wtf is raising these men

[Drabarni]

Aibu in wondering wtf are raising such shit men.
Thread after thread of complaints about how they don't do enough, can't do this or that, lazy, don't do their share.

I'm not saying that it's a woman's job, my dh wasn't brought up by his mum and I'm beginning to realise I got such a good one. Not boasting, he has his moments, but uselessness and laziness just doesn't figure.

There are men that do no parenting at all, even when at home.
The 80's/90's was a time when men were told to step up and be involved at all levels, and many did.
We seem to be going backwards.

@Drabarni I think there is definitely an element of that, lots of us kick back against things we disagree with in regard to our parents, there's unrelated things I've always sworn I won't repeat. It's not an unbreakable cycle. But I think it is pretty ingrained for many and often not reflected on because mothers keep it hidden from their children how difficult their lives are. It's not always visible to children how unhealthy crap dads and over compensating mothers are, until it's too late.

It’s something to do with women being conditioned to be nice to men. Obviously this was all men’s idea. However, in order to score points, other women may make a show of sticking to these rules and sneer at those who don’t.

I'm one of five. In my 60.'s and the middle one in age. All the rest are male. My DM was insistent that we all learned to cook, clean, and know how to look after ourselves. When they married the eldest too now 63 and 65, certainly did thier fair share. I remember staying with them both when thier DDs were babies and the eldest especially walking the floors with a teething baby for hours. Both married nurses who went back to work part time. Both DB's RAF 3rd DB is gay. Been with the same partner for 30 years. Both worked full time DB away a lot. Both responsible for housework. No children. Youngest DB hardly lifted a bloodt finger and his my DSIL didn't throw him out I don't know. I would have done.
So all brought up the same just one was a lazy bugger.
My own DS wouldn't dare expect his DW to do everything. She wouldn't stand for it and neither would his mother although when DDIL had to go away for three weeks when DGG was 18 months all her friends couldn't believe that she was leaving him to cope. Nobody thought anything if him being away working for three weeks at a go. One actually asked me if I was coming to stay because she would never trust her husband with the baby on his own !

I agree it's parents. Let's say it as it is. How many times have any of us done something and the brain went "Oh my. I am turning into my mother/father".
Lots of behaviour is learned from the immediate surroundings.

It’s something to do with women being conditioned to be nice to men.

Who is doing the conditioning though? I was never taught to be nice to men, just because they are men. Nor being nice to women just because they are women.
I was taught being polite to everyone and nice to the nice people.

Ha this made me lol. I think mumsnet is just concentrated moans about men. They’re not that bad! I hate that my DH considers it okay to watch tv whilst leaving DD playing on her own on her mat but then again he does encourage me to go out and is happy to do bedtime on his own when needed.

It’s not fun to gush about the good stuff though!

I don't think you can blame the parents. Most people quite easily manage a lot of things their parents never did or strongly disapprove of. For example, many people spend many hours playing video games or on their phone, when their parents have never touched a video game and can hardly use a phone. Or eat take out daily although they grew up eating home cooked food.

So they can break the mold when it comes to fun stuff. But when it comes to house work - "oh well can't do it, not my fault, I'm a slave to my upbringing I guess".

I grew up in a traditional home in the 70's where chores were divided into 'men's' and women's' work' even though my parents (during my school years) worked full-time outside of the home. This meant that the lion's share of housework was assigned to my mother and sister, even though there were 3 capable males within the home. As a teenager, i bristled at the injustice of it all. My husband and his sister, on the other hand, was raised by a single mother in the 60's Having a penis did not exempt him from cleaning, cooking, washing and so forth. Our children have been raised with the understanding that we are a team, and everyone needs to contribute to the smooth running of the home. I remember my daughter telling me when she was toddler that Grandpa "must be stupid" because he can't clean or cook. She thought it was "unfair" that Grandma "has to do everything". My sisters partnered with lazy, selfish men. They moan about them all the time, but don't challenge the status quo because all their friends' partners are equally useless. One of my brothers partnered with my my lovely SIL. It was him, due to their working patterns, that did the majority of school runs, homework, cleaning and meal planning and cooking, even though he didn't lift a finger at home when we were growing up. I feel all parents should be good role models, and not perpetuate unfair stereotypes, or enable lazy, selfish attitudes, regardless of their sex or gender.

I had an ex who was lazy and selfish and I put this back to the relationship he had with his mother - she did everything for him and they had a weird emotional incest type relationship.

He would leave his dirty plates in the lounge room. He had ants all over his bedroom (this is when we lived together).

He left me, had two children with his next girlfriend and then left her. He’s now dating someone who looks like his mother.

Yes, I blame his mother.

But his father also took off, lived in another state and both parents told the children that he was just working away (they were actually separated).