That nursery are leaving baby awake too long

[littlejalapeno]

DS is 10 months old and we try to make sure he naps every 3-4 hours when he’s at home. This means a morning nap at -around 9.30. He goes to nursery three mornings a week However at nursery he rarely goes to sleep before 11.30. I know it is a more stimulating environment, but if he has been up since 5.30 or 6.30 it means he will have been awake 5-6 hours, which seems very long for a 10 month old to me.

When we joined we filled out a sleep schedule and info on how to help him get there and I have asked the staff and his key worker to help him sleep by 930. But it doesn’t happen and they tell me he’s too excited to sleep and just doesn’t want to. To me that’s a sign of an overtired baby. I usually end up waking him at 1pm when I collect him and he’s like a zombie and yawning and fussy about his next nap, which he’s not ready for until 4/5pm (instead of 1.30-2pm) which also pushes bed time back by two hours and then he spends the night waking constantly.

AIBU in thinking nursery should be following the sleep schedule they requested and helping him sleep on time?

Every morning when we arrive and have a chat about him and I do ask for him to be put to sleep at 9.30/10, but it just doesn’t seem to happen. When I collected him yesterday they gave him to me at the door ready to go and said he had been playing downstairs with the big kids, but he was so sleepy I checked his book and it said he had just woke 10 minutes before I collected him, so I don’t know how he could’ve been up and playing and coat and shoes on in that time. I feel like I should escalate it to management... How can I do it in a polite way where we find a solution, as I understand he’s not the only baby that needs attention? It’s just making our lives harder and I’m worried that he is very over tired and it could have a negative impact on his development. Is 6 hours too long for a 10 month old to be awake? He just seems so grumpy 😔 I’m so tired too from being up constantly at night, so sorry if this is a little garbled! Any advice on how I can handle this tactfully would be so welcome!

How long has he been going?
DS naps at different times at nursery than he does at home. I just leave them to it tbh. It's a great nursery, he's happy there and I trust that they are doing their best to meet his needs. If I was dropping him off at 9 I'd be very surprised if he was settled enough to nap by 9:30.

One sleep in the middle of the day seems roughly right to me at that age? Not sure exactly what mine were doing then as I had a ‘if they fall asleep, they fall asleep’ type of rhythm going on, but I seem to remember a vague activity-eat-sleep kind of day with playgroups, etc in the morning and an after lunch sleep. If nursery have a set time for babies to eat and then sleep, I imagine it could be difficult to have a different schedule for every baby. Perhaps a childminder would be able to be more flexible.

The thing is, they can’t force a baby to sleep.
I have a nearly 10 month old who has his first nap at 9.30 if we’re at home. However if we go straight from the school run to a group or a friends house he absolutely won’t nap until we leave. There’s too much going on.

My 9 month old tends to only nap once/twice in the day now (depends on whether her first nap is long enough). Typically she wakes at half 7, first nap at 11.30am until 1.30pm. She then stays awake until 6.30pm and in bed, asleep for 6.45. If her morning nap only ends up lasting half an hour, she'll have another one between 3-4pm.

Maybe your baby genuinely doesn't want to sleep at nursery much and a short nap at home would be best. I personally can't put DD down for a nap after 4pm or she won't sleep at 7pm.
Maybe a bit of re-jigging his routine so it suits nursery better might be an idea. If it's the same every day he'll sleep better throughout the night.

A 9.30am nap for a 10mo in a stimulating environment is probably unrealistic TBH.

At that age, several naps a day is quite unusual, in any case.

My dd2 started nursery at 10 months and she absolutely needed 2 naps a day at that age or she was up all night
Nursery could get her sleep right and I was broken from nights awake.
I begged them with tears in my eyes to sort it.. and they did! Have a firm word with key worker or room leader. If it doesn't improve escalate to management.

I think if you want 1 on 1 care and for your sleep schedule to be followed you need a nanny. I find babies just don't sleep the same in different environments to home and at a nursery they won't be able to afford have just one on one care focusing on your child napping specifically at X time, when they are fighting sleep.

