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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To just be appalled a pregnant woman has been jailed over this ?

153 replies

Sootyandsweep2019 · 18/09/2019 20:38

Yes, ammend the certificate to be factually accurate. But I am genuinely scared and appalled the CPS felt this was in the public interest to prosecute here. I mean, are they going to knock on the door of all Jeremy Kyle guests in a similar situation ? And there are many other cases where I'm just aghast a prosecution was thought to be in the public interest.

There are also women, who will protect a child by having someone else register as the father to keep a domestic abuser out if a child's life, I think we have a real, real authoratitive problem in this country as I could not trust any authorities that thought this was okay ( Daily mail story about mother jailed for naming the wrong man on birth certificate , trying to link but struggling on phone)

OP posts:
Tennesseewhiskey · 18/09/2019 21:10

Sorry not the made up case that's in the public interest. This woman's case is un the public interest.

P1nkHeartLovesCake · 18/09/2019 21:10

It’s a legal document, it’s a crime to give false information. The registration office had signs up telling you this ffs!

Why does being pregnant mean she shouldn’t be prosecuted?

Yabu, it’s a crime having a vagina doesn’t mean you don’t get prosecuted...

RosesAndRaindrops · 18/09/2019 21:11

Daily mail story about mother jailed for naming the wrong man on birth certificate , trying to link but struggling on phone)

Not read the story what you're referring to and as there's no link I'm just going by what you've said.
That'd be fraud, surely? You can't just go putting anybody's name on a birth certificate as the father if they're not.

rwalker · 18/09/2019 21:12

There will be MASSIVE chunks of this story we don't know, any newspaper edits and sensationalise stories . I really wouldn't be quick to judge .
Being pregnant and a mother shouldn't be a free pass to do what you want and get away with it .

AuntieStella · 18/09/2019 21:13

Your train example has an important topic difference- the parents are married.

All DC of married women are assumed in law to be children of the marriage, unless the husband repudiates. So if he chooses to acknowledge the DC, irrespective of biological paternity, that is legal (remember the roots of the system are the orderly transfer of property).

NotACleverName · 18/09/2019 21:13

I am really surprised that mumsnet, which is meant to be feminist, approves this.

Yeah, no. That's not how feminism works.

TheSecretJeven · 18/09/2019 21:23

She obviously didn't think it through or possible long term consequences. Supposing the relationship with Boyfriend breaks down in acrimony and she has to open a maintenance claim. Boyfriend simply denies paternity, refuses to pay, and refers her back to Father. As did happen, the DNA test would bear this out. She's also potentially cut her child from inheriting any estates from their true family on their father's side. Feminism isn't about extinguishing someone else's legal rights.

ExhaustedGrinch · 18/09/2019 21:23

You can just pick and choose who you put on the BC depending on who you happen to be sleeping with the moment the child is born. Do you not think that the CHILD should be aware of who their biological father is and have their own personal documentation reflecting this? I'm glad she was jailed and I hope it stops other people considering doing the same.

ExhaustedGrinch · 18/09/2019 21:24

*can't

cdtaylornats · 18/09/2019 21:25

They committed several crimes - the main one is attempting to block the parental rights of the father.

GoneToTheDock · 18/09/2019 21:32

@Fullyhuman

How is it the mother’s crime? You have to be married to the dad to put them down without them being there; if not married he has to go with you. So it’s him that commits the crime, isn’t it?

What??? The woman went and registered the birth and put another man down- he was also there, he was also jailed

Bouffalant · 18/09/2019 21:33

This has nothing to do with feminism.

VondaVomin · 18/09/2019 21:44

I think it is right she was prosecuted for fraud, but a jail sentence was inappropriately harsh for a first offence and excessive compared to sentences I have seen for other crimes.

For example a friend of mine was the victim of a stabbing in the street by another woman. The attack was completely unprovoked and that was not disputed. It was never really explained why the attack took place.

My friend was stabbed in the throat and could easily have died. Her attacker, who had no previous convictions for violence, was bound over to keep the peace, so not even a criminal conviction.

Now explain why putting the wrong name on a birth certificate is worse than that.

Drabarni · 18/09/2019 21:45

Not a BC but other official records with me.
All those questioning the punishment as harsh need to know what it's like to not know your father and then be told your mother said any old name will do. The name chosen was of a boy they bullied in school.
I'd much rather have just been told unknown than a pack of bloody lies.
An awful thing for her to have done, the punishment is fair.

Northernlurker · 18/09/2019 21:48

Sentences aren't determined by what's worse. Each crime has a range of sentences and the judge has to justify what's handed down. I think this is a fair sentence for a premeditated fraud with potentially devastating consequences.

Tilltheendoftheline · 18/09/2019 21:51

I think it is right she was prosecuted for fraud, but a jail sentence was inappropriately harsh for a first offence and excessive compared to sentences I have seen for other crimes.

Was it a first offence?

I agree with pp, people who think this is no big deal have no idea the damage this sort of thing does.

And also, if she believes she has the right to do what she wants with her child and their own legal documents, out of spite (no other reason. Just spite) , do you believe she normally puts the kids first?

You believe she was probably great in all other respects? Or is it more likely she believed she owned the child and could use the child in anyway she deemed fit?

Peony99 · 18/09/2019 21:52

I am really surprised that mumsnet, which is meant to be feminist, approves this.

My definition of feminist doesn't involve letting people get away with stuff just because they are women.

Figgygal · 18/09/2019 21:57

She knowingly and deliberately registered the child falsely she's a criminal and the law has rightly judged and sentenced her

I certainly don't feel sorry for her feel sorry for her kids having such a mother

AnneLovesGilbert · 18/09/2019 21:57

My definition of feminist doesn't involve letting people get away with stuff just because they are women.

Mine neither. OP, you’re not doing the cause much good if you want women excused their crimes because they’re women Hmm

She’s a parent. She has responsibilities to her child and honesty about their parentage is one of those.

You also can’t make being pregnant a literal get out of jail card. That’s patronising women, not supporting them.

StrangersToLove · 18/09/2019 22:02

It's an odd one because if you're married your partner CAN be registered as the father, even if they aren't.

For instance - a married lesbian couple, the female partner can be named as the 2nd parent even though they're not biologically related to the child.

But if you're not married then this isn't allowed, and you can go to jail for it.

Thymejuice · 18/09/2019 22:08

I clicked the link. Why did she get eight months and the boyfriend six? They committed the crime together.

IsobelRae23 · 18/09/2019 22:20

Yes it is a good use of taxpayers money!

Because it tells people this is breaking the law, or else it would sets a precedent that this is okay, and loads of people would do it. This deters people from doing it.

willstarttomorrow · 18/09/2019 22:23

As someone who works within the Family Courts (with justified restrictions on reporting) and also frequent offenders I suspect there is a lot more to this. I am a bit of a lefty liberal but admit to being amazed how difficult it is for lots of people to actually end up with a custodial sentence. Some of the incredibly violent men I work with seem to be like Teflon. I do not believe in custody for punishments sake for 'minor stuff' , and neither do the courts in straight forward cases when a community sentence could be more productive. I think it is very unlikely there is not more to this, however for the child's right to confidentiality it has not been reported.

HennyPennyHorror · 18/09/2019 22:23

This is not a feminist issue! It's fraud!

ivykaty44 · 18/09/2019 22:35

If you lie on civil registration documents then it’s fraud which carries heavy penalties

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