I know IABU... but why would my friend choose to get pregnant?!

[IShineAShoe]

I’ll start by saying this woman is a very dear friend, I have known her for years.. but she can be very hard work.
She has a lot of issues around money. She has plenty, her husband drunkenly mentioned her savings account with £40k in it one night we were out together as a group. She is notoriously tight, hates spending more than she has to. For her hen weekend a few years ago we travelled to a uk city a few hours away by train and spent every night in a cheap chain pub because she didn’t want to spend a lot, and chose a hotel 2miles outside the city centre and made us walk everywhere because it was cheaper (by about £10) and taxis were a waste of money. At times she has ended up on medication because she gets very anxious about spending money.

She also has a few issues around her weight, she has worked well in the last couple years doing strict diets and she goes to the gym 3/4 times a week. She is very image conscious and gets very anxious if she thinks she’s putting on weight.

On top of that she is very house proud in terms of cleanliness. If anything is out of place she gets very upset and plans her week around her cleaning schedule.

Everything in my head is screaming that why on earth does she want a baby?! I had my first 3 years ago and there were a lot of comments from her about everything that a baby brings e.g they are so expensive, they’ll make a mess, pregnancy changing her body. I honestly thought she had ruled out children. 6 months ago she announced she was 7 weeks pregnant, and on the same breath asked how I was getting on Ttc, unfortunately I had the previous week suffered a miscarriage at 6 weeks, so I told her this. I get that I might be feeling a little raw about this due to the circumstances, but she’s complaining to me about everything despite knowing I should be going through the same things she is, and I’m not.

Her latest thing is about towels. She’s had long serious discussions with me about blankets, how many does she need? Are they essential? Can she just use a throw she already has for the sofa? It’s ridiculous. She’s also got very upset about spending money on other “essentials” such as muslins (!!), bottles, steriliser, baby furniture and the pram. I remember the joy I had when I was preparing for my first and getting to choose all the things he would need. She has none of that, everything is about trying to save money. She’s already saved a lot by buying second hand, but it’s not enough! She’s kept a running total of it all and in her words “it’s made her feel sick”.

I can’t help but really worry about her, and her baby! I’ve encouraged her to go to baby groups to make mum friends and get out the house when she’s on mat leave, but it’s always about the cost and how she can’t afford it (when i know that she can). I’m hoping when baby is here she’ll relax about things and spend the money on what baby needs (and the things that will make her life easier!). I don’t want to distance myself from her, but I’m exhausted by it all and a little resentful that she’s having a baby and miserable about it when she knows my baby would have been almost due too.

She sounds unwell tbh. But not someone I could have around me. Life's too short. You say she is a dear friend, but you haven't said a single positive thing about her which balances this awful behaviour. Is she actually a friend, or just someone you've known a long time / a friend out of habit? Sorry if that sounds rude, but after years on MN I've noticed wide variations in what people consider friends to be.

I do like her, and she will always be my friend. I can’t see how that will help her if I am not there for her. She is involving me by telling me these things and asking my opinions, I am trying to give her the best advice I can and trying to ease some of her worries of spending money by giving her things she’ll need like a Moses basket and baby bath. I might not know exactly how to help her, but I am trying. I don’t agree with all her choices but obviously I’ll be there for her to help her if she needs/wants it.

Do you think she may have OCD? It sounds very familiar to a close family member that suffers with it. If so, I would keep a close eye on her after birth to make sure she is doing ok, sometimes it can make OCD obsessions worse. it could also develop into a child protection later on.

I'm sorry for your loss, I think she has been very insensitive

I’m sorry to say this but she sounds like she will make her child’s life a misery with these attitudes. Have you told her straight that she’s being ridiculous?

She is a long term friend and we had a lot of good times together. She’s great to pick up the phone to and have a chat and she loves playing with my son. If we do have an odd time where we go out, and she’ll offer to buy me a cup of tea, I know that small gesture for her is huge, and shows that she is a kind and generous person. Is she a great friend? Not at the moment and some of her behaviours are difficult and exhausting for me, but I see that she struggles with them too.
I’m not a doctor, but I see she has problems there. I’m not going to write her off as a friend because of it.

I get that general opinion is that IABU, I appreciate everyone who has commented and shared their thoughts.

I agree with those saying she sounds either ill or bordering on it.

Looking after your money is fine. When it spills over into situations similar to @Oliversmumsarmy then it’s a problem.

What do you say when she’s asking these things? Do you just tell her she’ll be fine? Do you ask her if she’s planning on relaxing the cleaning schedule?

