AIBU to say that summer hols are a driver of inequality

[Teaandcrisps]

Myself and OH have had mixed personal fortune over the last 10 years - so from personal experience know the difference.

Summer holidays with no money is shit - especially when the weather is crap. If you can afford it however, it's great fun.

It's not just the obvious things - summer hols, trips, activities, camps, increase in food costs; it's also if you have the kind of job that can give you time off.

Given that food bank have launched the holiday hunger campaign, AIBU to say that summer holidays is an unequal construct and the 6-weeks off needs to go.

To answer the inequality question... I do think it’s tough for kids from low-income families. Hearing about other children’s holidays / trips to Lego land etc. Spreading the holidays more evenly could take some of the pressure off the peak holiday season and allow more families the chance to go away. Teachers could also benefit from this.

I think the only thing that would happen to holiday prices is that they'd be more expensive at various points of the years.

There is not a cat in hells chance that holiday companies/train companies/airlines/etc wouldn't simply take advantage of more periods of expensive holidays.

In some ways it would probably be worse - especially in whatever summer break there was. More people would be trying to go away in nice weather in a shorter window, therefore companies would charge more and in turn people will less money would have even less chance to go than they do now.

Nobody likes the thought of anyone struggling but the hostility towards teachers, blaming them for having to pay for childcare is demoralising

@shithappens123 Very few people on the thread have actually agreed with the OP, if she wanted it to turned into a teacher bashing thread it has failed miserably

I think the massive elephant in the room is the fact that wages in this country just aren't high enough nor do they reflect the cost of living.

lyralalala There has been some hostile posts though and tbh I shouldn’t have commented as I knew it would wind me up.

@shithappens123 There has been, but there always is on any thread. A couple of them have been quite obviously goady as well. The vast majority of people have (quite robustly in some cases!) pointed out that teachers are not childcare.

If anything the thread has been pretty supportive of schools and teachers.

This is a society and childcare issue, not an education issue (even though the OP has quite deliberately ignored all posts about that).

Yeah I think the OP is a goady...

@shithappens123 I work in a school myself.

So yes I think summer holidays should be reduced not re-rigged.

And more than ever the time is now - the numbers of children experiencing poverty has gone up and it is a shocking time where food bank have launched holiday hunger.

Yes I agree that this move can't act in isolation and won't solve everything - yet it will do something, and this move would help our most disadvantaged children.

The long 6-week holiday is not a necessity. It is a tradition and it no longer works.

I'm completely bemused that teachers would leave in droves if they didn't get 6-weeks unpaid holiday - really? this proposal is simply reducing thier unpaid holiday by 3 weeks!?*

For all those saying where is the money coming from for these extra 3 weeks - well where does anyone think the money is coming from for food banks that all thru summer have been feeding millions of children? Its coming from the few Local Authorities that have been able to afford it.

And guess what, it's coming from us - the parents who every year pay for holiday schemes, clubs etc.

Great for those that can afford it or have flexible jobs that allow them time off or who have 1 person that can afford to stay home. Brilliant.

This is not the case for everyone.

The priority is children who are barely eating, whose parents are struggling during this time because of the extra pressure, whose summer is miserable - this will lead to MH issues, not reducing holidays. Plus, budgeting for children over 3 weeks rather than 6 is much more manageable.

And for those that say that it would be too much for the kids - this is easily solved through curriculum management. Quite frankly the last 2 weeks of summer term hardly have any structured learning anyway.

I think they are, but I also absolutely love them and wouldn't trade them for the world. It would be a very sad day when parents abdicate their child's childhood to the state.
I think we are living through unprecedented wealth inequality in this country. We have one of the largest gaps in the developed world. Reducing the gap between the richest and poorest has so, so, so many benefits and this would just be one.

OP you are full of it. Yes teachers would leave (tbh it wouldn’t take much to leave) it’s a gamble that really would leave schools in a mess.