9.30 can't be long after the start of nursery, surely. I wouldn't have thought you could expect him to walk in there where the other kids are all playing and just be ready to go down to sleep.

I don't see the problem with what nursery are doing. If he won't sleep at that point when he is with them then he won't.

I'd leave it to be honest. If he needs a nap in the afternoon then make it no longer than about 45 minutes.

My DD is a bit younger (9mo) but does have two naps a day generally if we are at home. But if we are out and about or somewhere not conducive to napping, then we just try to adapt (so if she skips morning nap then she will have a longer afternoon nap, or if I know we are going somewhere in the morning where she can't nap then I try get a catnap out of here before we go.) What time do you drop him off? If he's up early then is there time for a nap before he goes in? If DD is up at 6.30 then I can usually get a short nap out of her at 8ish for 20 mins if we have to be up and out. If we are just staying home then I won't put her down till nearer 9.

Oh and sometimes a 20-min nap at 4 is enough to keep her going till bedtime if it's been a day with not many naps.

One sleep in the middle of the day seems roughly right to me at that age?

I don’t think so. DS was still having two naps at that age, and as OP said 3 to 4 hours is how long a child that age can usually comfortably stay awake. I agree 6 hours is much too long for a 10 month old to stay awake - even my 18 month old would struggle with that. He has a nap after about 5/ 5 and a half hours after waking in the morning.

DS goes to nursery one day a week last week he got up at seven, went to nursery at 9:15 at home would've napped at 9:30 for at least an hour, today it was two hours, at nursery he napped at eleven for half an hour, he then had another half an hour in the afternoon again at home it would be 1-2 hours . They're great, put him in his grobag and in the sleep room (cots, black out blinds,), they'll hold his hand or stroke his hair, they even rock him to sleep if they think he's getting over tired, but it's just too exciting to him. We've started packing his pyjamas when they do a nappy change after tea around 4:30 they change him into pyjamas, I pick him up at five bring him home he BF and goes straight to bed about 5:45 he usually goes to bed about 7/7:30 sometimes even 8 ish if we've been out. I don't think you can expect them to have the same routine.

In mine they all sleep roughly 12pm-2pm. Unless they're a very heavy sleeper would be pointless trying to put them down while all others are awake

Ime there are generally two types of parents re sleep 1) the type who want to stick to naps for very good reasons and 2) the type who will be flexible knowing that surroundings will impact sleep.

I've always fallen into group 1 and found it immensely stressful knowing how much sleep my children need and not being able to give it to them. My children get poorly if they get overtired so I sympathise.

My first went to a nursery and I found that although they asked about sleep requirements, they actually had set times for all rooms and babies had to fit with that. For that reason my second went to a childminder, which was a much better fit for us.

FWIW my first had 2 naps a day until she was 14mo and my second was 13mo. My third is 12mo now and still has 2 naps a day (in fact this morning she had 1.5h and this afternoon she's had 2h so far and she sleeps 7-7). All babies have different needs. I'm a childminder and the 12mo I look after also has 2 naps a day as do some of my friends children. It's really not that abnormal and if it's what your child needs then you have 2 options 1) ask nursery to try harder or 2) find more suitable childcare. What is the sleep environment like at nursery? Is it lights on and napping while others play or do they have proper sleep rooms?

My baby always takes a 2 hour morning nap and at least an hour if now more in the afternoon. At crèche he sleeps no more than 45 mins in morning and same in afternoon. I know they’re doing all they can so I just do my best to make sure he gets early nights. Also he doesn’t go on Fridays and I make sure to stay home so he can get a catch up. Every single Friday morning at home he takes a 3 hour nap.

It’s difficult but I don’t think it’s easy to replicate their sleeping habits at home in crèche.

My 10 month old napped this morning from 10.30-12 and won’t nap again today - she’ll go to bed at 7.

When I pick her up from nursery her key worker sometimes apologises about not being about to get her down for a nap in the afternoon - but what are they supposed to do? You can’t make a baby sleep.