The money thing in itself is odd but combined with everything else it’s a bit worrying. I’d encourage her to open up to her HV about her concerns around cost and cleanliness.

I have told her on many occasions that if it makes life with a baby easier, then it is money well spent. For mostly everything, she doesn’t need it all right away so if I see her struggling I can remind her to part with the cash when things will maybe be seen as essential e.g needing more than 2 baby bottles as she can’t keep up with washing and sterilising them or maybe needing to buy another blanket if baby pukes or poops on them.

@IShineAShoe there are people that cherish above all else ‘keeping their nose out’ and ‘not rocking the boat’. Meanwhile, in real life, sometimes we need to offer advice and support before someone has asked.

I’m sorry for your loss. While I think this might heighten any ‘not fair’ personal feelings I think your concern for your friend and her baby is justified.

Have you spoke to her husband btw? What does he think of her obsessive tendencies?

She's not your friend though? She spends all her time complaining at you, is completely insensitive to your feelings and is ungrateful for the baby things you've lent her. Why are you under the impression you are friends? None if this is how a good friend behaves.

Obviously she has serious mental health issues that need to be addressed. If you actually care about this women (and her poor, sockless child) then have a serious sit down talk with her where you tell her that her pathalogical aversion to spending money is ruining her life, and will cause huge concerns with the health visitor when the baby's born.

I think if she lived in a council flat and was displaying this behaviour SS would be involved. Women with absolutely nothing are expected to put their baby first and usually do. This is the perfect storm for emotional abuse.

Perhaps the baby wasn't planned?

And even if it was, YABU. I definitely wanted kids, but the sheer cost of everything drove me to distraction during pregnancy. Once DS arrived, I stopped caring as much. I think worrying about finances was an outlet for how rubbish I felt in pregnancy and how desperate I was for everything to continue normally for as long as possible.

**I feel very sorry for this baby.

That child deserves a mother who will put them first every time and not someone who has money and her body first and baby coming in a poor 3rd

Your friend is deeply unhinged and needs professional help not a pregnancy.**

^Completeley agree. That poor baby is in for such a sad life with a mother like that

All the things she’s asked me are in regards to baby things she needs to buy. She’s done reading online about things people recommend, but ive said how a lot of these “essential lists” depends on the baby and it’s a guide. When She asked about the baby bottles, I told her that 2 were not going to be enough, but that she might end up spending money on bottles baby doesn’t like. I want her to understand that it’s very likely she’ll spend money and not “get the use” out of things.

She’s not brought up the cleaning stuff, and I haven’t either. I mentioned it because it’s something other people would strike as strange how obsessively she cleans, and how this typically won’t fit in well with life with a small child. But honestly, it might not be an issue when she has the baby, and she knows what she’s dealing with. Right now, she’s not had the baby and she’s not really been around small babies, so she doesn’t fully know what to expect, like any first time mum! There’s no point in me trying to prepare her for everything, she’s not asked for any practical advice like that, so until she does I’ll butt out of that side. And just remind her that yes, baby needs socks!

She has her husband and her mum on hand to help her with all the baby routine stuff. And she knows I’ll be there to talk about anything she wants to talk about.

I’m hoping that when baby is here she will start to see that money will need to be spent on some things. If it is clear she is struggling with certain things then I’ll do everything I can to help her, as will her mum and husband I’m sure.

Initially I thought like PP that having a baby will help her (the loss of control). But the thing to me that most suggests she might actually need some help is the post where you say she and DH split finances based on what they eat! How tedious. And the goal of £100k like her parents. Saving money is obviously to be applauded, but doing it for ‘money’s sake’ seems unhealthy, and she doesn’t sound happy, so I think it is less ‘horses for courses’. If she were happy and careful, that’s fine. But the obsessiveness and a goal that doesn’t seem to aim for joy (are her parents happy with their financial freedom?) makes me think she might benefit from some kind of counselling to try and understand what is driving this, because it’s probably more about control and less about cash.

I think your friend is a little bit like how I was, still am but not as bad I check my online bank account at least 3 times a day. I’ve got enough money for the month and savings but still live in a heightened state of stress over money. I’ve been very poor in the past, I also have a notebook always with me and check off each bill as it leaves my account.

When I was expecting my daughter even though I could afford it I bought a secondhand cot, secondhand pram, used old t-shirts instead of buying muslins, didn’t buy a baby bath and used the kitchen sink instead.

If it helps I have chilled out a bit and much of that was due to the needs of my daughter and I’ve become more realistic.

