To think veganism is not for children?

[ohhhhlivia]

Yes, I am aware that it is perfectly possible to have a healthy vegan diet at any age. I know that.

However, it is more difficult and easier to get wrong if you want to be vegan. It still is restrictive (even with all of the new stuff coming out) as in you need to tell hosts, check menus in advance etc.

It's a barrier that has to be overcome. I don't understand why you would do that to someone who has no choice in the matter.

Lots of kids go through a fussy phase too, add veganism in and surely you're at a high risk of health problems?

I think what I'm getting at, is that childhood nutrition can be hard enough as it is, so it just feels wrong to make it harder for reasons that do not directly benefit the child.

Agree it seems deeply unfair that the child has no say in it.

No kids have a say in what their parents feed them when they’re young. Meat eaters ‘force their beliefs’ on their children just as much as vegans, they just don’t see it that way.

Our school has vegan Monday every week and most of the children come home hungry as they don't like it.

If you want to be vegan, crack on. But I do t think other children should have it forced on them to eat it. The school do it because of peer pressure from the older, woke teenagers.

@twinkletoesimnot

Not read the whole thread but *@Noshowlomo* Please do not generalise and do try to tell the truth..... Some animals are grass fed. Some may have antibiotics when needed- but these are strictly controlled. None in the UK will be injected with hormones

Absolutely correct. Animals who have had a course of antibiotics cannot be sent to market until a certain period of time has elapsed.

I would definitely report you to social services if you were forcing your children to eat vegan food only

I suggest taking a look at the meat eating diet first. Would you report families who “force” their children to eat burgers/sausages/bacon which in years to come will lead them down the path of heart disease and cancer but not eating animal products and cutting your risk of heart disease and cancer isn’t ok.

In this very long thread, it been brought up many times that omnivore parents "force their beliefs" on their children too, by giving them meat. This is true of course. However the reason non-vegans find this difficult to empathise with is because one way of eating is offering an abundance of food to the child (all known food groups) and the other is offering a restriction on food (limited food sources). Restriction is associated with hardship, and abundance with comfort and security, and therefore it is hard to think of an infant suffering deprivation (which is what a limited diet equates to).

Oh and I don't think anyone is saying that feeding kids chicken nuggets and chips every night is fine. What a strange thing to say! No one is saying that a omnivore diet of any kind, even a shitty kind, is fine because it contains meat. They're saying that all things being equal, a vegan diet for a growing child is sub optimal.

@JovialNickname

In this very long thread, it been brought up many times that omnivore parents "force their beliefs" on their children too, by giving them meat. This is true of course. However the reason non-vegans find this difficult to empathise with is because one way of eating is offering an abundance of food to the child (all known food groups) and the other is offering a restriction on food (limited food sources). Restriction is associated with hardship, and abundance with comfort and security, and therefore it is hard to think of an infant suffering deprivation (which is what a limited diet equates to).

AFAIK vegans also eat foods from all food groups. It therefore follows they will also feed their vegan children food from all food groups.

Yanbu. I'm a vegetarian but feed my son meat because it's his choice & id never impose my views / dietary choices on him. When he's older he can choose to be a vegetarian if he wants to. I feel bad for children who are just raised vegan and don't get a say in the matter.

@rainingallday

YANBU. I am dead against people forcing their views on their children, and particularly when it could be (and probably WILL be ) detrimental to their child/children's health.

I would not hesitate to report someone to social services if I saw them raising their child(ren) as a vegan. Fortunately, most people I know have more sense than to do that.

If you think raising a child as a vegan is worthy of calling social services then you really need to get out more.

@JovialNickname

Oh and I don't think anyone is saying that feeding kids chicken nuggets and chips every night is fine. What a strange thing to say! No one is saying that a omnivore diet of any kind, even a shitty kind, is fine because it contains meat. They're saying that all things being equal, a vegan diet for a growing child is sub optimal.

A healthy diet includes carbs, fat and protein. All of those things can be easily found in a vegan diet.

My diet is definitely more varied now that I am a vegan. When I ate meat I pretty much lived off macaroni cheese, pizza and fish fingers or chicken nuggets and chips. Now I still eat vegan versions of those things but I now eat wider variety of different curries, stir fries, soups, sushi, lasagne, pasta with different kinds of sauces, risottos, scrambled tofu...I also eat a wider variety of fruit, nuts, seeds and nut butters as well as plenty of accidentally vegan junk food/convenience food like crumpets, pot noodles and Skittles!

Speaking of junk food, I am still constantly amazed by what I can eat as a vegan. I actually found out recently that Walkers roast chicken crisps and Maryland sugar free chocolate chip cookies* are vegan! I think if you go in with the mindset that it's too restrictive and you constantly think about what you can't eat then of course you're going to struggle. But if you go in thinking about all the different you can eat and what you can do with those things then chances are you're going to do a lot better.

*Sugar free cookies sound weird but they still have sweetener in them so they still taste sweet and they are amazing. I ate the whole packet in one sitting .

@firstimemamma

Yanbu. I'm a vegetarian but feed my son meat because it's his choice & id never impose my views / dietary choices on him. When he's older he can choose to be a vegetarian if he wants to. I feel bad for children who are just raised vegan and don't get a say in the matter.

