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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To expect tenants to let tradesmen in?

84 replies

ForeverBubblegum · 10/10/2019 17:09

Gas safety certificate is due on a flat we rent out, so we hired a gas engineer DH knows through work to do test and service boiler at the same time. The gas man offered to call the tenant and arrange a time with them so with permission I passed on the tenants number. All seemed simple enough.

A week or so later we got a call from gas man saying the tenants weren't in at arranged time, but they would reschedule. Today another call, tenant was not in to let them in again, and this time they are billing us for their wasted time (far enough, they could have been doing other work)

So was I being unreasonable to expect tenants to be home when they arranged to be? Should I have arranged to go with a key myself? Probably will have to now (obviously with notice), but seems like an unnecessary intrusion on their privacy.

OP posts:

CormacMcLaggen · 10/10/2019 17:15

I always arrange the time and date with my plumber (who does the Gas Safety) and then I ask the tenant if they mind letting him in at that time/date.

If yes - great, but I have my phone handy and the plumber knows to call me if the tenant isn't there for any reason.
If no - I will meet the plumber there to let them in.

Never had a problem (touch wood) doing it this way.

Sounds like your tenants forgot the guy was coming? Or couldn't be bothered to be there? That's really shit.

CormacMcLaggen · 10/10/2019 17:18

I'd be really worried if the gas safety has expired now, too? If I were you I'd arrange with the Gas Safety guy yourself to carry out the gas check ASAP, tell him you'll meet him at the property yourself and let him in with your key. Let the tenants know, of course. But they've missed him twice, so I would take control back and do the same for the future.

Lindy2 · 10/10/2019 17:19

Yes they should have been there at the agreed time. I'd be annoyed too.
It looks like you need to go there yourself or if you use an agent get them to sort it. I use an agent for reasons like this.

AJPTaylor · 10/10/2019 17:32

They should have told you if they didn't want to wait in.

Kko1986 · 10/10/2019 17:32

Hi
I'm a tenant and my landlords call a month before it's due and I agree to the contractor to arrange with me. I arrange a convenient time and I'm in. Your tenants are being out of order I would contact them if I was you

OneForMeToo · 10/10/2019 17:35

They should arrange or agree for the key to be used. I always arrange a convenient for me time as I do not allow access without myself or husband being present.

You can’t just let yourself in with the key uNless emergency (flood/fire) without court approval you still need permission.

BoneyBackJefferson · 10/10/2019 17:36

ForeverBubblegum

YANBU

CormacMcLaggen

If no - I will meet the plumber there to let them in.

With the permission of the tenant?

alexdgr8 · 10/10/2019 17:38

maybe the tenants misunderstood and thought they were being asked if it was ok for engineer to be in their flat at that time, not that they were responsible for letting him in. maybe they have to go to work. is English their first language, are they new to renting in uk?
I would expect landlord or their agent to take responsibility for this.

DriftingLeaves · 10/10/2019 17:40

Pass on the cost of the cancellation to the tenants,Very rude of them - it;s for their benefit. Be there yourself next time (giving the required notice)

JasonPollack · 10/10/2019 17:41

If the gas man can only come during working hours and they are both working YABU. Surely you do not expect them to take time off to let your tradesman in?

Oblomov19 · 10/10/2019 17:41

They sound like nightmare tenants!
They arranged the time? How can they then justify not being there?

Actionhasmagic · 10/10/2019 17:43

When I rented my landlady would let them in herself but ask if the time and day was okay

MitziK · 10/10/2019 17:45

Depends. Did you pay somebody who was able to come when a tenant isn't at work, so they don't have to take unpaid time/risk having their ZHC reduced to Z for not being available for a whole day? Did he actually cold call them out of nowhere demanding entry? That ain't gonna happen with anybody calling my mobile.

The way to do it is by a polite letter, asking them to call and book the inspection.

SmileCheese · 10/10/2019 17:47

If the gas man can only come during working hours and they are both working YABU. Surely you do not expect them to take time off to let your tradesman in?

But the tenant was the one who arranged the time, so that argument makes no sense.

I would be contacting them to say you will need to be at the property on a newly arranged date to ensure the check is carried out. I would then arrange the check directly with the gas man and absolutely pass on the cost for the wasted appointment to your tenants.

BoneyBackJefferson · 10/10/2019 17:51

Original poster

ForeverBubblegum · 10/10/2019 17:53

Thanks everyone, I didn't think I was BU, but part of me started wondering if I was expecting to much by asking tenant to wait around for plumber/gas man.

