To think that teachers need to teach stuff and not me.

[caroline161]

DS has just started at Grammar school. Ridiculous amount and type of homework. For example: Learn about Archimedes principle, explain what you have found. AIBU to email the school and say, " I would appreciate it if you could teach him this instead of me and what the f are you doing all day which means that I have to teach him Archimedes principle"

@Xalia in all honesty, I saw 5-6 people in my class of 30 alone who had been tutored to an inch of their lives and who had moved so close to the school they might as well have been living in the grounds. Do I think the system is flawed and that those who can’t necessarily handle it get in? Yes I do. As I said however, several times now, I didn’t read that the OP’s child had just started as I do think that makes a difference.
Now, dismount off your high horse, you’re giving it a bad back.

Again, I appreciate I teach in a totally different area, but I think the principles are probably the same.

I don't know what you teach but Sciences are precise. Accuracy and correct terminology are important. It is not enough to be half right or try to argue that day is night.

It should be taught differently from the arts and humanities.

Woes not only did OP's son just start grammar school (and I appreciate your now acknowledging this fact), he got into grammar school without coaching.

He is not one of those who do not deserve their place. He is a bright lad.

@caroline161

Incase you are looking for help (longest post ever but stick with me)

Archimedes first made the displacement discovery. This is a way to calculate the volume of an irregular shape. If we have a cube, we can find the volume by measuring but we can't measure funny, lumpy shapes and calculate in the same way. So his displacement discovery allows us to find our volumes. When you submerged a funny shapes item into fluid, the amount of food pushed out is equal to the volume. See my comment above for that in more detail.

Archimedes then started thinking about things which float vs things which sink, and how the volume of fluid being pushed out related to that. Can we use that displacement of fluid to work out buoyancy?
When we use fluid we mean liquid or gas, so this applies to things floating in liquid like water but also to things floating in the air.

Archimedes principal states that When a body is immersed completely or partially in a fluid, it experiences an upward force that is equal to the weight of the fluid displaced by the body.

Simply, when something is either submerged or floating, the force pushing up against it is the same as the weight of fluid it pushes aside. So, if it pushed aside 200g of water or air then that would mean that the force pushing up against it is 200g. This is the buoyant force.

How does this knowledge help is find out if something will be buoyant (float)?

For something to float, it's density much be less than the buoyant force against it.

Density = mass/volume. So we can use Archimedes displacement theory above to work out the volume of any object, and we get the mass by weighing it. Use those figures to work out density.

Imagine a cube of iron. It's very dense, it has a lot of weight contained in a small volume. If we drop that into water, the small volume will only displace a small amount of water. Remember, that the water displaced is equal to the force pushing back against that iron cube from below. The cube pushes aside a small amount of water, so that means only a small force is pushing up against it as it sinks. That force isn't larger than the density of the cube (too small) so the cube overpowers it and sinks. You can look up figures for all of that.

Now imagine a hot ait balloon. It's huge. Massive volume. When it inflates, it has to push loads of air out of the way. The amount of air it's just pushed out of the way is equal to the force which is about to push up against the balloon, and its huge.
We would then work out the density of the balloon, it's full of helium which really isn't dense at all. In the scenario, the buoyant force pushing against the balloon is a much bigger number than the density of the balloon, so the balloon floats.

So, if we want to know if we're building something which will float or sink, we would use Archimedes principal. We'd find the volume of the thing we are making. This volume is equal to the byoant force which will push against it.
We then work out the density.
If the density is bigger than the buoyant force then it will sink. If the density is smaller than the buoyant force then it will float.

Alexa or Siri are your friends @caroline161 😁

There is a site called www'schoolphysics.co.uk which has free info to help 11-19 years olds. See www.schoolphysics.co.uk/age11-14/Matter/text/Archimedes_/index.html

If he still doesn't understand then he could ask the Physics/Science teacher to explain with a back-up email from you. Some of us don't have sciency brains (I certainly don't!). He really should be doing his own homework with minimal input from you now. If he/you feel overwhelmed I would talk to his form tutor, but it is a big step up from what is expected at primary school. Did the school give some idea of how long they expect children to spend on homework? To me that is a perfectly normal homework for a first year. Look up concept and write a few sentences explaining it - half an hour tops. Maybe you are overthinking it.

Surprised what a rough time the OP has had.

Flipped learning is NOT "the new thing Ofsted wants." Ofsted says nothing about flipped learning, and it's not "new." It was very trendy about 10 years ago, until it became obvious that it wasn't going to revolutionize learning, and now it's being used a lot less.

Theory of flipped learning: Students research things by themselves and come into the classroom ready to do exciting projects and discussions based on what they have learned.

