Parenting is futile

[topsagain]

No matter what you do as a parent, other factors influence your childs life. Obviuously being a loving and supportive parent matters but that there is so much out of your control that determines your chids life. Genetics, circumstance, personality, etc etc.
Parenting is just swimming against the tide.

People who think parenting has futile, should never have children.

As for it being futile, why on earth would anyone actually believe that.

Just because your parents were abusive and cruel it doesn’t mean that you’ll perpetuate that behaviour as an adult which some people seem to be suggesting, that if you come from terrible parenting that there is no hope for you. My dad and step mum were emotionally and physically abusive to me and my brother. It went on until we left home as soon as we were able. We both having loving, long and successful marriages and we both have daughters that we have never slapped, hit or been cruel to. It give me great satisfaction to have not repeated that cycle.

I think it’s true that character and personality are very much genetic. And often where parenting is lacking it can because those parents have conditions themselves that haven’t allowed them to parent well (such as MH issues, ASD, ADHD, all sorts of things). Very balanced parents often have balanced children; that’s not all down to parenting; it’s down to genetics as well!

dayswithaY
Thanks for your input. So many parents are targeted for bad parenting. But the real outcome of bad parenting is evident. As in these cases.
Bad parenting is not letting your child on the tablet for a few hours, as is so vilified nowadays.

Lots of people here are knowingly or unknowingly referring to the concept of attachment and yes there is definitely lots of great evidence that having a secure attachment to a caregiver early in life is pretty crucial to outcomes. But attachment - how attachments are formed - is actually complicated as well. It's formed between two individuals with their unique genetic and other traits, in a given context. There is even some evidence that the most problematic type of attachment, disorganised attachment, which is associated with abuse and neglect, has genetic influences.

I think evolutionary psychologists have posited as well that at a population level, you don't necessarily want everyone to have a secure attachment. The other types of people have their own assets, like vigilance to threats, that are useful at a population level.

Tigger001
people who think parenting has futile, should never have children.

As for it being futile, why on earth would anyone actually believe that
Good parents who keep trying,and get fe dup and frustrated.

Good parents, who care, who judge themsleves,who want to be better

I think you have a point, OP.

I had a traumatic upbringing but I'm okay. Independent, married, financially very comfortable and really happy with my life. I feel very lucky.

If I had had a better upbringing, I would have likely had more confidence and less anxiety, but essentially I'm still 'me'.

I often debate the nature/nurture argument in my head as ds 6 is very challenging and I blame myself. However dd 4 is a delight so although I am not a perfect parent and certainly have made mistakes I think circumstances and influences outside parents 100% have an influence

It's pretty basic genetics that your phenotype (i.e. the way you are) is a combination of your genotype (genetics) + environmental factors.

Over the years at all three of my children's schools, I'd say 90% of the badly behaved children have shit parents, either through apathy, misguided parenting methods, drug/alcohol or relationship issues or other socioeconomic reasons.

underneaththeash
I have seen the another side.Good parenting, and disruptive , chaotic children.

I have two children.
One is studious, conformist and eager to please.
The other is argumentative, resistant and obtusive.

My son, now in his twenties, recently said "I've got too many ethics, mum, and it's all your fault."

Nature v nurture? Nah. It's just Olympic calibre parenting...

I have one on a child plan, another who is praised for their co-operation, inclusion, wiliness to help.

On my personal experience.parenting exactly the same is what promted me to post that parenting is futile.

Apologies for drip feeding

tops I assume all the children of these wonderful parents as older bad ‘uns freely acknowledge that do they? Because I can assure you everything I did as a child or teen that would be viewed as bad was directly related to the ‘good parenting’ that was very different to the bullshit act put on for others

The flip side definitely exists, plenty of children with mediocre or shit parents manage to break the cycle.

X-post op, thought it was general musing on bad parenting so not a dig at you

Studies show that parents are more akin to shepherds than inventors. Sorry, I can't remember the source now but that's essentially what the science shows. You don't have a blank slate. You won't get to impart your morals exactly. Children will have the temperament they have.

Yes of course REALLY bad parenting causes damage but I don't think that's what you're really talking about OP, is it? It's more the difference between say a parent encouraging sportiness vs academics, tidiness vs messiness, a social conscience or looking out for number one - the reality is that a child will turn out how they are going to turn out and short of actual trauma they aren't going to significantly change from that path. You can essentially nudge them in one direction or other though, which for some children will make a massive difference, although for others might be something like which sport they take up but they would have been active in any family. And of course your children (hopefully) grow up into adults which it would be nice to get along with so it is of course beneficial to try and parent well for the reason of developing a good relationship as well.

Different things matter more at different ages I think.
Baby/toddler - home (learning) environment has a huge impact
Older DC - how good the school is, peers etc

@topsagain parenting isn’t detrimental in all cases though is it?

I think my parents did a fab job they creates boundaries but allowed controlled freedom, they rewarded good behaviour and made clear the poor behaviour was a disappointment... I think I got smacked once ( it only hurt my pride ) because they never lost their cool with me but still managed to get their point across.

I am sure they were not perfect but they were not detrimental that was not my point

I was reacting to your what’s the point of parenting when outside influences will mess your kid up anyhow ... actually I did some bad stuff but the worry of disappointing my parents made me pull back from those bad behaviours as a young adult that I may have otherwise continued.

Absolutely we get it wrong too ... but to be the best parents I guess united front, listen to your child , don’t act in anger , be fair and consistent , you will raise your child to your own moral compass so to some you will be too strict or not strict enough it all depends on the individual but it takes all sorts to make a world we don’t live in a world of clones so there is always going to be differences of opinion.

There are on the other hand parents that abuse their children / starve them / beat them ... the question is how as a society should we protect or how can we protect these children

On my personal experience.parenting exactly the same is what promted me to post that parenting is futile.

Perhaps that's your problem op. You don't parent two children the same. Each child is an individual and should be treated as so. Of course your morals/ ethics will filter to them but how you speak to them, manage behaviour/ discipline/ reward etc may need to be adjusted according to what is most likely to be effective for that individual.

Many days I'm tired and just feel like giving up and let my kids what ever they like cos I'm thinking maybe I'm nagging too much or what I do just don't matter... But this argument right here says a lot, yes our kids will be influenced by many factors but my input will be good, I will fight tooth and nail to guarantee that.

I have two children.
One is studious, conformist and eager to please.
The other is argumentative, resistant and obtusive.

Ironically, the argumentative, obtusive one is very likely the more intelligent of the two. If you are a good, conscientious parent and keep an open mind I bet they will both turn out fine. Different maybe but fine. Keep an open mind, set firm boundaries but expect them to be tested. Be a coach not a dictator. You're having a bit of a wobble by the dound of it but that's because you care. You will get there precisely because you do care.

On a more light hearted note it can be really surprising how differently to us our children can be
My daughter is messy, mathematical, not girlie, very tough, not emotional
Whereas I am OCD tidy, adore reading, uber girlie, quite sensitive and very emotional
I always tease her about being a changeling 😆

TooTrueToBeGood Thanks, I am having a wobble.
Everything is a battle, getting dressed, sitting up for meals, going to get washed, going to bed. I think I am trapped in an endless power struggle.
Not sure how to get out it and get some co-operation.