In the past I've booked the time myself, but I just end up passing messages / possible times between the tenant and tradesman, so though it would be easier for them to talk directly.

If tenant had said they didn't want to let the plumber in, I would have been happy to go over, but why make the booking if there not willing to be in.

I'm just going to give them a date, and tell them I need to be there. Hopefully they'll give permission because if not I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. (Illegal to enter, but also illegal to let gas safety expire)

OP posts:

lyralalala · 10/10/2019 17:59

Have you spoken to the tenant? Do they realise that they need to be there? They may have assumed you were letting the guy in. Also, did you check with the tenant before giving our their phone number?

I always find the best way to do it is to ring the tenant and ask them if they want me to make an appointment or do they want to deal directly with the tradesman in. It also gives the chance to ask if they want to be there or if they're happy for you to do it.

lyralalala · 10/10/2019 18:00

Just seen you already answered the number point, sorry.

SmileCheese · 10/10/2019 18:01

Also, did you check with the tenant before giving our their phone number?

The Op did say in her first post that with permission she passed on their number.

alexdgr8 · 10/10/2019 18:06

I don't think it is reasonable to try to make the tenants responsible for what should be a landlord's duty, eg taking time off work to give access. they have their work to go to. being a landlord with all its duties to ensure compliance/ maintenance is the work of the landlord, or delegated to an agent whom they pay to do this.
so I think it quite plausible that the tenants did not realise they were personally being expected to assist the engineer to gain access.
it's not right to say they are benefitting by this inspection; it is a legal duty of the landlord, so the landlord is benefitting by not being prosecuted for neglecting to do it. also from the point of view of keeping the property in a rentable state; it needs a gas safety cert to be able to let to any future prospective tenants, if these ones get fed up and decide to leave....
I don't see how legally they can be charged any extra fees.

MojoMoon · 10/10/2019 18:10

^^I'm just going to give them a date, and tell them I need to be there

And if they have work? Or a holiday planned? Or they don't want use annual leave up?

Call them and politely ask if they would prefer you to arrange the appointment and for you to attend with the plumber while they are out OR if they want to attend the appointment in which case discuss a time and date with them for this to take place.

They are your customers, it is not a feudal landlord situation. You cannot dictate to your tenant when they need to take time off work or change their plans!

It may be for their benefit except actually it's also for yours since you are the one fined if it expires. So I'd not try ordering them around.

Countrylifeornot · 10/10/2019 18:19

They have messed you around twice now, causing you to be billed.
Telephone them, ask how they wish to proceed. Explain that if there is no gas safety cert you ownt be able to allow them to live there and will serve a section 21. They sound like cock wombles.

mumwon · 10/10/2019 19:02

don't phone send email/special delivery letter or take letter & deliver to tenant - warn them that it is a safety check & is part of their responsibility as a tenant to allow this to be one (checking first if there was an issue of course) If they were being awkward (& it does happen) warn them they are breaking their contract & as such it is grounds for you to give them notice (this has happened a lot of land lords & this is the advice given by RLA et al websites. Landlords are liable for safety checks & if tenant decides to stop paying to give a section 21 you have to have up to date gas safety which is why their behaviour would worry me & should worry you. As stated check before you say this that there is no reason BUT if they made the appointment & they couldn't be in (& if anyone has dealt with British Gas you know servicing times are approximate) they should have cancelled &/or let you know - wouldn't you do that if it was your own house? It is really silly thing to do because it is al about the tenants own safety & this landlord went out of their way by putting the service person in direct touch to arrange convenient time. You cannot - by the way - enter the property without the tenants permission (although if they fail to comply you could get some legal permission I think I read on one of the sites)

mumwon · 10/10/2019 19:04

You must have proof that you have arranged this by the way & get letter/email from gas service person about the failure & his conversation (ie as witness)

alexdgr8 · 10/10/2019 19:13

some people seem to have a wonky idea of the rights/ responsibilities of a landlord and tenant.
no it is not like a house-owner having to wait in for British Gas all day; that's the point, the tenant is not the owner. they have paid for the quiet use of that property, and unless they have bolted the door from inside and refuse access at a previously agreed/stated time for essential repairs/checks, they are not being unreasonable.
they cannot be unilaterally co-opted to act as an agent of the landlord in relation to tradesmen.
the property is a capital asset of the landlord, not of the tenant.
it is the landlord's duty to act in a professional manner in relation to the contract of letting.

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