Practice of flipped learning: Half the students don't bother, another quarter open a Youtube video and half heartedly watch for a couple of minutes before getting distracted by social media and chatting/watching cat videos, and maybe another quarter actually do it properly. In the next class, the teacher attempts to set the students up with exciting projects and discussion only to discover that most of the class didn't in fact research the topic properly at all, and then has to quickly concoct an ad-hoc lesson to quickly explain the content which the students should have researched for their homework. By the time that's finished, there is then not much time to do the exciting projects and discussion that was planned.

I think it's fine to gradually bring in student-directed research as students get older, but most Y7s are not going to have the maturity or experience to be able to research a topic thoroughly by themselves, or to resist the distraction of all the fun stuff (cat videos, Snapchat, gaming, porn or what have you) that the online would is bristling with. The internet is very very very distracting for children and adolescents.

It sounds like the school is preparing them for student-directed research with this homework. They have to start somewhere.

Apologies for me earlier sarcastic post.

With the further updates from the OP, I would hazard a guess that her son is used to getting things correct and is afraid/worried about getting something wrong and therefore not wanting to start writing something he is unsure of.
This is a common trait in Grammar school pupils.

OP, encourage your son to ‘try’, I.e. give it a good go. Put something down. Remind him that it is ok to make mistakes. The teacher’s ‘job’ will be to help him learn from those mistakes. They cannot give meaningful feedback from a blank page, however. We remember something more from getting it wrong first time, funnily enough!

Definitely write in and give them a piece of your mind.

Use swear words and exclamation marks.

I didn’t read the full thread, so apologies if already mentioned, but a good tip if you’re struggling to find understandable material is to Google the subject and add ‘for kids’.

‘Archimedes principle for kids’ throws up loads of child friendly explanations and videos. Hope that helps for this and any future research projects.

@JonSlow
Please do not make me laugh like that in front on my children so I have to explain what I just read

I don’t understand the angst.

My kids primary school had a classroom book in kindergarten that described this in a simple manner to 5yo’s. They couldn’t read the book but every week got to take a classroom book home as well as school library book. It was something about a man called Archimedes in a bath with lots of animals joining him and was funny but with hidden learning. So it a concept a 5yo can understand if conveyed properly.

Then there’s Google. Is he Googling ‘kids explanation of .....’. That’s what he needs to do if he has no concept and can’t understand the standard explanations. Once he grasps that the initial simple concept he can go back and add depth from the standard explanation.

This is not about a school dodging off, it’s about them setting him up to be an independent life-long learner. Your carry on is not exactly setting a stellar example to your son in this regard.

I’m not sure grammar is the place for your child if they’re struggling to research and retain information about the Archimedes principle.

Parents want to get their children into grammar schools because they will mix with the children of other parents who have books, cultural capital, an interest in education and learning and take an active part in their children’s schooling.

If you don’t know about some of the things your son is learning I am sure he will be able to explain them to you. Explaining things one has studied to others is the one of the best ways of grasping the principles and fixing them in one’s own mind.

Just a thought. When you google, are you putting KS3 in front? Because that usually filters the results you get to an appropriate level.
There are good science study guides around too, if he’s happier working from a text book.

Nasty responses on here - you son is fine. And if you show him this thread he can go into school and say - “what I found out what that a lot of women on Mumsnet have opinions on Archimedes Theory”.

I’m not a big fan of the flipped learning but this is just a research task. He can only do his best.

Crikey, how did I manage in 1975 without Google.

My DC all covered Archimedes principle in Primary.

You DS should be googling himself - the BBC stuff tended to be easily accessible (better than Wikipedia which can become too technical).

These are key skills your DS needs to be learning: how to google stuff, and then regoogle if you don't get it
going back to the teacher if you don't understand (it will probably be taught in the next lesson anyway)
And planning the homework, so you don't get overwhelmed (knowing both the date it is set and the date it is due)
And knowing when to stop if you can't get it done in a "reasonable" time.

I went to grammar school and left with 4 As at A level and a place at Oxbridge (reading an arts subject). We were taught science badly and I never understood the bloody Archimedes Principle (though lulabella's posts upthread have helped).

For heaven's same, cut the OP and her son some slack.

You sound a delight op!

@caroline161 please can I recommend CGP study guides and revision guides. They are brilliant. They cover all topics in most subjects in an easy to understand way, with little drawings to make it engaging. They have been my saviour in many a homework crisis situation and are superb for revision.

Your boy is not thick and neither are you, it's a steep learning curve hitting secondary school. He will soon get into the rhythm of studying and comfortable with self-learning.

Also Khan academy is brilliant for Maths concepts too.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with setting a ‘research’ type homework, but having read @Lulualla’s post, I’m glad I don’t have to try and help anyone understand the Archimedes principle!

Sounds like the sort of homework I had at Grammar school in the 60s, only I didn't have Google.