To be struggling to parent DS2?

[AliciaWhiskers]

DS2 is 8. For context, DS1 is 10, and has ASD. I split from their dad 3 years ago, and we have a 50/50 shared care arrangement.

DS1 tends to have more meltdowns with me; he holds it together at school and with his dad, but I get the brunt of his meltdowns. As a result, poor DS2 sometimes (for his own safety) gets asked to leave the room, basically so he doesn't have to witness his brother hitting/kicking/punching me. I don't know how else to manage the meltdowns, other than to try and keep DS2 safe.

Unfortunately, sometimes DS1 is also on the edge quite a bit, and this impacts DS2 too. I suspect he feels pushed out, or maybe not as important as DS1, but if I don't deal with DS1, he has a full blown meltdown, and then DS2 has an even harder time.

DS2 is so very different to me. I'm an introvert, I am quiet, I find it difficult when people talk all the time, and I am not very argumentative. DS2, on the other hand, talks almost constantly (which is fine, and I try really hard to keep listening and pay attention and be interested, although sometimes I find this very difficult), is loud and boisterous and in your face. He is also very argumentative. I am sure he will be a politician one day - he will argue that black is white and is certain he is never wrong.

He also gets into some really negative spirals. Today, we walked home (as we do pretty much every day - we live 20 mins walk from school - again for context he is always in the car with his dad as he lives further away), and the whole way home was just this cycle of negativity - I don't want to walk home, I can't do my homework, I want my brother to shut up, I hate you mum, my shoes hurt, I don't want to take my brother to football tonight. And it goes on and on. I don't know how to deal with this - ignoring it makes him feel ignored, and then his behaviour escalates until I talk to him. I try and cheer him up, but that is usually not welcomed. I try and change the subject and talk about something else, but he is just rude and insolent. Honestly, he behaves like he is 13, not 8!

I get that he has the rough end of his brother's behaviour, and I don't really know how to solve that either. I was thinking about family therapy, but I don't want to pathologist something that is probably just part of the normal spectrum of behaviour.

I'm a single mum, so having 121 time with just him is difficult. DS1 dislikes playdates due to his ASD.

I want to parent him better, but I don't know how. I love him, absolutely unconditionally, but I can find him difficult to parent, far more so than DS1 - even though he has more challenging behaviour, he's a bit like me and so I understand him more.

I realise I might get slated on here, but I'm posting because I want to be better, and donning my hard hat incase of insults of what a bad job I'm doing.

I think you need to get support with the meltdowns for DS1. No matter what the reason for them (and I appreciate ASD melt downs can’t be controlled) your DS2 is effectively watching you be abused. If this is the only way DS1 can manage his meltdowns you are going to have huge problems as he gets older and this may even trigger severe PTSD / Anxiety in DS2.

Is there anyway your ex can have DS1 more if he gets on with him better / is better able to handle the violence?

@grumpyhoonmain - DS1 tends to meltdown more with me. It's not that his dad can manage them better, it's just that they happen less with him. DS2 prefers to be with his Dad. Hypothetically, if DS2 spent more time with his Dad, then that just further affects his relationship with me. I want what is best for both of them, but I also don't want to lose DS2 or make him feel even more pushed out by suggesting he spends more time with his Dad.

I agree totally that he is effectively witnessing DV when DS1 is hitting me. It's horrible to think that if a partner was doing that to me, he would be arrested. And yet because it's my child, there is nothing I can do, and of course I can't fight back.

Could you let him take his bike or scooter on the way to school? Would make it more fun.

Btw I totally agree about domestic violence. My sons hit me from time to time. They are only small, but I can't handle it emotionally. That's why I didn't address that part of your post. I don't know what to say, but it's really tough. I so admire you for keeping it together.

