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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think Universal Credit are cunts.

109 replies

CatCave · 30/09/2019 20:56

To cut a long story short, I broke up with my partner and moved out of our home to rent on my own. This happened in July.

Last year when I was still with him and did not claim benefits I had two part time jobs and was taxed double on Job 1 and nothing on Job 2.

Job 1 offered me full time so I quit Job 2 but was still being taxed far too much.

I received a refund of this tax in my August wage. Universal Credit have counted it as my earnings and are not paying me anything this month.

I don't think this is fair. I have already paid for the tax once, had it refunded and now I'm effectively paying for it again through losing a payment which I would normally be entitled to?

I have to go to an appointment to appeal to a "decision maker" but have been told its very unlikely that they will change their minds.

When I received the tax rebate I used the money to pay off arrears I had fallen into by being taxed too much in the first place so its not as thought I spunked the money on crap when I should have saved it - I had no idea they would do this!

AIBU to think I should have been paid UC as normal?

What's more is that I have to attend the bloody job centre, I'm a single parent and work full time, its humiliating.

OP posts:
EmeraldShamrock · 01/10/2019 10:27

I'd love to know how much it costs for the administration and accounts staff to run this massive payroll system monthly.
How much has it actually saved, with the exception of the claimants they saved money as they died due to the UC changes.

swingofthings · 01/10/2019 10:37

It would actually be cheaper to give every adult in the UK decent incomes
What would that be though? A decent income to afford a decent life is going to be different in the South than the North.

People will also different views on what constitute 'decent'. Is owning a car a necessity when you have public transport within easy walking distance? A 10yo car or something more reliable?

Same with housing, holidays etc...who gets to define what 'decent' is. Many consider to currently enjoy a decent life with UC.

DickKerrLadies · 01/10/2019 11:08

How much has it actually saved

I'm really not convinced that saving money was ever the actual aim of UC.

EmeraldShamrock · 01/10/2019 11:26

I'm really not convinced that saving money was ever the actual aim of UC
I thought every austerity change was about saving. Was it to reduce claimants or teach claimants responsibility.

vickibee · 01/10/2019 11:29

a tax refund is not income surely? UC will have already had details of your gross pay and based their calculation on that. The tax deducted is irrelevant. or maybe I am being thick, I though it was gross pay that counted

TheOriginalNutty · 01/10/2019 11:39

catcave I really hope you get this sorted. I don't know if you are on FB but there are some very helpful groups on there, with very knowledgeable people who can help you take things further. One is called Universal Credit Essentials.

The whole system is a joke and my biggest bug bear is that some of the staff that they employ, don't know what they should about the benefit they are giving advice on. I have twice had job center staff tell me I was wrong about something that would ultimately result in them owing me money, and surprise surprise, I was right and they were wrong.

I work full time but i'm on a low income because i'm doing an apprenticeship. When I started, my wages were mistakenly reported twice one month. It was as plain as the nose on my face what had happened and how, but I still had to take time off work, go to the job center and hand in bank statements, wage slips and god knows what else. It then went to a decision maker and still came back as 'we are right you are wrong'.
I then got help from one of the groups on FB and took it through a Mandatory Reconsideration, where it was eventually found that yes I was right all along.

The system is bad enough as it is. If we have to have it then at least make sure that the staff implementing it know what they are doing.

Blueoasis · 01/10/2019 11:40

@SavageFenty

How is it the people who work for dwp's fault? Or anyone at the job centre? We collectively as a country voted in the fucking tories. How people forgot what they are like is beyond me, I wasn't even born when thatcher was ruining things and I know how bad it was. The politicians did this. Aim your anger at the right people. It is their fault, not the people in the job centre.

No person makes the decisions now on uc. Its a computer system. The computer sees you getting extra money, so it stops the benefits. It sees past payments and knows when you've been overpaid, hence why it sometimes cuts payments for the first month. No person except the idiot who created uc is to blame for that.

There is talk about removing it but I think they will just make everything worse by doing another system. God knows.

safariboot · 01/10/2019 11:55

In your case OP, the problem seems to be that you were not claiming UC when the overtaxing took place and either were getting no benefit then, or no more than previous months

And this will be the situation for almost everyone who loses their job and claims UC afterwards. When in work you normally pay taxes on the assumption you'll keep that job (relevant for personal allowance, tax bands, etc.). If you leave work you'll end up with a tax refund.

Original poster
CatCave · 01/10/2019 13:23

Yes safari, but I didn't leave work. I'm working the same amount of hours ar the same job as I was when they took the extra tax.