I’d still buy secondhand though for pram etc, don’t see the need for all brand new.

Also sorry for your loss

I think OP is obsessing more about 'friend's' money position than the 'friend' herself!

She still deserves to be a mum! She may be a wonderful parent. No one knows how they'll feel until they have their own baby. That would be a very lucky child being born to a mum with such a a decent amount of savings.

I’ve just remembered I also only bought one pack of baby grows thinking how many can a small baby surely need, in hospital the midwife laughed at me, I soon learnt to be realistic.

OP I have a friend who sounds very similar.
Would openly criticise anyone who had children. They are expensive, they are ungrateful, they bleed you dry etc. When she announced very publicly that she was ttc she cut anyone off who challenged her based on her past opinions.
Her and her DH are the tightest people I know. She received an inheritance (more then £50k) and still continued to complain about being skint, everything is so expensive. We went out for a coffee and she made her husband transfer the cost of a coffee into her account before she would get in the queue for drinks. I was literally open mouthed.
Now their child is here. She hasn’t changed. Still does everything on the smallest possible budget. Even down to resticting numbers at the child’s b day parties and messaging individual guests in advance to see if their child would like a party bag.
I’m actually a fan of second hand markets but she does things like sells on gifts that were brought for her child. It all strikes me as so mean. I just feel like I can’t relate to her at all and as a result naturally spend less time with her and the child. It’s a shame.

I’m not at all against 2nd hand stuff, a lot of things I bought for my son were preloved and still in great condition.

Her baby is due in the next month, so at least the stressing about preparing will be almost over. I do care about my friend, and I’m sad that it seems she’s had so little joy out of being pregnant and looking forward to her new arrival
I have every hope that motherhood brings her a lot more enjoyment and that the money issues etc are no longer issues when baby arrives. Having known my friend for decades and seeing how this pregnancy has made her even more money focused, I think there could still be issues ahead.

Baby was planned btw, I just find it difficult to understand her reasoning for it knowing everything she does know. But obviously baby is coming soon and i have everything crossed that she does find joy in her baby.

She can self refer to Time To Talk and may be eligible for some help such as CBT. It sounds like she has financial OCD. OCD is a shit because it grows and grows until it takes over your life.
Your poor friend.

Really it's impossible to make an essentials list as every baby and parenting style is different.
I would tell her that talking endlessly about this stuff upset you because of the miscarriage. Maybe she'll lay off a bit. (I' m sorry for your loss)
It sounds like she is adamant about her ways and views and you won't be able to get her to budge anyway.
There might be mental health issues at play here, but unless she wants help for them herself, there isn't anything you can do about it. Just try and save your sanity by avoiding endless rehashings of what she needs to buy/ how expensive things are.

I’m sorry but YABU, your sadness over your loss is making you resent her because you feel she is not appreciative enough about her baby.

I’m sorry but some people are more frantic about money even if they have a lot because of their upbringing. You can’t say she won’t be a good mother just because she worries over the costs of things. I think you should tell her that you would prefer less of the baby talk when you are around if you are still feeling upset over the loss but I think you are projecting too much on her and seem overinvested in how she behaves about her pregnancy.

So what are you going to do OP? Just stay silent and encourage her to buy more than 3 vests when she rings you? She's not going to get better by herself. It sounds like she's surrounded by people who feed her anxiety (her parents are like this and her husband splits shopping based on who eats what) so she might not know how strange and worrying her behaviour is.

She's a prime candidate for PND and any health visitor would be alarmed by her obsession with buying as little as possible. You are doing her no favours by watching her circle the drain while keeping your nose out.

YANBU to be worried about her, she sounds like she has serious MH issues, and I don't think having a baby will change that. I would worry that it makes her worse, because this seems to be about control, and when you have a baby, control goes out of the window!

The way their finances are split is weird too. Are they going 50/50 on all the baby's costs? Who will be paying for the baby's food?

I also worry about this baby's childhood. Will they ever be taken out for the day? Be allowed on school trips? Go to birthday parties or soft play? Will their toys be confined to their bedroom, and will they have no messy play? It doesn't sound like the child will be happy, and allowed to be a child.

I hope she's at least bought a new car seat, and cot mattress, not secondhand.

It also must be very hard for you, as you would be at the same stage as her, if you hadn't had the MC. It's bad enough getting through the months until the date your baby was due as it is, without this as a constant reminder. I'm so sorry for your loss.

Do you feel you need to take a step back for a while? Could you explain to her how hard you're finding it atm, and you need some space, or at least, no more pregnancy/baby talk, for now?