Abolishing private schools - how would it work in practice?

[Dongdingdong]

Labour has voted to abolish private schools:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-public-private-school-abolish-eton-vote-conference-corbyn-education-policy-a9115766.html

Whether you agree with this or not, I don’t understand how the logistics would work. Would private schools suddenly cease to exist from say, summer 2023, with all pupils forced to find a place at the local state school for the autumn term onwards? What would happen to the buildings and facilities - would they remain as state schools or be sold off to developers for example?

Thank God for the children who are privately educated!! gid has noth8ng to do with it dearie. Give us a break, what a pathetic thing tiomsay. Abolish the sector. Expand the state sector and fund it oroperly through taxes, so that 100 percent kf students, not 6 lercent, get a great education for all of our futures. Get rid of this skewed system, and quickly.

I don’t understand how you can seize private assets in this way? Just like that? It would take years to go through the legalities surely. These headline grabbers cause so much hate and division. Why can’t they just say that they want the two sectors to work better together, and come up with some realistic goals?!

@DobbyTheHouseElk I know you say he's unelectable but they may get a power share

Be interesting to see the plans for how the pupils would be absorbed into schools, where the places would magic from. Many teachers who teach private wouldn't have much interest in teaching state, even with the promise of it being better.

Didn’t JC go to private school
Himself?

I think it is wrong if it’s a compulsory purchase. The house isn’t owned by the government but a private individual. I think it’s theft. I can’t come to your house and tell you I’m buying it for under market value and you can’t refuse.

Between my self and siblings our kids attend, private, state, religious and sen units. Different schools suit different kids. I don't think you can just eliment one type like that it has big implecations for the whole education system.

Thank God for the children who are privately educated!! gid has noth8ng to do with it dearie. Give us a break, what a pathetic thing tiomsay. Abolish the sector. Expand the state sector and fund it oroperly through taxes, so that 100 percent kf students, not 6 lercent, get a great education for all of our futures. Get rid of this skewed system, and quickly.

A good education for all is clearly a good thing, but why is the private sector an obstacle in achieving that? Why is abolishing private education for 6% of the student the way to achieve better education for the 94%?

How is the private sector preventing the financing the state one?

Have these policy writers actually spent time in an average private school? There is this fantasy idea that it's all super rich kids, but many of them have a big chunk of pupils with parents who are breaking their necks to pay the fees.

You put the prices up by 25% and the super rich won't notice. You'll just end up with the 'no longer rich enough' stretching the state schools resources just that little bit more and spending on that money on private tutors instead.

So who benefits?

I keep asking that on this thread, but it seem no one who supports this policy has an answer.

It's just so massively THICK and badly thought through. How have we got to this point?!

I benefited from Labour's last attempt at social engineering through education. The Direct Grant scheme in the 1970s provided fully funded places at independent schools for the highest achieving at 11+ in state schools. My sister and I both had 100% funded places at an old and highly regarded independent school. I'm not sure it achieved much overall but I'm grateful for having had the opportunity, despite the journey to and from school being horrific because of not living close. It also potentially took the top 4-5 academically per participating borough out of the local state system

I’m sure if Labour said ‘let’s fuck over the private sector by making the state sector AMAZING’ then everyone would be happy.

Fergus- why is it outrageous?? I say that as someone who privately educates my children. I don’t see why it would be a bad idea?

MissMarks you educate your children privately but want these schools abolished?
You sound like a complete hypocrite.

chardonnay coz if we take priv8 schools away no1 will notice that state is underfunded coz natch the unwashed masses are too thick to be aware of the real problems with education. Get em to blame the rich.

I see your point.

If there's nothing better, then the bad thing is the good thing.