OP posts:
Neaoll · 01/10/2019 13:49

I agree end all benefits (apart from disability benefits) just pay everyone an income and end all these silly systems.

Lifecraft · 01/10/2019 13:55

Guest2013 My sister is a case manager for UC. She's just like you, a single mum trying to give her children a good life. She's often on the receiving end of abuse and regularly called things like cunts. Please think about where you're directing your anger. It certainly shouldn't be at anyone you speak to or see regarding UC. It's not their fault.

@SavageFenty oh please give over, bet your sister and the rest of the DWP are all part of the problem.

I think the above exchange proves that many of the people who claim Universal Credit are cunts. Imagine working there, having to deal with not only the decent folk, but some of the utter scumbags who make up a proportion of the claimants.

BiBiBirdie · 01/10/2019 13:59

YANBU
What a crock of shit.

Can you speak to your MP?

MrsMaiselsMuff · 01/10/2019 14:25

It costs £700 to administer each UC claim. The government estimated that figure would be less than £200.

You're not unreasonable at all OP. It's a shit system, and whilst I don't blame the staff directly, I have little empathy when they fail to speak out about the gross failings of the system.

raspberryk · 01/10/2019 14:38

It's an absolute joke, ours is wrong almost every month, we've been underpaid, overpaid, owe money for backdated overpayment but they don't backdate underpayments.
They've managed to double our income this month by somehow saying we had 2 lots of salary from HMRC in the same month and now we have to send months of pay slips and bank statements.
When I first went on it as a single parent it took 3 months to get paid, and when it arrived it was wrong. I paid back an overpayment that didn't ever happen but I gave up fighting it.

Original poster
CatCave · 01/10/2019 18:43

I think the above exchange proves that many of the people who claim Universal Credit are cunts. Imagine working there, having to deal with not only the decent folk, but some of the utter scumbags who make up a proportion of the claimants.*

Well yes, but I'm not one of them, nor am I personally blaming/ taking my anger out on the people I have spoken to.

OP posts:
LakieLady · 01/10/2019 19:10

My assessment period is 27th-26th. I'm starting a new job where my pay days are the last working Friday of the month. 4 months next year will mean I am paid twice in that assessment period which means my UC gets reduced by over £500 each time and only increased by £200 in the month I apparently earn nothing.

HMRC have issued guidance to employers that avoids this if the employers follow it. They have been told they should show the payment date as (using your case as an example) the last calendar day of the month, even though the money is actually paid on the last working day.

From memory, I think it's para 1.8 of HMRC PAYE and NI guidance. You could check this out and ask your payroll department to follow the guidance.

However, I understand that some payroll systems make that difficult, including the one used where I work. Finance have said it can't be changed, meaning lots of staff are losing out because their system's inflexible.

Ironic, when a benefit adviser gives advice to a colleague, only to find that their employer can't follow the recommended procedure.

LakieLady · 01/10/2019 19:11

Please think about where you're directing your anger. It certainly shouldn't be at anyone you speak to or see regarding UC. It's not their fault.

I agree with this. The cunts are the government and those that voted for the cunts.

HelenaDove · 01/10/2019 19:30

The 16 hour thing....................the problem with that was that when extra hours ON TOP of those 16 were offered......the extra hours were INTERMITTENT and INCONSISTENT not guaranteed Friend of mine fell foul of this and it took over TWO MONTHS for the system to adjust.

PencilsInSpace · 01/10/2019 20:10

meaning lots of staff are losing out because their system's inflexible.

No they're losing out because UC is inflexible.

namina · 01/10/2019 20:18

YANBU they make life so difficult. It drives me insane

PigletJohn · 01/10/2019 20:27

"HMRC have issued guidance to employers that avoids this if the employers follow it. They have been told they should show the payment date as (using your case as an example) the last calendar day of the month, even though the money is actually paid on the last working day."

And you describe empoyers as inflexible because they can't issue false documents?

Wow.

LakieLady · 01/10/2019 20:41

*And you describe empoyers as inflexible because they can't issue false documents?

Wow.*

No, because they can't comply with the government's own guidance on how to do it!

cinderellainyellakissedafella · 01/10/2019 20:45

It is income. I have just started to get carers allowance for my partner and that will be taken off as well. It's ridiculous.

Babyroobs · 01/10/2019 20:47

Cinderella - Yes carers allowance is taken off because it's income you are paid separately. You should get a £160 carers element paid in your Uc too though ?

cinderellainyellakissedafella · 01/10/2019 20:47

@guest2013 people like your sister are what has caused the problem. The people in the job centre and on the phone are generally very nice, it's the other bastards who cause the misery.

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