OP, you aren’t useless. You’re doing your best in a difficult situation.
You do seem to have unrealistic expectations of your 8 year old. It’s developmentally appropriate that he thinks he’s always right. Does it really matter that he thought a 2 minute walk would take 5 minutes?
You’ve acknowledged that he’s very different to you, and it sounds like you’re focusing on the negatives about this (interesting that you feel that he focuses on the negatives). Maybe you could identify one things a day that’s different to you that’s positive and do something with him that highlights that?
I also think that you need to acknowledge that it’s not surprising he’d be negative living with his siblings outbursts. I know you can’t control that but perhaps this is something to reflect on when you’re getting annoyed by it.

You aren’t useless but I do think you perhaps need to let go of DS1 a bit more. Talk to his dad and arrange him to have him more if the meltdowns don’t happen as much with him. I think equal 50/50 is not working with your eldest and your ex should probably have him the majority or even full time with you day visiting. You could then spend more time with DS2 - chances are without your DS1 around your relationship will improve.

@Notsurehowtofixit yes, cycling is a possibility. We have done that in the past, usually with us all cycling as the pavements are busy, and he would need to go on the road, so it's safer for us all to cycle than for me to run behind with all the book bags. Good idea, though.

@RichTwoTurkeyFriend no, it doesn't really matter that he thinks a journey takes longer than it actually does. This morning, he asked me whenthe last day of term was. I said It was the 20th December. He said I was wrong, and that it was earlier than that. I said I wasn't wrong, it was definitely the 20th (because IT IS THE 20th!). He just doesn't stop. Even when I stop talking about it, he keeps going, saying I'm wrong. I suggested we fact check it, either by looking on the website, or by asking the office when we got to school, but he just doesn't stop! It's so infuriating.

Really good point to try and look for the positives, rather than focus on the negatives. I'll definitely try to do that. And yes, I get that his life can be really hard sometimes, far more difficult than a lot of 8 year olds have to face. I do feel sad for him.

@GrumpyHoonMain thanks for your reply, but I don't agree that DS1 spending more/all his time with his Dad would solve this.

Would some monthly extra day for one of them to go to Dads help? So each gets one to one time with the parent that weekend? So marketed to both of them and swap to the other parent the following month?

How is residency shared? Could the pattern be changed so there are fewer transitions?

Have you got a young carers group nearby ?? If not it's definitely worth looking into it.

I know you're talking about DS2 but I'm wondering if you're getting any support for the violence you're experiencing from DS1?

@RandomMess their Dad didn't want to do that last time I asked, but it was a while ago so could ask again. At the moment the care is shared according to our work schedules. A shift from that would require a huge change of work patterns. DS1 goes to secondary school in September and I'm hoping to start my own business to be able to be more flexible, so that might be possible for the future, but would be difficult now. (It would be possible now if exH would allow me to have more than 50% of the care, but he won't, so that's out)

@NeedAUsernameGenerator we don't have any support from anyone regarding DS1's violence towards me. Community paeds discharged us, despite knowing it was happening and that he self harms but hitting himself. We wouldn't meet CAMHS threshold. Nobody gives a shit.

@FoamingAtTheUterus I'm going to check that out right now, thanks.

Can you discuss with Ex shifting from 50:50 for 6 months with no change to maintenance arrangements? To see if it does make a big difference?

@RandomMess it would be really difficult to do that due to work stuff. Probably not impossible, but also difficult how to put that to the kids.

Another vote for "How to talk so kids listen and listen so kids talk". I think it would help a lot with your DS2. It's all about naming their emotions and validating them, so if he is winging about the walk you focus on his emotions and say "It must be very tiring to walk at the end of a long day" "This must be very difficult for you" etc.

Going to talk from a different perspective.

I was DS2 in my family situation. My brother had severe autism. I watched his tantrums escalate over the years and it was awful to watch. No child wants, nor needs, to see their parent being kicked, hit, pushed over, etc. I was always on edge at home, waiting for the next broken window. It was horrible. Once my mum accepted that medication was needed to keep both of them safe, things did get a bit better. But it was still hard on me (obviously as an adult I can appreciate my mum so much and she's my hero, but as a kid I honestly resented my brother for how everyone had to act and behave, and his actions).