It won’t impact on his development lol.

Thanks for all your responses- lots to think about. He definitely needs two sleeps... it’s hard to know what to do when I’m so sleep deprived too.

@PepePig that sounds wonderful. Our day is wake at 5.30 nap at 9-10 awake until 1.30 nap until 3, bed at 7. Wakes once or twice before midnight and twice before up for the day at 5.30am

I’ve done some reading just now and he shouldn’t drop down to one nap until 12 months

@Topseyt we drop off around 830, a nap at 10 would be fine especially if up since 5.30. I did see other babies being helped to sleep through bottles and cuddles when we did our setting period at the beginning of last month. Surely sleep is a habit that needs to be taught and kept up?

@Hangingtrousers thank you, it sounds like you were in the same situation

I do appreciate they have other babies to look after but letting a baby stay awake until they drop down from exhaustion doesn’t feel right to me.

O it’s not too long for him to be awake. He won’t combust! It may not be ideal for your schedule, but it won’t hurt him. Nursery is not home. Children need to fit into nursery routine not the other way around. You need to adapt to their schedule or get a nanny or possibly a childminder willing/able if you want to stick to your schedule.
You need to realise though, his sleep pattern will change. By the new year he’ll probably be down to one longer mid day nap & with Christmas coming up, is it really worth changing childcare for? Personally I wouldn’t.

He had just woke 10 minutes before I collected him, so I don’t know how he could’ve been up and playing and coat and shoes on in that time. I feel like I should escalate it to management...

I don’t understand why you don’t believe them. It doesn’t take 10 mins to put on a fresh nappy, shoes, coat and put him in the room to play with the others.

If the bottom
Line is that you don’t like/trust them - then move him, definitely. But when they go to nursery, in other people’s care, you simply can’t micro manage

@SpookilyBadOooooooh

I don’t understand why you don’t believe them. It doesn’t take 10 mins to put on a fresh nappy, shoes, coat and put him in the room to play with the others.

I should’ve been clearer. He was yawning and sleepy which is why it didn’t seem likely that he was up and playing. And usually I would go inside to collect and put his coat on, which is why it felt odd.

Also... “micromanaging” ouch. I’m concerned about his sleep and welfare and asking for advice, let’s not get carried away with words like that lol

I do appreciate they have other babies to look after but letting a baby stay awake until they drop down from exhaustion doesn’t feel right to me.

Have they told you that this is what's happening? Clearly, you're not present at nursery so I wonder how you know this?

Nurseries, as you know, have lots of babies to look after and generally, they have a sleep time when they will try to get all the babies to sleep at the same time. They'll have a few members of staff responsible for that while other members of staff are looking after the slightly older children who don't sleep so much. Perhaps nursery is not the best place for your baby if you're unhappy with how they set out their day. It's never, ever, going to be the same as when at home.

Thanks to everyone who’s sharing their babies’ sleep routines, very helpful and reassuring!

Having been through childcare with two of my own and heard countless similar worries from friends over the years - I think you have to let this go - he isn't massively out of kilter and I just think nursery is not going to behave like a nanny who works just for you.
\my own childminder basicaly stopped putting my kids down at all far too young - but I just accepted it wasn't every day and stuck to the routine on my days.

Sleep is never the same at nursery but definitely have a chat with them and see what they can do. They may be able to put in a pushchair or something else that could help. My 9 month old naps 9-10 and 1-2.30 at home but only ever manages 2 45 minute naps at nursery. They do try though.

To be honest, if you don’t like the way the nursery is handling the sleep issue, don’t send him. If you need childcare for work, then look for a childminder or a nanny who might be able to more easily match your schedule or another nursery who might be more in tune with what you want.

Wakes once or twice before midnight and twice before up for the day at 5.30am

Possibly because he is sleeping too much during the day?? 3 to 4 wake ups in the night - to do what? Feed?

Anyway, if you think he needs more napping then I would suggest try not to stress about nursery days and let him catch up on home days.