mind overnight about children.
I absolutely used to cringe at toddlers and preteens and all the rest, could never imagine myself bringing one up. It just wasn’t me.

I’m now 33 weeks pregnant and can not wait to have her here and am overjoyed.

People change their minds and it’s frankly none of your business at the end of the day OP.

Your friend just seems like the greatest worrier of all things that's all,and should not really have the well worn mental health tag put on her.

She's on medication for it, of course she has mental health issues!

I should say that I genuinely have no issue with answering her questions within reason. I have three other friends due in the new year and I love talking baby stuff and sharing my own experiences when I had my son three years ago. I’m not wanting to live in a baby free bubble because I had a miscarriage, but I want to share in the excitement and joy, but I’m not getting that side from her. I understand everyone has worries before baby arrives and no one really knows the things to buy, but this is obsessive. If it was a balance, then fine, but she’s not said anything she’s looking forward to, everything is about being worried about how much baby costs. I’m not saying that she’s not feeling joy and excitement, hopefully she is, but she’s not sharing any of that with me.

I’m sorry but YABU, your sadness over your loss is making you resent her because you feel she is not appreciative enough about her baby.

I’m sorry but some people are more frantic about money even if they have a lot because of their upbringing. You can’t say she won’t be a good mother just because she worries over the costs of things. I think you should tell her that you would prefer less of the baby talk when you are around if you are still feeling upset over the loss but I think you are projecting too much on her and seem overinvested in how she behaves about her pregnancy.

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This

@IShineAShoe, I’m sorry for your loss.

I wonder if you’re just finding the intensity of her questions hard to deal with in light of your loss? She’s asking you a lot of questions, presumably because you’re already a mum and she wants to be well-prepared.

Regarding the money - it might be absolutely fine. My DM has receipts for literally every penny she has spent since 1970. Everything is in a spread sheet and she is meticulous in looking for deals. She was and is an absolutely amazing mum.

If we do have an odd time where we go out, and she’ll offer to buy me a cup of tea, I know that small gesture for her is huge

Don’t not believe that cup of tea isn’t filed away as a cost under your name.
Or like my mother, anyone outside the family was treated to all sorts of things.

I never had any toys as if she had workmen in and they had children she would give away anything of mine as she wanted them to see her as this extraordinary generous woman and they would come back and do work for her.

I missed the bit about cleaning when I wrote my first post.

I was actually going to mention it as a thing that my mother did as well.

Those saying that being slim, having a clean house and being careful with money isn’t a problem.
My mother described herself as similar and would question people on why everyone thought of her as being out of control or mentally unwell.
But it would become an obsession to the point of threatening suicide if during a meal she decided the table was messy and needed cleaning so would start clearing the table before we had finished eating. Plates taken and food scraped into the bin.

Things would regularly end up with her being sectioned because the control over food, money and the cleaning couldn’t be met.

As a child growing up in that household we never went anywhere as first we had to clean the house.
This would involve cleaning every droplet on every chandelier we had in every room.
Polishing miles of skirting boards and hoovering rooms 3 times etc before we could leave.

We never got to the end before bedtime so would have to start again in the morning.

She would plan holidays abroad either camping, caravanning or in a motor home. Never in a hotel.

We would be back after 3 days because she would say that she had a bad feeling that someone in the family needed help. Usually though it was because she thought the dust was settling.

I grew up with someone like your friend and she needs putting straight now.

Yes you can buy secondhand and there are things you buy that you might not need and there are things you don’t buy but need to buy but if she is expecting to obsessively control her spending and cleaning and not end up sectioned then she needs to let go and throw away her list of baby costs now.

Babies cost money, toddlers cost money, children cost money and teenagers cost even more and they are messy, untidy and individual people who aren’t going to fall in with what you want to do.

I would hope a severe reality check would make her snap out of these obsessions but unfortunately I think she is too far down the rabbit hole.

ActualHornest
Those things would worry me, yes. But being careful with, or anxious about money, doesn't necessarily mean you will deprive your baby.
It is very unfair to question why someone would choose to have children, even if they do suffer anxiety. I was extremely careful with what I bought for the babies. So much of it seemed like waste. I got a lot for free or second hand, but I never, ever compromised their health or wellbeing.
Assuming someone will be a bad mother because they are anxious about health, money or cleanliness is wrong. By all means, look out for signs of PND, as you would in any friend. But don't automatically think badly of her. All sorts of people want children and are good or bad at various parts of looking after them.

Very well said indeed poetry

@Oliversmumsarmy wow that’s extreme!

Sorry to hear of your loss OP. Distancing yourself from her lm afraid sounds the best course of action, she sounds hard work and selfish (obviously tight but you know that already!). I have a so called friend who despite knowing of my fertility issues, is keen to compete with who has it “worse”. For the record she always thinks it’s her and ‘having children is so hard and you don’t know what it’s like’. Well clearly, we have fertility issues and our IVF has just failed. She is very much kept at arms length and l rarely instigate contact which is quite easy as she expects me to do all the running

A lot of people have poor insight into themselves and parenthood. She is one of those people. I’m surely there will be much more hysteria when the baby is sick everywhere, grows out of clothes too quickly etc etc

To be fair OP when I was pregnant with DS (accidental pregnancy) I wasn’t excited or full of joy at all, and I was planning how I could get back to work as soon as possible, the moment I held him in my arms the world fell away and he was the only person that mattered, not feeling connected to your child in pregnancy has no baring on how loving a mum can be.

You do seem like you are judging her as being undeserving of a baby because she isn’t behaving in the way you think she should.

It sounds much more than anxiety and more of an OCD issue. Medications aren't the solution without therapy to address her OCD tenancies and beliefs which may get worse with a baby. It might be worth gently suggesting she preemptively look into perinatal mental health service support.
It sounds like you are being very strong for her and supporting her through this time that she may be quite overwhelmed with especially with your loss which I'm sorry to hear about.