You know nothing about education

just to add to what i said up thread i do get the childcare issue because altho i am a sahm i stay at home and look after my best friends dd for free along with my own 3 and she deffinatly doesnt have a lot of money left after rent and other bills. i will feel guilty about this when i do return to work myself as i know it will be difficult for her to cover the hours she works and will likely have to find a different job because no childminder is going to work until gone 10pm

Well they're over now so you can chill until next summer.

You keep talking about poor and deprived kids.. it all sounds noble and possibly even reasonable (the intent not the means), however there's something not quite sincere in the tone of your posts. There is definitely something that bothers you about the school holidays, but I doubt it's the kids.

StockTakeFucks - I agree

It's a false dilemma isn't it - shorten holidays or leave the poor to suffer.

I'm completely bemused that teachers would leave in droves if they didn't get 6-weeks unpaid holiday - really? this proposal is simply reducing thier unpaid holiday by 3 weeks!?

Teachers are already leaving in droves. Slashing their holidays by a quarter would see any industry lose a vast number of staff, why do you think teaching would be any different?

For all those saying where is the money coming from for these extra 3 weeks - well where does anyone think the money is coming from for food banks that all thru summer have been feeding millions of children? Its coming from the few Local Authorities that have been able to afford it.

Where do you live that LA's are funding food banks? Where I am all food banks are charity funded. As is the school lunch club that has been run by the LA (but not funded by them).

So again, where is the funding for teachers, TA's, support staff and janitorial staff coming from?

this is easily solved through curriculum management.

So turn school into basic childcare for three weeks then?

@StockTakeFucks yes, I know. But people who want a sunny holiday (here or in Europe) generally go in the six week summer holiday for the weather. Thus driving up demand. A longer spring half term or something would allow people more flexibility to go then and might make it slightly more affordable. It’s not going to solve the problem but might help somewhat.

No hostility towards teacher from me btw. Loads of knackered teachers in my family.

Maybe the op wants a state boarding school for poor kids and the rich kids can have all the holidays.

What counts as poor? Free school meals in ks2? Food bank? Not able to afford two week in Cuba in August? Not able to afford any holiday in the uk in August? Poor spending choices rather than lack of money?

@lyralalala you’re probably right. I’d prefer the option of going in May or September (not peak weather so possibly cheaper) and having more flexibility around those times in terms of duration etc. Easter and October holidays are too much of a weather risk.

I maybe am in the minority as probably only have a few more years of the six weeks holidays. Its been a struggle at times and we have had it easy compared to some as have had help from family over the years and I worked part time.
I thought the origins of the 6 weeks were to help farmers etc and I know in the continent they have the break to avoid the hottest part of the year. I remember the joy of breaking up as a kid and getting away from school and everyone, and trying to fit in timetables to suit every age group would be a nightmare. So probably don't know what the real solution is except from a nostalgic view they do come to an end... Eventually!

I’m sorry but I’m sick of the constant teach bashing on MN

Your agenda is utterly batshit. This isn’t a teacher bashing thread, nobody has said a teacher or indeed schools are at fault.

Some of us manage to have empathy of people who find life hard. Try it.

YABU. Children in other countries get much more time off and the parents still manage to get on with things. School is for education, it's not a day care centre. Staff need breaks too.

My kids prefer more time off in summer, their cousins live abroad and have much longer summer holidays. Although it's cheaper to visit them in October, there's bugger all to do there when the weather is closing in and the kids there don't have holidays in October so the kids don't get time off together. We didn't visit them this summer as we couldn't afford the flights this time sadly but there is more they can do when it's warmer.
I work in a hospital and the shorter the summer holidays are, the harder it is to spread time off fairly so all parents can spend time with their kids in the summer holidays. Happy to keep them longer for now.

I have friends who are teachers who all say that the summer holidays is the one holiday where they truly get time off. The pressure teachers are under is immense and shouldn't be underestimated. I believe the long holidays helps them decompress.

The same for the kids. It's all very well (and doesn't relate to my own experience) to say the last few weeks of term have little learning but by the end of term they are knackered.

Poverty is an issue, but shortening school holidays isn't the answer in my view. Children deserve a childhood, not even longer in school.