The reality is, your DS2 will likely always resent his brother a bit. He can understand it's not his fault, but it still hurts to see people you love be abused and the fact you do feel like you don't matter as much.

Do loads of 1 on 1 things with DS2. Your ex needs to do 1 on 1 things. And I'd honestly seek help with the tantrums now. He's young now but honestly the difference in tantrums from 10yr to say 16yr is dangerous and very hard to deal with. You need to protect yourself to be a good mum to both kids.

I totally get how hard it is, but unfortunately it is something that's going to affect DS2 for his entire childhood and teenage years. It's better to work on improving the situation now than leave it and DS2 end up feeling completely second best and ignored. Hope things get better

I promise I'm not slating you but you do seem to concentrate on every negative point. He sounds miserable. He also sounds like he's trying to control things by his need to be right.

I have an 8 year old. I try to listen but he has more incommon with his dad than me. I also walk to school and have my 2 arguing over who's turn it is to talk.

Maybe, unknowingly, you block out all the things your ds1 does to you and it ends up coming out negatively at ds2?

I'm sorry CAMHS and the paediatrician aren't helping or supporting your family. I don't know if anything here would be helpful in terms of support groups or other organisations or charities: holesinthewall.co.uk/resources/leaflets-and-information-for-parents/

This is nothing like your situation but might be useful... My son tends toward the negative and when we were cycling home the other day after a not-great day he was in a foul mood, complaining about everything but not whining, he was really furious.

I didn't have the energy to jolly him out of it and that felt a bit false anyway so I stopped our bikes, walked into a park, and said "I'm with you, it all feels shit and I'm fed up too. I'm going to stand here and scream FUCK as loudly as I can. You want to join me?"

So we did. And then we did it again. And then we agreed to not tell anyone about the bad language and laughed all the way home.

I'm not suggesting this necessarily, just perhaps an occasional glimpse of the fact that you are human too and understand how he feels. It might be all he needs to open the floodgates and let it all out

You have to try again to get help with the violence. In a very short tine he will be bigger and stronger than you. You could be looking at broken bones, black eyes, teeth knocked out and internal bleeding on a regular basis. It can't go on and you need to be very clear with social worker about that.

I think that time of day he'll be tired anyway after school which always makes them feel a bit rubbish or low/ratty. Maybe take a drink & snack bar for the journey & use it as time to listen, acknowledge & value his feelings: & praise him for coping with his sibling. And one on one time doing stuff he likes even if it's just watching his favourite film.

You’re worn out; he’s worn out. When he’s coming out with inaccurate things, I can see it’s annoying, but it sounds to me as though it’s about underlying thoughts, e.g. you telling him it only takes two minutes to walk a distance means nothing to him if it feels like ten. You telling him when term actually ends isn’t responding to his feeling which is that it’s nearly the ends of term.

I wonder if this is part of the way in which you feel your personality is a better fit with your eldest? Is he fact-accurate? I think your younger son is trying to tell you about feelings in the guise of facts, so if I were you, I’d try and read the underlying message and respond to that, e.g. “I know, it feels like Christmas is getting close! What are you looking forward to most? What do we need to do? What’s happening at school?”

Don’t sweat the small stuff—does it really matter how long he thinks ten minutes is? He’s only eight! He may be trying to create order and certainty in his head...

I'm taking DS2 out of school for lunch today - about the only way to ensure 1 to 1 time without DS1. Looking forward to it :)

We had a really lovely hour together at lunch, and a really good chat about how he is finding things at home. He says he feels that DS1 wants my attention all of the time, and he feels left out. I said I would work really hard to make sure we get at least half an hour to ourselves, every day, which is our time (DS1 plays on his computer), and he liked the idea of the siblings/young carers group. I looked into that and appparently there is a long waiting list, but I will call them and get the ball rolling.