I honestly don't think this will get off the ground, yes private schools will have their charitable status removed, have to pay VAT on fees & corporation tax on their profits. The revenues from this will probably pay towards abolishing tuition fees for universities. Ofsted being abolished will return powers to HMI & the local authorities, can't be a bad thing, the old inspections used to share good practice with other schools, hopefully the academies will be put back under LA control bringing about savings of all the executives on the boards of the schools. Labour are busy at this conference writing their new manifesto for the next GE whenever that will be, they are all waiting for BJ to trip up in to the black hole he is creating.

Shami Chakrabati and Diane Abbott must be sweating on this proposal, given they are senior members of the shadow cabinet and choose to educate their children privately. To be honest, I'm not sure how much Jeremy Corbyn, the product of a Grammar school education and who also chose to educate his son selectively, can be considered the greatest advocate of a fully comprehensive education. Naturally Labour here but despising the Animal Farm-ish hypocrisy of the Labour leader and his acolytes.

Smacks of Big Brother. Would it be actually be legal to take over these assets?

What about the income generated from foreign pupils? According to ISC Census 2019 "Non-British pupils also contribute disproportionately to the UK economy, contributing £1.8bn to GDP, supporting 39,310 jobs and generating half a billion pounds in tax revenue".

Our 2 ds went/go to private secondary schools because the local catchment school is crap. We tried to get them in to the next nearest secondary (the largest state secondary in Hampshire) but failed. Eldest went for two terms and it was hopeless, he just got swallowed up, struggled and it was failing him. Difficult to communicate with teachers/dept heads/anyone. He has dyspraxia and is currently being diagnosed for adhd. Youngest is bright but needs to be pushed/stretched. They both had a big say on the school they went to. So, under these proposals, our choice would be taken away and our kids let down.

Not everyone has this choice obvs, but then tackle the failing system not the one that is working and admired worldwide.

I hate this preachy hypocritical attitude. As other posters have said, many Labour mps use private education. As soon they are offered a title, not many turn it down.

We are no way the 'millionaires' mentioned in the article. Labour haven't got a clue. We have to be careful financially, drive a clapped out old car and don't go on holidays abroad, etc... But it is our choice and we think it is worth it. Should Labour decide what everyone does with their disposable income? Let's all walk/bicycle round in sack cloth uniforms with our little red books.

I would never vote for these hardliners.

Doubt it moomin I’m fairly certain their dc are a similar age to mine, mid to late teens. So you just know any plans will allow ample time for their dc to finish school first. And as they’ve previously demonstrated they are quite brazen about their hypocrisy. Possibly some gradual plan where they’re closed in stages and by huge coincidence Labour mps dc will attend schools marked for the last stage.

Still, would be quite amusing to find out how school/ parent communication would go for them . ‘Ahh, Mrs Abbot, it isn’t that mini Abbot hasn’t been accepted into the sixth form on his gcse results. You fucking closed it’

Finland? There it is simply illegal to charge fees for schooling. Seems to work quite well, too. Finnish schoolchildren are usually near the top on international comparisons.

Can we learn from Finland? I would vote for that.

Some interesting stats from the WorldBank including the often cited Finland where this shows 15% of secondary students are in private education. 25% in France. 9% in Germany and 5% in Netherlands. Puts 7% figure for uk in perspective (accepting that some of figures are from a couple of years ago).
data.worldbank.org/indicator/SE.SEC.PRIV.ZS

Finland probably has a totally different culture to the UK. Doesn't start school until much later.

Maybe that is where the UK could make savings in the education budget chop a couple of years out the system start school later. And probably only start preschool at 5.

Oh shit NO! What about the free childcare and what about getting women working and contributing to the economy. Can't change the school start age. Sod the fact that 4yos need time to mature and other places with older starting age do better.

Sorry for the rant. But it bugs me when people want to cherry pick from other school systems without looking at the whole picture.

Hmm 🤔 a deeper look at that WorldBank data is a little more confusing, not sure now what it’s showing ...

It will lead to a massive “brain drain” as the highly skilled professional workers will simply move to another country that allows them to educate their children as they see fit...but that’s fine isn’t it as we’ve got plenty of doctors!