Except you are still making a choice for him by feeding him meat. It's just a different choice to those who decide to raise their kids veggie/vegan...not better, just different.

Children need nutrients, not specific ingredients. A vegan diet can be as nutritionally complete as any diet.

There is nothing inherently ‘sub-optimal’ about a vegan diet. You get healthy vegan diets and unhealthy vegan diets, just like you get healthy omnivorous diets and unhealthy omnivorous diets.

If you accept that a child eating a diet containing large quantities of processed meat, sugar, refined carbohydrates, fizzy drinks, sweets and ready meals with little home made food and limited fruit and veg is eating less healthily than a child eating a vegan diet of fresh fruit and veg, wholegrains, nuts, pulses, legumes, tofu and beans, then you understand that it’s not whether the diet is omnivorous or not that makes it healthy.

YABU you could say the exact same argument for meat eating- forcing it upon your children.
Have a think about what humans are really supposed to eat- milk made for a baby cow, eggs that come out of a chickens butt.
What do gorillas, elephants, rhinos eat?
Children don’t need animal products.
Wake up and smell the commercial brainwash!!!

Well let's face it, no vegan on the planet is going to say anything other than their children are thriving on a vegan diet.

So the question is moot.

Some of these comments are laughable!
Pigs/cows/sheep get tumours and cancer just like us. Butchers chop those parts out and it gets ground into mince that you then feed your kids.
Processed meat is a well known carcinogen.
Cows milk contains pus and a whole load of other crap.
But vegans should be reported to social services 🤣

I personally think it depends on the age of the child. Bearing in mind that the natural weaning age of human mammals is believed by experts to be between the ages of 3 and 7, by that logic it is understood that children in this rough age bracket still need milk. As very few children in the UK are still receiving breast milk at this age, most get the closest equivalent from the milk of other mammals. After this age though, I believe a vegan diet can be very healthy if well managed. There have been the occasional horror stories in recent years of parents who mistakenly and ignorantly believe that 'oat milk' etc is actual milk, and babies and toddlers have become seriously unwell, or died. So sad.

@Dinosaurpooped

YABU you could say the exact same argument for meat eating- forcing it upon your children. Have a think about what humans are really supposed to eat- milk made for a baby cow, eggs that come out of a chickens butt. What do gorillas, elephants, rhinos eat? Children don’t need animal products. Wake up and smell the commercial brainwash!!!

Have you heard about your ancestors, the hunter food gatherers?

Both dd and Ds were raised vegetarian.

I was told by some parents that this would stunt their growth and I needed to feed dc meat in order for them to grow.

Neither Dp or I are particularly tall but both dc tower over us and over the children who’s parents said our children would be short.

@adogwithabone so many kid foods are "fortified" cereals, yoghurts etc plus we are all encouraged to give children daily vitamins... This is because our diet is deficient in so many ways regardless of meat preferences. And the reason there aren't the nutrients in the food we eat any more is because of our mass farming methods which have depleted the earth of its goodness

I have a vegan friend who eats really well and her food looks great. Her 7 year old vegan son is a different story though - he doesn’t like any vegetables and is really fussy so he pretty much lives off quorn nuggets and chips with vegan mayo. He is underweight and constantly grumpy, pale and exhausted. I don’t doubt that if he ate the same varied vegan diet that his mum did then he would be a lot healthier.

YABU, many traditional diets are effectively vegan and people managed. Most diets outside Europe and parts of Asia have not traditionally included milk and most people are lactose intolerant for this reason. Humans are the only animal to drink milk past infancy and to drink another animal’s breast milk, it’s super weird when you think about it. We really do not need cow’s milk.

I imagine most kids being raised vegan are healthier than the average kid because the parents expect constant questioning sand judgment about their decision so have probably swotted up on health and nutrition.

As for forcing it on children, how is it any different to forcing them to eat meat/dairy? You’re forcing your view on them either way

Some people are so incensed by vegans that it's funny.

@EveryPlanetHasAYorkshire hi, thanks for the comment. I'm afraid I'd have to respectfully disagree that I'm "making a choice for him by feeding him meat". I offer him meat and he makes the choice for himself. Ds also eats a wide variety of foods that vegetarians and vegans would eat, it works for us and his diet is based on what a very experienced nhs dietician said was best for him. I respect vegans though and if ds wants to be a vegan or vegetarian when he is older then i'd support that, just as I'd respect his wishes if he continued to eat meat. Each to their own

[quote firstimemamma]@EveryPlanetHasAYorkshire hi, thanks for the comment. I'm afraid I'd have to respectfully disagree that I'm "making a choice for him by feeding him meat". I offer him meat and he makes the choice for himself. Ds also eats a wide variety of foods that vegetarians and vegans would eat, it works for us and his diet is based on what a very experienced nhs dietician said was best for him. I respect vegans though and if ds wants to be a vegan or vegetarian when he is older then i'd support that, just as I'd respect his wishes if he continued to eat meat. Each to their own [/quote]
You're still making the decision to offer him meat.

DS still eats meat. It is still me (and DP of course) who are making a choice for him.

"You're still making the decision to offer him meat." Yes, I couldn't agree more with that. Of course I obviously am! @EveryPlanetHasAYorkshire